Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

Ale wrote:

I am about to construct a couple of speaker stands to my DM601 S2 and
I don´t know if I should use spikes between the stands and the floor.
My floor is hard (without carpet).

If you're placing stands (or floorstanding speakers) on carpet then you
should use spikes. That way the stand (or cabinet) makes contact with
the floor underneath.

At my old house where I had a wooden floor I stood a concrete paving
slab on the floor and placed floorstanding speakers on top of this (with
spikes as the slabs had a decorative surface - the adjustment on the
spikes meant I could get the speakers level and stable).

At the new house I have a solid concrete floor downstairs, so I don't
need to resort to concrete blocks. Upstairs has a wooden floor, so I'm
using concrete blocks there. (Yes, it does sound better, the bass is
tighter and doesn't "wallow" around the room when the speakers are on
slabs.)

In case I should use them, should I use 3 or 4 per stand?

3 if you can get away with it, as then you won't have problems with
speakers/stands rocking if they're not level. If your speakers and
stands together are quite heavy though you may need 4 on each stand to
spread the weight.

If you're placing the stands on a wooden floor it might be worth using
cones rather than spikes, as these won't destroy your floor. Either that
or place a 1p coin under the tip of each spike to protect the floor (or
a 1/2p coin if you still have any lying around!).

What about between the speakers and the stands? I have also seen
spikes there.

Never bothered with this. I tend to use rubber stick-on feet placed on
the top plate of the stand. The speaker then sits on this.

Two advantages - firstly it nicely decouples the speaker from the
surface... and secondly (more practically) the rubber feet stop the
speaker sliding around on the top plate.

HTH.

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

Phil Allison wrote:

Rooms with bare floors sound ABSOLUTELY ****HOUSE for hi-fi.

Well yes, there is that small point.

A few years ago I knew someone with all Audiolab 8000 series kit (the
original, not the cheap and nasty Chinese copies that have just been
re-launched) and Monitor Audio floorstanders.

It would have sounded great, except... they had it in a room with
laminate flooring, very few soft furnishings etc etc.

Apparently he didn't want carpets cos they were "so 1980s".

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

"Glenn Richards" wrote in
message
. uk
Ale wrote:

I am about to construct a couple of speaker stands to my
DM601 S2 and I don´t know if I should use spikes between
the stands and the floor. My floor is hard (without
carpet).

If you're placing stands (or floorstanding speakers) on
carpet then you should use spikes. That way the stand (or
cabinet) makes contact with the floor underneath.

And the advantage of this is????

If you're placing the stands on a wooden floor it might
be worth using cones rather than spikes, as these won't
destroy your floor.

Cones have pointed ends too, right?

Either that or place a 1p coin under
the tip of each spike to protect the floor (or a 1/2p
coin if you still have any lying around!).

So let me get this - you add a cone which creates a problem that you then
have to fix by stacking money under it?

How about forgetting about the cone?

What about between the speakers and the stands? I have
also seen spikes there.

Isn't a spike just a cone with a sharper tip?

Never bothered with this. I tend to use rubber stick-on
feet placed on the top plate of the stand. The speaker
then sits on this.

Two advantages - firstly it nicely decouples the speaker
from the surface... and secondly (more practically) the
rubber feet stop the speaker sliding around on the top
plate.

Why bother with spikes and cones at all?

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

"Arny Krueger"


Isn't a spike just a cone with a sharper tip?



** I wonder if they come in conical elliptical like styluses ?

And sapphire or diamond ?




........ Phil

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

Arny Krueger wrote:

If you're placing stands (or floorstanding speakers) on carpet then
you should use spikes. That way the stand (or cabinet) makes
contact with the floor underneath.
And the advantage of this is????

If the speaker (or stand) is contacting the floor rather than the carpet
then it provides a more solid support.

Which means that when the speaker cone moves forward it has something
solid to push back against - so the air will move rather than the cabinet.

If you're placing the stands on a wooden floor it might be worth
using cones rather than spikes, as these won't destroy your floor.
Cones have pointed ends too, right?

They do - but cones also normally come with a small disc with a recess
in it which you place under the cone to prevent damage to the floor.

The other option with floorstanding speakers which works when you're
using them on a hard surface (eg a wooden floor) is to use stick-on
rubber feet. These however aren't terribly effective on carpets, as the
speakers aren't in contact with the floor underneath - so will move
around and vibrate with the music.

Two advantages - firstly it nicely decouples the speaker from the
surface... and secondly (more practically) the rubber feet stop the
speaker sliding around on the top plate.
Why bother with spikes and cones at all?

Because it sounds better. Same as if you've got floorstanders that can
be filled with sand - if you bother filling them with sand then they'll
sound better. Tighter bass for one thing.

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

"Glenn Richards" wrote


Because it sounds better. Same as if you've got floorstanders that can be
filled with sand - if you bother filling them with sand then they'll sound
better. Tighter bass for one thing.


Mass loading speakers doesn't always bring benefits - it needs trying
out.....

