Audio, hi-fi and car audio - Linn and Ariston

On Sat, 05 Jun 2004 09:27:36 +0100, Jim Lesurf
wrote:

In article , AudioEnz
wrote:
in article , Oddjob at
wrote on 05/06/2004 4:11 AM:

Hello all, I've just bought an RD80 and was told that it was the model
the LP12 was based upon. They were built in the same factory in
Scotland (nr the airport)

According to Hi-Fi World magazine, Hamish Robertson of Ariston
approached Ivor about his dad's engineering factory building the Ariston
turntable (the RD-11 - the RD80 being a later model). The article
suggests that the engineering factory didn't produce any, but that soon
after Ivor started Linn products.

There are some articles in old issues of magazines like Hi Fi News that
give some details of the history of this. It is, shall we say,
'contentious'. I suspect that Ivor would give you a different view than if
you talk to the familiy of Hamish, or to one or two other people.

You can say that again! :-)

Some people suggest that Ivor copied the Ariston for his early LP12. I
suspect that what Ivor took was the *idea* of building a turntable.

Take a look at the Thorens TD150 turntable. It fits exactly in a Linn
Sondek plinth. The 150 and the Sondek are two of the very few turntables
to have a full length armboard (the Ariston RD11 certainly didn't). Even
the supension springs are in the same places.

The idea of producing a turntable may have come from Ivor's discussions
with the head of Ariston. But I suspect that the design inspiration came
from the Thorens TD150.

I can't recall the details off-hand (I'd need to re-read the old articles).
However IIRC there were also technical points like the way the turntable
bearing is arranged.

Quite so. There's little doubt that the layout of the main parts of
the RD11/LP12 was based on either the AR turntable or the TD 150
(launched in 1965, six years before the RD11/LP12). The TD150 itself
*may* have been based on the classic AR table (or not, depending on
your view of history, since the AR XA and TD150 were launched almost
simultaneously).

The point of contention (pun intended) was the origin of the 'single
point' bearing which became the Linn logo (for anyone who wondered why
the logo looks like it does!).

But you really ought to get Stewart Pinkerton involved in this
discussion. I understand that Pinkie and Ivor exchanged several lawyer's
letters over this subject some years back. Interested in telling us
more, Stewart?

We did have a 'frank and forthright exchange of views', although Ivor
never did carry out his threatened libel action - I may have persuaded
him that truth is always a good defence in such matters! :-)

Anyone who is interested in an unbiased view of the true worth of the
Linn LP12 Sondek is advised to check out

http://www.high-endaudio.com/RC-Tables.html

which has one of the most objective and dispassionate deconstructions
of that over-rated piece of trash that I have seen. It also contains a
hilariously accurate view of 'Linnies', as seen by the bemused
bystander!

FWIW I also supplied some information from published sources to the
relatives of Hamish some time ago. Unfortunately, this is an area where -
for legal reasons - some people may know more than they would choose to say
in public. This does not mean *me*, but at least one other person that I
have in mind. As a result, much of what one picks up is on a 'hearsay'
basis which makes it hard to assess.

I had my information directly from Hamish, and I was also approached
by his daughter quite recently, following a somewhat acerbic exchange
of newgroup posts and e-mails between myself and Ivor, and threats of
legal action from him. These threats mysteriously evaporated when it
became obvious that I *would* pursue the matter if he really wished
all that dirty linen to be splattered across the press again. Suffice
it to say that, given the cheap tricks used by Ivor over several
decades to promote his 'average at best' products, and given his known
ruthlessness in business (ask any of the hundreds of ex-Linn dealers
who refused to toe the party line of sneakily biasing all demos
towards Linn), I know which side of the story *I* believe........

Intriguingly, I was approached by Hamish' daughter because she was in
fear of violent repercussions following her visits to Ivor in an
attempt to obtain redress for past wrongs. He seems to have a very
dark reputation indeed in the darker areas of Glasgow society, and
given the young lady's recollections of what had happened between Ivor
and Hamish at his several visits to Hamish' house, I have little doubt
as to Ivor's willingness to misappropriate anything he could lay his
hands on. Such is of course mere hearsay in a legal sense, but let me
ask just this simple question. Is there anyone, anywhere, who believes
that Ivor Tiefenbrun is an *honest* man?
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering