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Copy Protected Cds
Since I just came across my first problem CD and I haven't seen any mention
of them here for a while, I wondered if people are still finding them troublesome. To be honest until I got this disc I thought the complaints were, well, a bit exaggerated. I've changed my mind. The disc is Mariza, Fado Curvo, on EMI Valentim De Carvalho". Lo and behold I found it listed on http://ukcdr.org/issues/cd/bad/ - I should have looked first shouldn't I? The effect on my AVI CD player is odd, there is a nasty sounding glitch a few seconds into the start of every track, then the rest of the track plays fine. It plays OK on my PC (using the player bundled on the CD - yuk) and what's more I can rip the tracks using Roxio - so I could produce a perfectly usable Red Book CD if I felt so inclined! What a stunningly successful Copy Protection scheme that is!! Roy. |
Copy Protected Cds
"Roy" wrote in message
... "TT" wrote in message ... : I recently had a similar problem when I ripped the DD2.0 track off a DVD-A disc. A loud (and I mean speaker damaging loud) squeal/click from the LH speaker at the end of the first 5 tracks. To overcome it I used Nero to cut the offending bit out and then used a steeper fade out to cover the cut. You could try this in reverse and use a fade in. What I couldn't overcome was the "watermark" on track 9 - a 16KHz sine wave through the whole track at just below music level. Almost unnoticeable in my car BUT un-listenable in my home system. Oh well cut track 9 :-( Hope this helps TT I can rip the tracks to hard disc and they are perfectly OK, hence my comment about how wonderful so-called copy protection is. All it achieves is preventing me playing the original CD on a CD player. Hmm. Perhaps it's trying to tell you something.......... |
Copy Protected Cds
"Keith G" wrote in message ... "Roy" wrote in message ... I can rip the tracks to hard disc and they are perfectly OK, hence my comment about how wonderful so-called copy protection is. All it achieves is preventing me playing the original CD on a CD player. Hmm. Perhaps it's trying to tell you something.......... If it's trying to tell me something it should speak more clearly. Although I have noticed that following Philips legal intervention these EMI copy protected disc no longer display the Compact Disc logo - 'cos they're not red book standard. Roy. |
Copy Protected Cds
"TT" wrote
I recently had a similar problem when I ripped the DD2.0 track off a DVD-A disc. A loud (and I mean speaker damaging loud) squeal/click from the LH speaker at the end of the first 5 tracks. To overcome it I used Nero to cut the offending bit out and then used a steeper fade out to cover the cut. You could try this in reverse and use a fade in. What I couldn't overcome was the "watermark" on track 9 - a 16KHz sine wave through the whole track at just below music level. Almost unnoticeable in my car BUT un-listenable in my home system. Oh well cut track 9 :-( TT, I admire your balls posting this here. It's about time a few of the 'home truths' concerning the quagmire that digital music's getting itself into these days - too many 'digi****s' here have been getting away with the 'it's digital, so it's perfect' mantra for too long. About the only certainty in 'digital' atm is that whatever player you go out and buy this afternoon, you can bet your butt that, within 2 years, it will turn out to have been the *wrong* one..... 30/40 years ago: 'Taping music is killing the industry' Today: 'Digital music is killing the industry'........ (Having said all that, I'm sorry to hear you are having problems, nevertheless.) |
Copy Protected Cds
"Roy" wrote in message
... "Keith G" wrote in message ... "Roy" wrote in message ... I can rip the tracks to hard disc and they are perfectly OK, hence my comment about how wonderful so-called copy protection is. All it achieves is preventing me playing the original CD on a CD player. Hmm. Perhaps it's trying to tell you something.......... If it's trying to tell me something it should speak more clearly. Although I have noticed that following Philips legal intervention these EMI copy protected disc no longer display the Compact Disc logo - 'cos they're not red book standard. Red Book? Forget it, Roy - that's out the window now, matey! |
Copy Protected Cds
A certain Keith G, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes :
30/40 years ago: 'Taping music is killing the industry' That was as ******** then as it is now. Today: 'Digital music is killing the industry'........ This is what you call a troll. Digital music isn't killing the industry. The industry itself, with it's bizarre ideas on copyright control, is doing the damage here. Inserting watermarks or other signals is perfectly possible to do on vinyl or analogue tape - it's just a recent phenomenon. I think it's rather sad for you to use this rather serious issue for all music listeners as a personal soapbox. The truth is that almost all music is distributed digitally, and there is no way to obtain most modern musical works outside of CD or DVD. Given that, can you explain the alternatives ? -- "Jokes mentioning ducks were considered particularly funny." - cnn.com |
Copy Protected Cds
"Chesney Christ" wrote in message
