"Keith G" wrote in message
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"David Looser" wrote in message
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"Keith G" wrote in message
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"David Looser" wrote in message
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"Keith G" wrote

Try to get to hear an idler wheel deck if you haven't already: the
bass
will beat both direct and belt drive for impact ('spank') and
tightness
and you will hear far more clear detail in it - sticks on cymbals,
wooden percussion instruments, rimshots etc.


As I remember it idler-wheel decks (which used to be the standard
arrangement, remember the SP25?) went out of favour because of the
rumble.


Not quite the same on high quality 301/401s and Lencos.

Not quite, but the idler-wheel arangment is inherently noisier.

Belt-drives were so much quieter.

The fascinating thing is that your eulogy over idler-wheel decks
matches
the hype said about the (belt driven) Linn. So what can an observer
make
of all these claims and counter claims? My considered opinion is that
belief is a very powerful thing!



Eulogy? All I'm doing is saying try to get to hear one if you haven't
already, then you can make up your own mind. I'm not asking anyone to
believe what they can't hear for themselves.


I was just struck by the similarity of your language to those who rave


Rave?


about
other decks. Granted the devotees of the Linn go far more OTT than you
(the Linn isn't just a turntable, it's a magical machine that turns any
third-rate audio system into a music machine to satsfy the gods, or so
they tell me). However you still used basically the same sort of
wine-writers language - "impact", "tightness", "detail" etc. that doesn't
mean a damned thing, but sounds impressive.


Strange how you bashers respond to the use of ordinary language - is the
use of words like 'eulogy' and 'rave' some sort of counter-measure? I use
the language that best describes what I find, others do the same - some
wax more lyrical than others, what's the problem?



The 301 has been around for years and years. If it was half as good as
you claim why would anyone use anything else?


Marketing.


The 301 was the choice of a large percentage of studios
and broadcasters. Even the 401 did not totally replace it,
due to the longevity of the 301.

At that time, there were, with the exception of EMT, few
other turntables judged to be anything like as good.

Both the 301 and 401 are still in strong demand, and there
are a number of small firms who painstakingly refurbish them.

Now, with the exception of those with USB outputs,
the cheapo turntables have disappeared.

Vinyl has become a thriving niche market, with people
ready and willing to make a much larger investment
for a quality turntable (much more than they are willing
to pay for a CD player, after all, they all sound the same:-)

The manufacturers that are left are able to concentrate
on engineering quality instead of having to build down to a price.

SME and Verdier are excellent examples.

http://www.sme.ltd.uk/

http://www.jcverdier.com/

Just as Keith points out, new vinyl issues are usually sold
out within days of release. Twenty years after vinyl's
"demise" this seems remarkable..

In contrast, the sales of CD have dwindled to such an extent
that HMV have announced the closure of 60 retail outlets, and
three CD plants in the ÜK are faced with closure due to over
capacity.

Iain