Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Fella wrote:

1) Ignore the "all cd players, amps, speakers, wires, etc, sound the
same" type of borgs lurking around here. Just believe in your own ears.


I'd love to know who you think reckons all speakers sound the same?

Well if some have the audacity to think that all cd players and amps
sound the same why not also speakers?

What about it howie? With level matching and 8 hours a day pink noise
listening subjected to the strictest iron curtain double blind tests you
think you would get a sonus faber sound the same as a, say, dynaudio ?


I've never seen this in print anywhere - the writer would be laughed out
of court.

Yes but he would come back.


I'd caution against just relying on your ears without a reference. The
room used for listening in has a far greater influence on the final sound
than any competent amp or CD etc. So what may sound fine in a shop at a
quick audition may well disappoint at home.

You are correct. I should have advised the newbie that (s)he should have
home auditioned any equipment for at least a week before any purchase
decision. That's what I do actually.



Also, IMHO, ... If a speaker sounds
'impressive' on one type of music more than another, it's a poor design.


Well I am not saying that for instance that some death metal vehemence
would sound bad with *spesifically* a sonus faber (it would sound bad
eminating from any old speaker, it wants to sound bad, yes?). What I am
saying is that its just a waste of money and abilities of the sonus
faber speakers to employ them on that kind of material. Sonus faber is
designed to bring out all the subtle inner details, the beauty, the
musicality, of a given piece of music, that IMHO, does not exist in
angry music. And since such music is preferably heard LOUD and with lots
of distortion, a sonus faber would be an overkill, as it were. A pair of
cremona costs at least three times as much as a pair of some average
cervin wega!s which are designed to give what the listeners or angry
music want.

Newbie wrote in message ...
Michael McKelvy wrote:

My choice would be for Dynaudio and Proac since they use the top 2
drivers made

Do you know which series within each model would be best to look at?
Maybe I have been out of this game for too long but the situation
confuses me. For example, Dynaudio site has Audience, Contour,
Confidence, and Evidence! Every write-up is superlative, leaving no
hint of what is the series aimed at. If you know Dynaudio (or proac)
range, please help!


"Ranges" often equate to "price brackets", I believe, price overlaps
are probably quite rare. I'm a Dynaudio user, I have just upgraded
from the Audience 42 to the Contour 1.3mk2 (now deleted,there's also a
1.3SE and 1.4, though not sure if the 1.3SE is still current either).
I have to say the Contours are by a mile the biggest improvement I've
ever made to my system over 20 years. At times they are simply
breathtaking. I got them second hand, mint for £675 and I believe you
can get them about £899 new (if you can find any). In somes respects,
it's hard to imagine how a speaker could be any better. I'd recommend
them without hesitation. They're stand mounters by the way, so factor
in about £100 for stands. (I've never quite understood why people
insist on floorstanders.)

In article ,
Fella wrote:
I'd love to know who you think reckons all speakers sound the same?

Well if some have the audacity to think that all cd players and amps
sound the same why not also speakers?

I think the expression would be all *competent* cd players and amps will
sound pretty close. Of course, it's easy to make an amp or CD player that
sounds different and impress the gullible.

What about it howie? With level matching and 8 hours a day pink noise
listening subjected to the strictest iron curtain double blind tests you
think you would get a sonus faber sound the same as a, say, dynaudio ?

Err, you're making a common mistake. You disagree with one point from a
person and therefore everything else he says is rubbish to. Not a good
idea.

Do you really think equipment makers don't make use of careful
measurements - even your favourite or most hated ones? Of course they do.
That doesn't mean to say they'll act on them, though.

snip

Also, IMHO, ... If a speaker sounds 'impressive' on one type of
music more than another, it's a poor design.


Well I am not saying that for instance that some death metal vehemence
would sound bad with *spesifically* a sonus faber (it would sound bad
eminating from any old speaker, it wants to sound bad, yes?). What I am
saying is that its just a waste of money and abilities of the sonus
faber speakers to employ them on that kind of material.

That's a bit elitist? Some here can remember when any kind of 'pop' music
was looked down on by many.

Sonus faber is designed to bring out all the subtle inner details, the
beauty, the musicality, of a given piece of music, that IMHO, does not
exist in angry music. And since such music is preferably heard LOUD and
with lots of distortion, a sonus faber would be an overkill, as it
were. A pair of cremona costs at least three times as much as a pair of
some average cervin wega!s which are designed to give what the
listeners or angry music want.

Any decent speaker is designed to reproduce its input accurately. Some
work better than others at this, of course.
One which reveals details 'perfectly' will continue to do so with
anything. A honky bass and shrieking treble type one might impress on some
things, but disappoint on others. Many these days also feed their AV
system through their main speakers, so don't forget to check on speech.
That can be most revealing.

--
*Why is the man who invests all your money called a broker?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Fella wrote:



Well I am not saying that for instance that some death metal vehemence
would sound bad with *spesifically* a sonus faber (it would sound bad
eminating from any old speaker, it wants to sound bad, yes?). What I am
saying is that its just a waste of money and abilities of the sonus
faber speakers to employ them on that kind of material.