... A certain Keith G, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes : 30/40 years ago: 'Taping music is killing the industry' That was as ******** then as it is now. Today: 'Digital music is killing the industry'........ This is what you call a troll. Digital music isn't killing the industry. Oh yes it is, wait and see. The industry itself, with it's bizarre ideas on copyright control, is doing the damage here. Inserting watermarks or other signals is perfectly possible to do on vinyl or analogue tape - it's just a recent phenomenon. Yes, as a result of 'digitising' music. (Kinda shot themselves in the foot with it....) I think it's rather sad for you to use this rather serious issue for all music listeners as a personal soapbox. Get real. Try to avoid the personal abuse of the more seasoned 'vinyl bashers' round here - doesn't make 'em look too bright..... The truth is that almost all music is distributed digitally, and there is no way to obtain most modern musical works outside of CD or DVD. Given that, can you explain the alternatives ? Yup, buy more vinyl - the MI will be absolutely bloody relieved to sell it to you - see earlier remark about taping. |
Copy Protected Cds
Hi,
In message , Roy writes If it's trying to tell me something it should speak more clearly. Although I have noticed that following Philips legal intervention these EMI copy protected disc no longer display the Compact Disc logo - 'cos they're not red book standard. It's about time, too. Putting the CD logo on non-red book compliant CDs is fraud, in my book. I'm glad to see that at least some of the big studios are at least leaving the logos off 'toyed with' CDs. -- Regards, Glenn Booth |
Copy Protected Cds
"Chesney Christ" wrote in message ... : A certain TT, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes : : : You could try this in reverse and use a fade in. What I couldn't : overcome was the "watermark" on track 9 - a 16KHz sine wave : through the whole track at just below music level. : : Sounds like a very bad fault on the original recording. A watermark : isn't a soundwave, and if it were, it would present on more than one : track. : : Very bad luck there. : : -- : : "Jokes mentioning ducks were considered particularly funny." - cnn.com : I would like to clear up a few points first. I'm not a pirate and am not doing this for financial gain or distributing any copied material. When I buy a disc I want to listen to it in my car. SACD/DVD-A/V presents a problem with this. If I legally own music I expect to able to use it - in *all* my players. No different from my vinyl days when I used to tape my LPs to play in my car (or at parties). Disc in question is REM - Automatic for the People DVD-A. It is an exceptional recording and I would rate it as one of the better hi-res discs I own. I have copied the Dolby Digital 2.0 track off this disc and once copied it shows these anomalies. Clicking through the left channel at the end of the first 5 tracks and a 16KHz noise on track 9 "Star Me Kitten" For DD it is a very good recording and if it was all I had it would be more than adequate ;-) And for a car it is perfect. The original does not show these traits only the copied material whether on a HD or burnt to a disc. BTW when played over crappy little computer speakers you don't hear the 16KHz noise anyway ;-) I am not complaining about this only passing comment and trying to help the original poster and saying how I managed to get around it as a matter of interest. Regards TT |
Copy Protected Cds
A certain Keith G, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes :
Digital music has been around for well over 20 years now. Yup and will be around forever - there's never any going back in this world. It just won't exist as CDs (or any other 'disk' form) for very much longer. What form do you have in mind ? Don't say "memory chips". You can't produce high-density (to the density of a modern dual-layer DVD) memory chips containing music in bulk for a few pence, and that won't be possible for many, many years. The success of DVD (for any function) seems to suggest that disc media are still going strong. Apart from anything else, there ain't the profits in the hardware there used to be. Which hardware ? The industry itself, with it's bizarre ideas on copyright control, is doing the damage here. Inserting watermarks or other signals is perfectly possible to do on vinyl or analogue tape - it's just a recent phenomenon. Yes, as a result of 'digitising' music. Is road rage the result of people owning cars ? Yes, amongst other things far to abstruse to go into here. So a person who owns a car is likely to become road-enraged ? Are domestic stabbings the result of people owning kitchen knives ? Same answer as before. So a couple who own kitchen knives are likely to stab each other ? Also: More people wear spectacles these days for a number of reasons including the fact that there are more Opticians.... You'll find there are more hospitals and doctors as well. We're better at diagnosing medical problems than we were 50 years ago, and we're also better at curing them. Cause and effect. How does vinyl (a medium upon which little if any music is distributed on exclusively) avoid this problem ? I'm a bit lost here - are you referring to the 'copyright control' issue? If so the problem isn't in the medium, it's in the industry. Yes. Price a twinkly new CD (complete with a nice artwork, lyrics etc) at no more than, say, 4.99 (absolute tops for the very latest releases) and the same lazy old Joe Ordinaire will buy it instead of trying to rip it off and Car Boot, Pub and Street sellers of bootlegs will jack it in because it won't be worth the bother. Back catalogue at 2.99 will sell all day long, sprinkle a bit of 'you know it makes sense' on in an intelligent way and bootlegging will halve overnight. We agree on something at least, although I do not think the bootlegging problem is anywhere near as serious as the music biz says it is. People have been copying and taping music since recording devices became available. -- "Jokes mentioning ducks were considered particularly funny." - cnn.com |
