Older seperates vs new system
 

With around £200 budget I've been thinking of buying a new hi-fi
system like a Sony or Panasonic or going to richer sounds and trying
to pick up some bargain seperates from their Trade Counter section.

I keep hearing that seperates invariably offer better quality and it's
tempting to build up a system as and when I could afford to improve
it. However, I've read online somewhere that CD technology has
improved in the last couple of years for example, and perhaps other
aspects have too (amps and so on) and am now wondering whether a new
hi-fi system would sound just as good as seperates that may be several
years old in design.

I'd appreciate peoples thoughts and opinions on the old seperates v
new system choice.

Older seperates vs new system
 

I wouldn't buy anything other than a second (ie. kitchen/bedroom) system new
for £200. If you do some research online and find out which stuff to buy,
you can (just about) put together a reasonable sounding setup for that sort
of money. As you mentioned, the used separates route also gives you the
option to expand/upgrade later as you can afford to do so. I've created a
very nice sounding setup myself, buying nearly everything secondhand off
Ebay (although admittedly spending more than £200). Btw, I wouldn't pay too
much attention as far as recent 'improvements' are concerned - most of what
you've heard almost certainly originates from hifi media hype!


"MG Lewis" wrote in message
om...
With around £200 budget I've been thinking of buying a new hi-fi
system like a Sony or Panasonic or going to richer sounds and trying
to pick up some bargain seperates from their Trade Counter section.

I keep hearing that seperates invariably offer better quality and it's
tempting to build up a system as and when I could afford to improve
it. However, I've read online somewhere that CD technology has
improved in the last couple of years for example, and perhaps other
aspects have too (amps and so on) and am now wondering whether a new
hi-fi system would sound just as good as seperates that may be several
years old in design.

I'd appreciate peoples thoughts and opinions on the old seperates v
new system choice.

Older seperates vs new system
 

MG Lewis wrote:

With around £200 budget I've been thinking of buying a new hi-fi
system like a Sony or Panasonic or going to richer sounds and trying
to pick up some bargain seperates from their Trade Counter section.

I keep hearing that seperates invariably offer better quality and it's
tempting to build up a system as and when I could afford to improve
it. However, I've read online somewhere that CD technology has
improved in the last couple of years for example, and perhaps other
aspects have too (amps and so on) and am now wondering whether a new
hi-fi system would sound just as good as seperates that may be several
years old in design.

I'd appreciate peoples thoughts and opinions on the old seperates v
new system choice.

You can't even get a decent new pair of speakers for £200.

I have a very nice pair of Rogers speakers from "Cash Converters"
and have seen some decent CD players and amps there.
eBay can also have some bargains.

Within your budget, all CD players and amps will sound the same
and the speakers will make the difference.

If you are in the Midlands, I have a pair of Mordaunt-Short MS3.40's
with stands you can have for 50 quid.
(Never been thrashed, full service history.)

--
Eiron.

Older seperates vs new system
 

I took my dog out for a walk.
While it was ****ing on MG Lewis's leg, he seemed distracted by:
With around £200 budget I've been thinking of buying a new hi-fi
system like a Sony or Panasonic or going to richer sounds and trying
to pick up some bargain seperates from their Trade Counter section.

I keep hearing that seperates invariably offer better quality and it's
tempting to build up a system as and when I could afford to improve
it. However, I've read online somewhere that CD technology has
improved in the last couple of years for example, and perhaps other
aspects have too (amps and so on) and am now wondering whether a new
hi-fi system would sound just as good as seperates that may be several
years old in design.

I'd appreciate peoples thoughts and opinions on the old seperates v
new system choice.

Buy new, get some cheap secondhand speakers off eBay. In your price range,
the 'features' are what costs the money. Try to find something without a
graphic equaliser and you're on the right track. Music is about enjoyment,
and they *don't* all sound the same, even at the bottom end.

--
Despite appearances, it is still legal to put sugar on cornflakes.

Older seperates vs new system
 

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 23:25:04 +0000 (UTC), "Triffid"
wrote:

Buy new, get some cheap secondhand speakers off eBay. In your price range,
the 'features' are what costs the money. Try to find something without a
graphic equaliser and you're on the right track. Music is about enjoyment,
and they *don't* all sound the same, even at the bottom end.

I think I would change the sense of that last bit - the word "even"
gives me a problem. It is especially at the bottom end that things
don't all sound the same. Once you are clear of the bottom end, things
do sound the same - they all tend to sound right. That situation holds
good all the way to the top end, where things tend to fall apart again
and stupid "boutique" designs rear their incompetent heads. That goes
for the electronic stuff anyway.

When it comes to speakers, they carry on getting better right up
into the many thousands of pounds, so to get the best within a budget,
it is a good idea to go secondhand, with the proviso that they be
carefully auditioned before buying.

d
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

Older seperates vs new system
 

On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:45:29 +0100, Eiron wrote:

MG Lewis wrote:

With around £200 budget I've been thinking of buying a new hi-fi
system like a Sony or Panasonic or going to richer sounds and trying
to pick up some bargain seperates from their Trade Counter section.