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

"Glenn Richards" wrote in
message
Arny Krueger wrote:

If you're placing stands (or floorstanding speakers) on
carpet then you should use spikes. That way the stand
(or cabinet) makes contact with the floor underneath.
And the advantage of this is????

If the speaker (or stand) is contacting the floor rather
than the carpet then it provides a more solid support.

So what?

Which means that when the speaker cone moves forward it
has something solid to push back against - so the air
will move rather than the cabinet.

The cone works against a relatively large mass - the speaker and its
enclosure.

If you want a real revelation, compare a speaker on an
acoustically-transparent stand to the same speaker hung from the ceiling by
fishing line. Note that the speaker does not move around noticably when
suspended by the nylon line.

If you're placing the stands on a wooden floor it might
be worth using cones rather than spikes, as these won't
destroy your floor.

Cones have pointed ends too, right?

They do - but cones also normally come with a small disc
with a recess in it which you place under the cone to prevent damage to
the floor.

Plan B - just don't use things that want to damage the floor.

The other option with floorstanding speakers which works
when you're using them on a hard surface (eg a wooden
floor) is to use stick-on rubber feet. These however
aren't terribly effective on carpets, as the speakers
aren't in contact with the floor underneath - so will
move around and vibrate with the music.

Never has happened for me.

Two advantages - firstly it nicely decouples the
speaker from the surface... and secondly (more
practically) the rubber feet stop the speaker sliding
around on the top plate.

Why bother with spikes and cones at all?

Because it sounds better.

Only in sighted evaluations.

Same as if you've got floorstanders that can be filled with sand - if you
bother filling them with
sand then they'll sound better. Tighter bass for one
thing.

Nahh - when you fill a speaker with sand you change the panel resonances as
well.

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

"Arny Krueger"

The cone works against a relatively large mass - the speaker and its
enclosure.


** The mass ratio of a whole speaker box to the woofer cone is around 500:
1, or more.

The conservation of momentum principle ( Newton's "every action causes an
equal and opposite re-action" ) requires that the momentum of the moving
cone and whole box remain equal and opposite. So, the box moves about 0.2%
of the cone's movement in the opposite direction.

Typical woofers move at most 6mm forward and back when producing the lowest
bass frequencies.

The box, in compliance with Newton, then moves 12 um back and forward.

12 um = 0.5 thou = one quarter the thickness of a page in the phone book.



Why bother with spikes and cones at all?

Because it sounds better.

Only in sighted evaluations.


** Of course.

Who wants to eat in a completely dark restaurant ??



........ Phil

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

Phil Allison wrote:
"Arny Krueger"

The cone works against a relatively large mass - the speaker and its
enclosure.


** The mass ratio of a whole speaker box to the woofer cone is around 500:
1, or more.

The conservation of momentum principle ( Newton's "every action causes an
equal and opposite re-action" ) requires that the momentum of the moving
cone and whole box remain equal and opposite. So, the box moves about 0.2%
of the cone's movement in the opposite direction.

Typical woofers move at most 6mm forward and back when producing the lowest
bass frequencies.

The box, in compliance with Newton, then moves 12 um back and forward.

12 um = 0.5 thou = one quarter the thickness of a page in the phone book.



Why bother with spikes and cones at all?
Because it sounds better.
Only in sighted evaluations.


** Of course.


IME it doesn't always work like that. My Dynaudio 1.1s sit on some
stands with a smallish top plate. After an hour of fairly spirited
listening, they'd moved about 4cm forward. I'd usually use blutack for
that reason - it's all in the movement of air.

Rob

Speaker Stands: with or without spikes?
 

"Rob"
Phil Allison wrote:
"Arny Krueger"

The cone works against a relatively large mass - the speaker and its
enclosure.


** The mass ratio of a whole speaker box to the woofer cone is around
500: 1, or more.

The conservation of momentum principle ( Newton's "every action causes
an equal and opposite re-action" ) requires that the momentum of the
moving cone and whole box remain equal and opposite. So, the box moves
about 0.2% of the cone's movement in the opposite direction.

Typical woofers move at most 6mm forward and back when producing the
lowest bass frequencies.

The box, in compliance with Newton, then moves 12 um back and forward.

12 um = 0.5 thou = one quarter the thickness of a page in the phone
book.



Why bother with spikes and cones at all?
Because it sounds better.
Only in sighted evaluations.


** Of course.


IME it doesn't always work like that.


** Long as the box is not bolted down - it IS how the box reacts to the
woofer.

Newton is not to be messed with.


My Dynaudio 1.1s sit on some stands with a smallish top plate. After an
hour of fairly spirited listening, they'd moved about 4cm forward.


** Bet your floor is vibrating in sympathy with SPL at low frequencies.

Then the speaker stand vibrates - cos it is supported by it.

Then, the un-secured box drifts forward.



I'd usually use blutack for that reason - it's all in the movement of air.


** Low frequency sound pressure waves shake the whole room - floor,
ceilings, windows, cupboard doors - every damn thing. And by exactly the
same amount even of the speaker boxes were hung on long coil springs from
the roof.



....... Phil