Stewart Pinkerton wrote:


But you can forget bass and treble with cheap trannies...........

But you can have bass or treble :-)

--
Nick

In article , Andy Evans
wrote:
I guess transformers from somewhere like sowter will be
100quid of that budget?

**Not even close. Your output transformers will eat up your entire
budget. And then some.

Well, yes and no. Lundahls ain't cheap, for instance. But the Maplins
£30 jobs (6.6K) are surprisingly good - a friend measured some and the
frequency response is nice,

At what power level, and with what distortion, into what loads? (And driven
from what source impedance?)

Slainte,

Jim

--
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Audio Misc http://www.st-and.demon.co.uk/AudioMisc/index.html
Armstrong Audio http://www.st-and.demon.co.uk/Audio/armstrong.html
Barbirolli Soc. http://www.st-and.demon.co.uk/JBSoc/JBSoc.html

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


Not the easiest speaker to drive (they need a bit of power) but I fancy
giving valves a try.

**Why?


Why TF not??

**See below.



Do you have a desire to buy an amp which:
* Delivers less power.
* Consumes more power.
* Begins to wear out, from the first instant it is switched on.
* Has a declining base of ready availability of spare parts.
* Delivers a poorer frequency response.
* Delivers higher levels of all types of distortion.
* Possesses a poorer phase response.
Than a similarly priced SS amp?


Jeez, where does all this come from - a book your Grandfather gave you
called 'Things That Boys Do That Make Them Go Blind'...???

**Nope. 35 years experience in:
* Listening to valve and SS amps.
* Building valve and SS amps (my first amps, tuners and preamps were all
valve types).
* Servicing valve and SS amps (I cut my teeth servicing guitar amps, at
age 16).
* Logic and reason.


Developed some preferences of your own then?



Oh ah - simply ooze 'personality' they do.

**Have you listened to a Rotel RA02? They're really very good. They
reproduce pretty much exactly what is fed into them, without altering the
signal in any meaningful fashion.


Zzzzzz....


IOW: They are REAL high fidelity amplifiers.


loads pistol, holds to own head


*BANG!!*


Like all real hi fi amps, the usual GIGO* applies. Likewise, if the signal
is superb, the little Rotel will allow that superbness to be reaily
apparent.


(I think the OP is seeking a little more 'soulfood' than just another
slice of 'ss ordinaire' - he's got a perfectly respectable little amp
already in the Cambridge Audio.... ;-)

**The Cambridge products, IME, are excellent. The small Rotel integrateds
are just a little better, IMO.


I've had 2 or 3 little Rotel integrateds in the past and one or two Rotel
power amps (nice to watch the front panel pumping along to the music)....


As are Arcams.


Oh ah, more 'personality overload'.....



*GIGO = Garbage In - Garbage Out.


Stoppit...

(I dropped my rusk when I first heard that expression.....)

... Do have proper respect for
large DC voltages with chunky amounts of current behind them, they'll
stop your heart in a heartbeat - so to speak.................

Yep. Remember thirty years ago building a Mullard 5/10 (was it?) and
picking it up with both hands and taking 250 volts (was it?) off the rail.
Aaaaarrrrkkkkkkk ... I can remember it now!
That - said my engineer friends - was the real reason they always kept
one hand in their trouser pockets ...
Cheers,

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 18:11:29 +0000, Wichita wrote:

... Do have proper respect for
large DC voltages with chunky amounts of current behind them, they'll
stop your heart in a heartbeat - so to speak.................

Yep. Remember thirty years ago building a Mullard 5/10 (was it?) and
picking it up with both hands and taking 250 volts (was it?) off the rail.
Aaaaarrrrkkkkkkk ... I can remember it now! That - said my engineer
friends - was the real reason they always kept one hand in their trouser
pockets ... Cheers,

Yep - been there, done that. I only dropped the amp a couple of feet and
bent the chassis a bit, but a couple of hundred volts of DC off the
smoother is bloody painful even after the mains is disconnected!!!! I've
learned a bit since then. :-)

--
Mick
(no M$ software on here... :-) )
Web: http://www.nascom.info

I've probably had four or five shocks. So I wouldn't build anything with a HT
over about 350-400v. I know that this can be lethal, but not as lethal as
1000v. So high voltage 845 amps "non merci" though I do have a quartet to try
in PP at around 350-400v. Interestingly, down there the curves look just like
KT66s.

