6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels
of microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the current
'70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise the number of
boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken apart each week -
we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals
in and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.

TIA.

--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

"Mike Scott" wrote in message
...

Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels of
microphones connected to a laptop?

snip

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals in
and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.


There seems to be a conflict between these two sentences. Do you want to
input 6 microphones *at the same time*?. If so you do need to do the mixing
before the signals get into the laptop. Only if you are happy to record from
each microphone one at a time can you use software mixing.

There are now plenty of small, cheap audio mixers with USB output which you
can simply plug into a laptop and use whichever of the audio editing
software packages available that suits. Bespoke software won't be necessary
(unless you enjoy writing your own).

David.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

David Looser wrote:
"Mike Scott" wrote in message
...

Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels of
microphones connected to a laptop?

snip

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals in
and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.


There seems to be a conflict between these two sentences. Do you want to
input 6 microphones *at the same time*?. If so you do need to do the mixing
before the signals get into the laptop. Only if you are happy to record from
each microphone one at a time can you use software mixing.

Eh? I don't understand that last bit. The current setup has 6 mic's
going into a 6-channel mixer (and thence to tape). In practice the mixer
is almost always just used to switch from one mic to the next as we
change talker; occasionally two or more mic's might be live at once.

We can either emulate the same - a 6-channel mixer but with USB output,
which is going to be expensive for that number of mic input channels, or
we can try to find a cheaper way of connecting the mic's and do the
mixing in software.

I notice there are some mic's with usb output; I'm not sure how well a
laptop would cope with 6 separate simultaneous USB data streams.
Although I suppose the data rate will be highish anyway. Let's see - 6
channels at 44.1kHz times 16 bits - about 4Mbit/sec; well within USB2
capabilities on one data stream.


There are now plenty of small, cheap audio mixers with USB output which you
can simply plug into a laptop and use whichever of the audio editing

Not with 6 mic amps, at least, not that I've found.

software packages available that suits. Bespoke software won't be necessary
(unless you enjoy writing your own).

Or want to de-skill the task. A set of buttons labelled 'talker 1',
'talker 2', etc and automatic level setting would be ideal, not hard to
train people to use, and less error-prone.

David.




--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

"Mike Scott" wrote in message
...
David Looser wrote:
"Mike Scott" wrote in
message ...

Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels
of microphones connected to a laptop?

snip

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals
in and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.


There seems to be a conflict between these two sentences. Do you want to
input 6 microphones *at the same time*?. If so you do need to do the
mixing before the signals get into the laptop. Only if you are happy to
record from each microphone one at a time can you use software mixing.

Eh? I don't understand that last bit. The current setup has 6 mic's going
into a 6-channel mixer (and thence to tape). In practice the mixer is
almost always just used to switch from one mic to the next as we change
talker; occasionally two or more mic's might be live at once.

We can either emulate the same - a 6-channel mixer but with USB output,
which is going to be expensive for that number of mic input channels, or
we can try to find a cheaper way of connecting the mic's and do the mixing
in software.

I notice there are some mic's with usb output; I'm not sure how well a
laptop would cope with 6 separate simultaneous USB data streams. Although
I suppose the data rate will be highish anyway. Let's see - 6 channels at
44.1kHz times 16 bits - about 4Mbit/sec; well within USB2 capabilities on
one data stream.


There are now plenty of small, cheap audio mixers with USB output which
you can simply plug into a laptop and use whichever of the audio editing

Not with 6 mic amps, at least, not that I've found.

They certainly exist, though I guess it partly depends on your definition of
"cheap".

software packages available that suits. Bespoke software won't be
necessary (unless you enjoy writing your own).

Or want to de-skill the task. A set of buttons labelled 'talker 1',
'talker 2', etc and automatic level setting would be ideal, not hard to
train people to use, and less error-prone.


It sounds to me as though you'd already decided how you want to do this. I
am not aware of any software that mixes the output from several USB mics, so
if you want to go that route I guess you are into the bespoke software.
Sorry, I can't help with that.

David.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 09:04:43 +0000, Mike Scott
wrote:

Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels
of microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the current
'70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise the number of
boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken apart each week -
we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals
in and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.

If you want to switch in software, you need a 6-input "soundcard" for
the computer with microphone preamps. As the computer already has a
2-input system, and an external analogue 6-channel mixer will be
cheaper (look Behringer) it seems a no-brainer!