I keep hearing that seperates invariably offer better quality and it's
tempting to build up a system as and when I could afford to improve
it. However, I've read online somewhere that CD technology has
improved in the last couple of years for example,

Nope, the last *significant* improvement in CD quality happened around
1990, when 'bitstream' converters came in. A cheap modern Technics CD
player is very close to sounding as good as anything you can buy at
any price.

and perhaps other
aspects have too (amps and so on)

Nope, they've been sonically transparent for twenty years or more at
the mid-price and up end of the market. A modern Yamaha AX-582/592
will sound pretty close to state of the art, despite what the
so-called 'high enders' would have you believe.

and am now wondering whether a new
hi-fi system would sound just as good as seperates that may be several
years old in design.

Nope, get some discontinued separates from Richer Sounds (their
Cambridge range contains some real gems) and you'll be well on the way
to top-class sound on a budget. The *important* thing is the speakers,
and good ones do cost serious money.

I'd appreciate peoples thoughts and opinions on the old seperates v
new system choice.

You can't even get a decent new pair of speakers for £200.

You can, but stick to top brands like B&W, KEF or Mordaunt-Short for
best results. Recently dicontinued ranges will give the best value,
and Richer Sounds is a good source of such.

I have a very nice pair of Rogers speakers from "Cash Converters"
and have seen some decent CD players and amps there.
eBay can also have some bargains.

Indeed so. In fact, there's a pair of Spendor BC 11s on for £95 right
now, which will give you great sound - and serious 'audiophile cred'!

Also B&W 602 Series 2 at £56, and many other excellent speakers
including Mission 780SE and even ATC SCM7s at very reasonable prices.

Within your budget, all CD players and amps will sound the same
and the speakers will make the difference.

Correct - and he'll get little improvement from the electronics until
he has spent at least a couple of grand on serious speakers.
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

Older seperates vs new system
 

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 20:45:29 +0100, Eiron wrote:

Nope, the last *significant* improvement in CD quality happened around
1990, when 'bitstream' converters came in. A cheap modern Technics CD
player is very close to sounding as good as anything you can buy at
any price.

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

I have a cheap modern Technics CD player (2002) which is
vastly improved by the addition of a Meridian 203 DAC. In
fact I have two such setups which I consider superior to my
Marantz 6000 CD player. An additional bonus is that the
Technics will play any CD-R's without quibble whereas the
Marantz is very picky.

No wonder you can't hear the difference between cables, Stew :-)

Alan

Older seperates vs new system
 

"Eiron" wrote in message
...

If you are in the Midlands, I have a pair of Mordaunt-Short MS3.40's
with stands you can have for 50 quid.
(Never been thrashed, full service history.)
--
Eiron.

Add a cheap new CD player (£50) with a Meridian 203
DAC (£100 Ebay) and a Pioneer A400 (£75 Ebay) or
similar (Nad 3020 £40 Ebay) amplifier and you have
better than decent sound for less than £300.

Alan

Older seperates vs new system
 

I took my dog out for a walk.
While it was ****ing on Don Pearce's leg, he seemed distracted by:
On Mon, 13 Sep 2004 23:25:04 +0000 (UTC), "Triffid"
wrote:

Buy new, get some cheap secondhand speakers off eBay. In your price
range, the 'features' are what costs the money. Try to find something
without a graphic equaliser and you're on the right track. Music is
about enjoyment, and they *don't* all sound the same, even at the bottom
end.

I think I would change the sense of that last bit - the word "even"
gives me a problem. It is especially at the bottom end that things
don't all sound the same. Once you are clear of the bottom end, things
do sound the same - they all tend to sound right. That situation holds
good all the way to the top end, where things tend to fall apart again
and stupid "boutique" designs rear their incompetent heads. That goes
for the electronic stuff anyway.

When it comes to speakers, they carry on getting better right up
into the many thousands of pounds, so to get the best within a budget,
it is a good idea to go secondhand, with the proviso that they be
carefully auditioned before buying.


erm.. I was thinking more in the sense that even cheap crap can be
distinguished. You just need to lower your terms of reference.

--
Despite appearances, it is still legal to put sugar on cornflakes.

Older seperates vs new system
 

On Tue, 14 Sep 2004 08:30:24 +0000 (UTC), "Triffid"
wrote:

erm.. I was thinking more in the sense that even cheap crap can be
distinguished. You just need to lower your terms of reference.

It is that word "even" that is the problem. It seems to imply that you
would expect more expensive stuff to be distinguishable, but it is
somehow surprising that cheap crap can be - that is the reverse of the
true situation, which is that cheap crap is the stuff that is most
easily distinguished, but once you are clear of that area, everything
is indistinguishable.

Or were you using the word "distinguished" in the "going slightly grey
at the temples" sense?

d
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com