=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


Not the easiest speaker to drive (they need a bit of power) but I
fancy giving valves a try.

**Why?


Why TF not??

**See below.



Do you have a desire to buy an amp which:
* Delivers less power.
* Consumes more power.
* Begins to wear out, from the first instant it is switched on.
* Has a declining base of ready availability of spare parts.
* Delivers a poorer frequency response.
* Delivers higher levels of all types of distortion.
* Possesses a poorer phase response.
Than a similarly priced SS amp?


Jeez, where does all this come from - a book your Grandfather gave you
called 'Things That Boys Do That Make Them Go Blind'...???

**Nope. 35 years experience in:
* Listening to valve and SS amps.
* Building valve and SS amps (my first amps, tuners and preamps were all
valve types).
* Servicing valve and SS amps (I cut my teeth servicing guitar amps, at
age 16).
* Logic and reason.


Developed some preferences of your own then?

**As a matter of fact, yes. Until 1978 (when I heard my first zero Global
NFB SS preamp) I MUCH preferred valve preamps. I preferred SS power amps,
much earlier than that. Then I heard an Audio Research D115. That altered my
perception towards valve power amps. I now beleive that provided the load is
suitably benign, a REALLY good valve power amp can sound almost
indisguishable from a really good SS amp. Crappy valve power amps are REALLY
easy to pick.




Oh ah - simply ooze 'personality' they do.

**Have you listened to a Rotel RA02? They're really very good. They
reproduce pretty much exactly what is fed into them, without altering the
signal in any meaningful fashion.


Zzzzzz....


IOW: They are REAL high fidelity amplifiers.


loads pistol, holds to own head


*BANG!!*


Like all real hi fi amps, the usual GIGO* applies. Likewise, if the
signal is superb, the little Rotel will allow that superbness to be
reaily apparent.


(I think the OP is seeking a little more 'soulfood' than just another
slice of 'ss ordinaire' - he's got a perfectly respectable little amp
already in the Cambridge Audio.... ;-)

**The Cambridge products, IME, are excellent. The small Rotel integrateds
are just a little better, IMO.


I've had 2 or 3 little Rotel integrateds in the past and one or two Rotel
power amps (nice to watch the front panel pumping along to the music)....


As are Arcams.


Oh ah, more 'personality overload'.....



*GIGO = Garbage In - Garbage Out.


Stoppit...

(I dropped my rusk when I first heard that expression.....)

**Good. Then you'll understand exactly what I mean.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


big snip (Jim, are you taking note?


*GIGO = Garbage In - Garbage Out.


Stoppit...

(I dropped my rusk when I first heard that expression.....)

**Good. Then you'll understand exactly what I mean.



Yes, except that I can't truly see the merits of any amp which will pump
'garbage out' no matter what the input (even digital), can you...???

;-)

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


big snip (Jim, are you taking note?


*GIGO = Garbage In - Garbage Out.


Stoppit...

(I dropped my rusk when I first heard that expression.....)

**Good. Then you'll understand exactly what I mean.



Yes, except that I can't truly see the merits of any amp which will pump
'garbage out' no matter what the input (even digital), can you...???

**Yes. I am not a musician. If a musician sees fit to make the sound
distorted in some way (ie: The guitar work in Beatles, Revolution), then who
am I to make alterations to that artistic content?

Additionally, if the input is sublimely perfect, any amp which distorts,
will ruin the goodness.

As my old dad used to say: "Two wrongs do not make a right."


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
...

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


big snip (Jim, are you taking note?


*GIGO = Garbage In - Garbage Out.


Stoppit...

(I dropped my rusk when I first heard that expression.....)

**Good. Then you'll understand exactly what I mean.



Yes, except that I can't truly see the merits of any amp which will pump
'garbage out' no matter what the input (even digital), can you...???

**Yes.

**Oops. That should be: "No. Not ever."


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au