That's a bit elitist?

No, not really. That kind of music is already based on distortion, LOUD
and intimidating sounds, like I said "it wants to sound bad", and it
doesn't have any subtle, inner details or microdynamics...

I got a 1.5 year old.. When I play charlie haden to him (or some
neo-classical turkish jazz, or astor piazzola, whatever) he rolls around
the floor, smile on his face, listening and mumbling.. But once (to
experiment) I put on soundgarden, and another occasion ozzy ozbourne
(just to be sure of the first time behaviour) and on both occasions he
ran out of the room crying. He was sincerely frightened... I don't
think he was "looking down" on that kind of music, or being "elitist" ..
It's just the way that kind of music is. And yes, I'd rather hear
soundgarden from a pair of cervin wegas, then sonus fabers..

Newbie wrote:

: Friends have suggeted Spendor, Proac and Dynaudio.

Those are well known names by now but I remember when each was news to
me and I suspected the salesman was trying to pull some trick.

Anyway, does anybody know any unknown / less well known speaker brands
that are of equal or better quality and much better value (ie, less
expensive) than these?

RPS

In article , RPS
wrote:

Newbie wrote:

: Friends have suggeted Spendor, Proac and Dynaudio.

Those are well known names by now but I remember when each was news to
me and I suspected the salesman was trying to pull some trick.

Anyway, does anybody know any unknown / less well known speaker brands
that are of equal or better quality and much better value (ie, less
expensive) than these?

Triangle.

http://www.triangle-fr.com/welcome-2002.htm

Stephen

"RPS" wrote in message
...
Newbie wrote:

: Friends have suggeted Spendor, Proac and Dynaudio.

Those are well known names by now but I remember when each was news to
me and I suspected the salesman was trying to pull some trick.

Anyway, does anybody know any unknown / less well known speaker brands
that are of equal or better quality and much better value (ie, less
expensive) than these?


Some (mebbe not all) of the Eltax brand get a very good rating in some of
the comix and are as cheap as chips. They are Danish and appear to be very
well made.

I got a pair of 'Millenium 100s' off ebay for a tenner (+ P&P) and they are
quite excellent, see:


http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax01.jpg

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax02.jpg

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax03.jpg

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax04.jpg

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax05.jpg

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax06.jpg

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax07.jpg

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/keit...ow/eltax07.jpg


(Sorry - haven't got time to sort them out, so I posted them all!)

Hint of Jamo Concert 8 in the shape of them...???

In article ,
Roger McDodger wrote:

"MINe 109" emitted :

Triangle.

http://www.triangle-fr.com/welcome-2002.htm

Yep.. never heard of them. Any relation to Pink Triangle?? Those guys
were pioneers. First gay high-end brand to market!!

A friend of mine traded in M-L Aeriuses for Triangle floorstanders. His
interest is classical, especially piano, so he can be tough on speakers.

I guess those other guys are out of business. Sounds kinda "South Park":
the gayest stereo ever! You could play your "Out Classics" collection on
it.

Stephen

On Wed, 27 Oct 2004 21:16:27 +0100, Roger McDodger
wrote:

"MINe 109" emitted :

Triangle.

http://www.triangle-fr.com/welcome-2002.htm

Yep.. never heard of them. Any relation to Pink Triangle?? Those guys
were pioneers. First gay high-end brand to market!!

No, these guys are French.
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

"Roger McDodger" wrote in message
...
"MINe 109" emitted :

http://www.triangle-fr.com/welcome-2002.htm

Yep.. never heard of them. Any relation to Pink Triangle?? Those guys
were pioneers. First gay high-end brand to market!!

A friend of mine traded in M-L Aeriuses for Triangle floorstanders. His
interest is classical, especially piano, so he can be tough on speakers.

Must be good..!

I guess those other guys are out of business. Sounds kinda "South Park":
the gayest stereo ever! You could play your "Out Classics" collection on
it.

Really. It's the gayest domestic hi-fi brand I've ever seen.


Spot the difference...

Santa Cruz lesbian and gay parade 1984.
http://www.glbthistory.org/photos/pinkflag.gif

Pink Triangle component.
http://www.kabrna.com/hifi/pacesetter.jpg


I had an LPT1 turntable and had dealing with the guys at Pink Triangle -
quite the nicest people I have ever dealt with. Sent me a speed controller
board and various other bits and pieces on a 'pay for what you keep, send
the rest back basis'. Incredible, this day and age.

I asked the bloke (damned if I can remember his name now) to confirm that
the 'Pink triangle' was connected to the pink triangles gays were forced to
wear in German WW2 concentration camps. He said it was *exactly* that - an
'homage' and rememberance...

I'm very sorry to see them go (the deck was a little cracker) but their last
ss amp killed them off - no market for such expensive 'esoterica' at that
time. Just goes to confirm 'it ain't what you do or the way that you do it
but the *timing* of when you do it'.....