Copy Protected Cds
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Copy Protected Cds
"Chesney Christ" wrote in message
... A certain Keith G, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes : Digital music has been around for well over 20 years now. Yup and will be around forever - there's never any going back in this world. It just won't exist as CDs (or any other 'disk' form) for very much longer. What form do you have in mind ? Don't say "memory chips". You can't produce high-density (to the density of a modern dual-layer DVD) memory chips containing music in bulk for a few pence, and that won't be possible for many, many years. Wakey wakey Chezzer! - http://www.sandisk.com/pressrelease/...d512mb_1gb.htm (Free in Corn Flakes packets, this time next year......) The success of DVD (for any function) seems to suggest that disc media are still going strong. Apart from anything else, there ain't the profits in the hardware there used to be. Which hardware ? The industry itself, with it's bizarre ideas on copyright control, is doing the damage here. Inserting watermarks or other signals is perfectly possible to do on vinyl or analogue tape - it's just a recent phenomenon. Yes, as a result of 'digitising' music. Is road rage the result of people owning cars ? Yes, amongst other things far to abstruse to go into here. So a person who owns a car is likely to become road-enraged ? Far more so than someone who doesn't own or drive one.... Are domestic stabbings the result of people owning kitchen knives ? Same answer as before. So a couple who own kitchen knives are likely to stab each other ? Depends if she 'finds out'....... Also: More people wear spectacles these days for a number of reasons including the fact that there are more Opticians.... You'll find there are more hospitals and doctors as well. We're better at diagnosing medical problems than we were 50 years ago, and we're also better at curing them. Cause and effect. How does vinyl (a medium upon which little if any music is distributed on exclusively) avoid this problem ? I'm a bit lost here - are you referring to the 'copyright control' issue? If so the problem isn't in the medium, it's in the industry. Yes. Price a twinkly new CD (complete with a nice artwork, lyrics etc) at no more than, say, 4.99 (absolute tops for the very latest releases) and the same lazy old Joe Ordinaire will buy it instead of trying to rip it off and Car Boot, Pub and Street sellers of bootlegs will jack it in because it won't be worth the bother. Back catalogue at 2.99 will sell all day long, sprinkle a bit of 'you know it makes sense' on in an intelligent way and bootlegging will halve overnight. We agree on something at least, although I do not think the bootlegging problem is anywhere near as serious as the music biz says it is. Excuse me? There was summat on the boxes a couple of nights ago talking about losses to the 'music producers' in terms of *billions* per year..... People have been copying and taping music since recording devices became available. Yebbut, they didn't have the Internet, 24/7 Broadband and 40× drives to do it with in them days. Chez, mi amigo, I don't think you've got an inkling of a clue about how much pirated music (and movies) gets shunted round the world at the speed of (well not 'light' perhaps....) every single day. Let me just say, if you've got shares in EMI, I'd think about unloading them while you still can....... |
Copy Protected Cds
A certain Keith G, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes :
What form do you have in mind ? Don't say "memory chips". You can't produce high-density (to the density of a modern dual-layer DVD) memory chips containing music in bulk for a few pence, and that won't be possible for many, many years. Wakey wakey Chezzer! - http://www.sandisk.com/pressrelease/...d512mb_1gb.htm These are very roughly 100x the per-gigabyte cost of a modern hard disk drive. I don't think we're there yet. (Free in Corn Flakes packets, this time next year......) I can't predict the future so discussion on this is academic, but I don't agree that it's going to be that quick. Not even the "small" 32MB cards have fallen to the point where they cost a few pence. The manufacturing process for memory devices is inherently wasteful (although improving) and is still quite complex, whereas a CD production plant can churn out prerecorded CDs and DVDs for almost nothing in bulk quantities. You're right to say that the future is in solid state memory devices, mainly because they're smaller and more practical. When that happens it'll be a great day (for everyone except folks with hangups about digital, for whom it'll be pretty much business as usual). But the quality of the stored data will be identical to the equivalent data stored CD, although less error correction will be required. We agree on something at least, although I do not think the bootlegging problem is anywhere near as serious as the music biz says it is. Excuse me? There was summat on the boxes a couple of nights ago talking about losses to the 'music producers' in terms of *billions* per year..... Consider the source. The RIAA and so on calculate their sums on the basis that every single copied track would have been bought legitimately, which obviously isn't true. People download stuff they'd never think of buying. The main