You could also look at the problem sideways and question whether you
really need 6 mics. Radio drama managed very well for many years with
the actors stepping up to a single mic. Are you using 6 mics because
you really need them,or because "it's always been done that way"?
Think hard whether your result could be achieved by passing around
(say) a Zoom H2.

You can only de-skill this just so far. The person capable of
positioning the mics sensible, setting levels and tidying up the
recording is not going to have a problem with plugging up the gear.
Without that person, the result will be mediocre.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

I don't think we could operate if we had to pull down everything each week.
I'd stick with a mixer and get a usb sound card with a line in on it.

People like mixers. Also, we use something called A Level Devil which means
that even the most ham fisted person cannot overload the recording, a thing
which you will find is much worse digitally than in analogue.
Save your money on new mixers and tell the committee you need a room to
use permanently. Play the blind card with the council and offer to do
their accessible stuff cheaper than anyone else does and you will find
things suddenly change... grin.
Brian, Kingston Upon Thames TN.
We are not actually fully digital yet, but the plan is to use existing
resources mixer wise, indeed, at home where some bits are prepared ahead of
time, I have a mixer connected to a computer .
Bg

--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email:
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________


"Mike Scott" wrote in message
...
Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels of
microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the current
'70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise the number of
boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken apart each week -
we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals in
and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.

TIA.

--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Yes, I think its actually cheaper though to get a good sound card with one
input and stick with the alresady understood mixer system rather than use on
screen soft mixing as one has to also look at the recording for putting in
track breaks to save later editing time on a tight turn around.

Brian

--
Brian Gaff....Note, this account does not accept Bcc: email.
graphics are great, but the blind can't hear them
Email:
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ __________


"David Looser" wrote in message
...
"Mike Scott" wrote in message
...

Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels of
microphones connected to a laptop?

snip

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals in
and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.


There seems to be a conflict between these two sentences. Do you want to
input 6 microphones *at the same time*?. If so you do need to do the
mixing before the signals get into the laptop. Only if you are happy to
record from each microphone one at a time can you use software mixing.

There are now plenty of small, cheap audio mixers with USB output which
you can simply plug into a laptop and use whichever of the audio editing
software packages available that suits. Bespoke software won't be
necessary (unless you enjoy writing your own).

David.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

"Brian Gaff" wrote in message
m...

Yes, I think its actually cheaper though to get a good sound card with one
input and stick with the alresady understood mixer system rather than use
on screen soft mixing as one has to also look at the recording for putting
in track breaks to save later editing time on a tight turn around.


The OP spoke about using a laptop, that means he can't use a "good sound
card". On-board audio on laptops is usually pretty dire, but mixers with USB
outputs are now readily available and seem to me to be the most obvious
solution to his problem. Though I get the feeling he has already decided to
use 6 USB mics and write his own software mixer.

I don't see a software mixer as being any easier to use or more idiot-proof
than a simple audio mixer, nor is it likely to be quicker or easier to set
up, after all a USB hub (probably a powered one) will be needed to plug all
the mics into.

But if the OP relishes the challenge of writing his own bespoke software who
are we to tell him not to?

David.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

David Looser wrote:
"Brian Gaff" wrote in message
m...

Yes, I think its actually cheaper though to get a good sound card with one
input and stick with the alresady understood mixer system rather than use
on screen soft mixing as one has to also look at the recording for putting
in track breaks to save later editing time on a tight turn around.


The OP spoke about using a laptop, that means he can't use a "good sound
card".


If it's a laptop with a pcmcia slot he could use one of these, which is what I
use with my laptop and very good it is too.
http://www.soundblaster.com/products...roduct=107 69


--
Bill Coombes

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 12:11:38 -0000, "David Looser"
wrote:

The OP spoke about using a laptop, that means he can't use a "good sound
card".

Sure he can, as long as "sound card" is defined loosely as "audio
interface". But for his application, a laptop's Line In will be just
fine, as long as he hasn't got one of those irredeemably noisy
laptops.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 12:11:38 -0000, "David Looser"
wrote:

The OP spoke about using a laptop, that means he can't use a "good sound
card".

Sure he can, as long as "sound card" is defined loosely as "audio
interface". But for his application, a laptop's Line In will be just
fine, as long as he hasn't got one of those irredeemably noisy
laptops.


I said "good sound card", not "sound card", the inclusion of the word good
was important. I've yet to meet a laptop with "good" on-board audio.

IME few laptops even have audio line in, most that I've met just have
microphone input and headphone/line out.

David.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Laurence Payne wrote:
On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 09:04:43 +0000, Mike Scott
wrote:

Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels
of microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the current
'70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise the number of
boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken apart each week -
we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals
in and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.

If you want to switch in software, you need a 6-input "soundcard" for
the computer with microphone preamps. As the computer already has a
2-input system, and an external analogue 6-channel mixer will be
cheaper (look Behringer) it seems a no-brainer!

You could also look at the problem sideways and question whether you
really need 6 mics. Radio drama managed very well for many years with
the actors stepping up to a single mic. Are you using 6 mics because
you really need them,or because "it's always been done that way"?

Something of the latter, I'm afraid. Come to that, it's been the case
until the past few weeks of "we've always used cassettes".... I've tried
off and on to shift the committee out of the 1970's without success.

To answer a point raised elsewhere, I really am just looking for ideas
to report back to the committee - nothing's cast in stone yet (such as 6
usb mic's :-)

One requirement is indeed to mark the various tracks - which could most
readily be done if everything is software controlled - because in
switching mic's you can also automatically (for example) start a new
audio file. I'm not too sure about training people to use audio editors
- and time is strictly limited for this job: we start recording at
around 6.30 pm, record till about 8-8.30, duplicate and the tapes are at
the post office by around 10pm. Doesn't leave an awful lot of time for
manual chopping up of audio files, especially for those not used to
computers!!


Think hard whether your result could be achieved by passing around
(say) a Zoom H2.

It could; but would require operational changes (I can hear the "but
we've always done it /this/ way!" types) to avoid clunks. And someone
would be bound to drop it.....


You can only de-skill this just so far. The person capable of
positioning the mics sensible, setting levels and tidying up the
recording is not going to have a problem with plugging up the gear.
Without that person, the result will be mediocre.

Harder to position a mic being passed round though. I'll have to have a
good think about this; very useful to hear others' thoughts, thanks.


--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Brian Gaff wrote:
I don't think we could operate if we had to pull down everything each week.
I'd stick with a mixer and get a usb sound card with a line in on it.

Life would certainly be a lot easier. But we borrow a room at the local
library on sufferance, I'm afraid; the whole lot has to be put out and
stripped down every evening. Except the two tape duplicators - they just
sort of hang around.


People like mixers. Also, we use something called A Level Devil which means
that even the most ham fisted person cannot overload the recording, a thing
which you will find is much worse digitally than in analogue.

Yes, I know. I've been playing with computer guitar effects lately, and
overload is, unsurprisingly, ghastly. I'm using an E-MU 24-bit box (USB)
for input to cope with the huge dynamic range - this cannot cope with
duplex at 48kHz (I was surprised), so I settle for the computer's own
line-out; good enough for now.

But I'll check that out.

Save your money on new mixers and tell the committee you need a room to
use permanently. Play the blind card with the council and offer to do
their accessible stuff cheaper than anyone else does and you will find
things suddenly change... grin.
Brian, Kingston Upon Thames TN.
We are not actually fully digital yet, but the plan is to use existing
resources mixer wise, indeed, at home where some bits are prepared ahead of
time, I have a mixer connected to a computer .

Now there's a whole new idea I tried pushing once - home working. The
editors could email out the texts, and people could mail in MP3s. I got
shouted down though.... they like working together.



--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

"Mike Scott"
wrote in message
Brian Gaff wrote:
I don't think we could operate if we had to pull down
everything each week. I'd stick with a mixer and get a
usb sound card with a line in on it.

Life would certainly be a lot easier. But we borrow a
room at the local library on sufferance, I'm afraid; the
whole lot has to be put out and stripped down every
evening. Except the two tape duplicators - they just sort
of hang around.

People like mixers. Also, we use something called A
Level Devil which means that even the most ham fisted
person cannot overload the recording, a thing which you
will find is much worse digitally than in analogue.

Yes, I know. I've been playing with computer guitar
effects lately, and overload is, unsurprisingly, ghastly.