reason for the losses in the music biz is to do with the sheer dreck they're churning out these days. People have been copying and taping music since recording devices became available. Yebbut, they didn't have the Internet, 24/7 Broadband and 40× drives to do it with in them days. Doesn't matter. I don't think the arrival of double-speed tape-to-tape devices doubled the rate of piracy, for example. Chez, mi amigo, I don't think you've got an inkling of a clue about how much pirated music (and movies) gets shunted round the world at the speed of (well not 'light' perhaps....) every single day. I do, I even work in telecoms. Let me just say, if you've got shares in EMI, I'd think about unloading them while you still can....... I'd never buy shares in the music business. Their tactics and business processes are despicable and the pumped-up manufactured music they churn out is utter dreck. -- "Jokes mentioning ducks were considered particularly funny." - cnn.com |
Copy Protected Cds
"Chesney Christ" wrote
snipped 'academic' bits We agree on something at least, although I do not think the bootlegging problem is anywhere near as serious as the music biz says it is. Excuse me? There was summat on the boxes a couple of nights ago talking about losses to the 'music producers' in terms of *billions* per year..... Consider the source. The RIAA and so on calculate their sums on the basis that every single copied track would have been bought legitimately, which obviously isn't true. OK, not worth arguing about. People download stuff they'd never think of buying. Yup. The main reason for the losses in the music biz is to do with the sheer dreck they're churning out these days. Yup and nope...... People have been copying and taping music since recording devices became available. Yebbut, they didn't have the Internet, 24/7 Broadband and 40× drives to do it with in them days. Doesn't matter. I don't think the arrival of double-speed tape-to-tape devices doubled the rate of piracy, for example. Adding the extra horse to your haycart didn't quite bring it up to Concorde's speed either. Chez, mi amigo, I don't think you've got an inkling of a clue about how much pirated music (and movies) gets shunted round the world at the speed of (well not 'light' perhaps....) every single day. I do, I even work in telecoms. No comment. Let me just say, if you've got shares in EMI, I'd think about unloading them while you still can....... I'd never buy shares in the music business. Their tactics and business processes are despicable and the pumped-up manufactured music they churn out is utter dreck. Yup. (No 'nope' this time.) Now ponder on one main area of my 'music tastes' - 30's, 40's and 50's Jazz - and see if you can squeeze vinyl into the equation somewhere.... ;-) |
Copy Protected Cds
A certain Ronnie McKinley, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes :
I'd never buy shares in the music business. Their tactics and business processes are despicable and the pumped-up manufactured music they churn out is utter dreck. Oh so on principle you don't buy ANY reproduced music at all? Obviously not. I didn't say anything about principles, or about whether or not I buy music. Is it any wonder you're so good at hearing things that aren't there. -- "Jokes mentioning ducks were considered particularly funny." - cnn.com |
Copy Protected Cds
A certain Ronnie McKinley, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes :
In uk.rec.audio Chesney Christ wrote: A certain Ronnie McKinley, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes : I'd never buy shares in the music business. Their tactics and business processes are despicable and the pumped-up manufactured music they churn out is utter dreck. Oh so on principle you don't buy ANY reproduced music at all? Obviously not. "Obviously not" ?? Obviously not, what? I'm not playing, Ron. It's pretty silly to say that I never buy any reproduced music. For anyone with a bit of wit, it would seem pretty obvious that someone posting in a hifi group probably does. -- "Jokes mentioning ducks were considered particularly funny." - cnn.com |
Copy Protected Cds
A certain Ronnie McKinley, of uk.rec.audio "fame", writes :
I'm not playing, Ron. It's pretty silly to say that I never buy any reproduced music. **I** never stated or **said** YOU didn't buy reproduced music, did I? What other way is there to interpret what you wrote below : "Oh so on principle you don't buy ANY reproduced music at all?" ??? Why did you write that ? I'm snipping all of your other arguments, it is impossible to argue with someone who insists on misrepresentation. I simply don't have time to bugger about with that. -- "Jokes mentioning ducks were considered particularly funny." - cnn.com |
Copy Protected Cds
"Keith G" wrote in message ... "Roy" wrote in message ... "Keith G" wrote in message ... "Roy" wrote in message ... I can rip the tracks to hard disc and they are perfectly OK, hence my comment about how wonderful so-called copy protection is. All it achieves is preventing me playing the original CD on a CD player. Hmm. Perhaps it's trying to tell you something.......... If it's trying to tell me something it should speak more clearly. Although I have noticed that following Philips legal intervention these EMI copy protected disc no longer display the Compact Disc logo - 'cos they're not red book standard. Red Book? Forget it, Roy - that's out the window now, matey! So it seems, but my (and I suspect your) CD player is designed to play discs produced to that standard. Roy. |
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