Digital clipping is especially probematical when the bandpass is not flat.

I'm using an E-MU 24-bit box (USB) for input to cope with
the huge dynamic range - this cannot cope with duplex at
48kHz (I was surprised), so I settle for the computer's
own line-out; good enough for now.

I've run 24/96 and 24/192 2 channels full duplex all day long via a USB-2
interface on a legacy laptop and a legacy desktop. All you need is a good
operational USB-2 interface. Is this laptop so old that its USN interface
isn't USB-2? Is there a USB concentrator that is mucking up the works?

You don't need a new interface, you need access to a USB-2 port that is
worth a darn. ;-)

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

In article ,
Mike Scott wrote:
Or want to de-skill the task. A set of buttons labelled 'talker 1',
'talker 2', etc and automatic level setting would be ideal, not hard to
train people to use, and less error-prone.

The Holy Grail for this sort of thing. But sadly not possible if you wish
decent speech quality.

--
*Being healthy is merely the slowest possible rate at which one can die.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Mike Scott wrote:
Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels
of microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the current
'70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise the number of
boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken apart each week -
we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals
in and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.

TIA.


Do you really need a laptop?

How about a low cost stand alone digital recorder?

Cheers

Ian

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

On 10/02/2010 09:04, Mike Scott wrote:
Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels
of microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the current
'70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise the number of
boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken apart each week -
we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals
in and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.


Use a cheap ex-office telephone exchange and 6 telephone extensions,
with conference call features.

Or probably could do the modern software VOIP implementation (asterisk?)
of all that, so could run the 'exchange' on your laptop - and have the
players contributing from their homes via the internet.

--
Adrian C

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Arny Krueger wrote:
.....


I'm using an E-MU 24-bit box (USB) for input to cope with
the huge dynamic range - this cannot cope with duplex at
48kHz (I was surprised), so I settle for the computer's
own line-out; good enough for now.

I've run 24/96 and 24/192 2 channels full duplex all day long via a USB-2
interface on a legacy laptop and a legacy desktop. All you need is a good
operational USB-2 interface. Is this laptop so old that its USN interface
isn't USB-2? Is there a USB concentrator that is mucking up the works?

You don't need a new interface, you need access to a USB-2 port that is
worth a darn. ;-)

Oddly enough this is on a desktop - an aging but at least half-way
decent system my son built (rather against my advice :-) ), NF7S-based
if I recall. And no hubs or what-not, straight in. One day I will get
round to investigating the problem, but 'horrid noises' on the guitar
are /far/ more interesting!!! :-)





--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Ian Bell wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:
Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6 channels
of microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the
current '70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise the
number of boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken apart
each week - we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the signals
in and do any needed switching or mixing in software, possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.

TIA.


Do you really need a laptop?

How about a low cost stand alone digital recorder?

If it can record mp3's and divide into tracks, maybe. I'd not thought of
checking this area.


Cheers

Ian


--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England

6 mic channels into a laptop
 

Mike Scott wrote:
Ian Bell wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:
Any ideas please on the cheapest and/or best way of getting 6
channels of microphones connected to a laptop?

I'm looking at upgrading a Talking Newspaper's systems from the
current '70's-standard analogue system. There's a need to minimise
the number of boxes, and to de-skill the setup (it has to be taken
apart each week - we'd love a dedicated home for the studio!!)

We don't really need a full mixer - my thoughts are to get the
signals in and do any needed switching or mixing in software,
possibly bespoke.

Any other thoughts and pointers welcome.

TIA.


Do you really need a laptop?

How about a low cost stand alone digital recorder?

If it can record mp3's and divide into tracks, maybe. I'd not thought of
checking this area.


Cheers

Ian



I suggested it because operationally it is closer to the 70s gear it
would replace so existing users ought to make the transition more easily.

Why does it need to *record* mp3s? Most laptop systems will record .wav
files which you can then edit and finally convert to mp3. You can do the
same with a standalone device, converting to mp3 on a PC.

That way you maximise the quality until the final conversion stage.

If you don't want to spend a lot of money you could buy something like a
used AKAI DPS16 which can record 6 simultaneous mic inputs, edit tracks
and export to a wav file on CD for conversion to mp3 on a PC.

If you want to spend more money there are probably plenty of more modern
devices that do much the same.


Cheers

Ian