In order to get an audible variation with typical cables I was
intending to direct drive electrostatic speakers. Obviously the
intention was to create significant differences in level across the
audible band but this is 'cheating'? (Actually I am not sure I would
want to mess with something potentially lethal for only GBP 1000).

Matching the levels across the audible band (20-20kHz?) is a pretty
severe precondition. Can I choose the source as well as the amplifier
and speakers?

I think I reused the same connectors for the headphone extension cable, they
certainly weren't anything special, it was the cables that made the
difference. I didn't need fancy wires to get a better sound, just shorter
ones with individual unscreened wires loosely spot tied instead of those
horrible sprung coil leads.

I don't believe a competition would have any merit at all as I'm convinced
most listeners don't listen properly and no offence but how do I know you
aren't in that category? Sorry, but listening is a skill that I'm willing
to teach to anyone with an open mind but only on my system which is far from
perfect, but has been tweaked over the years to give its best and I know it
inside out.

In article ,
Stewart Pinkerton wrote:
If you can demonstrate an ability to hear 'cable sound'
under level-matched blind conditions, I'll give you £1,000.

Can the subject choose the amplifier and speakers?

Yes, the only pre-condition is that the levels match across the audio
band. This is isn't a trick of any kind, it's just to stop someone
introducing say 20 feet of 40AWG wire, or a big series inductor, to
win the bet on a 'cheat'.

Well, of course, you *could* allow them to specify the amp - Naim - and
you the speakers. Electrostatics. And watch the smoke come out of the Naim
with basic cable. ;-)

--
*Red meat is not bad for you. Fuzzy green meat is bad for you.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
SteveB sbrads@nildramDOTcoDOTuk wrote:
I think I reused the same connectors for the headphone extension cable,
they certainly weren't anything special, it was the cables that made
the difference. I didn't need fancy wires to get a better sound, just
shorter ones with individual unscreened wires loosely spot tied instead
of those horrible sprung coil leads.

You don't need screened wire for headphones anyway - they're a high level
low impedance device, just like a speaker. Something like four core
burglar alarm cable at pennies a metre will do just fine.

--
*I'm pretty sure that sex is better than logic, but I can't prove it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

You don't need screened wire for headphones anyway - they're a high level
low impedance device, just like a speaker. Something like four core
burglar alarm cable at pennies a metre will do just fine.

Yeah, but you'd like something nice and flexible, and something that
doesn't fail if bent and flexed a lot.

Sennheiser used to use steel wire in their headphones. Kinda scary, I always
imagined those cabled being used to garrotte someone.


Martin
--
M.A.Poyser Tel.: 07967 110890
Manchester, U.K. http://www.livejournal.com/userinfo.bml?user=fleetie

On 30 May 2005 09:06:11 -0700, "andy" wrote:

In order to get an audible variation with typical cables I was
intending to direct drive electrostatic speakers. Obviously the
intention was to create significant differences in level across the
audible band but this is 'cheating'? (Actually I am not sure I would
want to mess with something potentially lethal for only GBP 1000).

Sure it's cheating, since easily replicable level changes are never
what is claimed for 'audiophile' cables.

Matching the levels across the audible band (20-20kHz?) is a pretty
severe precondition.

Not really, unless you are trying to pull a fast one. When did you
ever see $1,000 a foot cable claim that it had a different FR from
zipcord?

Can I choose the source as well as the amplifier
and speakers?

Absolutely.
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

On Mon, 30 May 2005 18:11:29 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Stewart Pinkerton wrote:
If you can demonstrate an ability to hear 'cable sound'
under level-matched blind conditions, I'll give you £1,000.

Can the subject choose the amplifier and speakers?

Yes, the only pre-condition is that the levels match across the audio
band. This is isn't a trick of any kind, it's just to stop someone
introducing say 20 feet of 40AWG wire, or a big series inductor, to
win the bet on a 'cheat'.

Well, of course, you *could* allow them to specify the amp - Naim - and
you the speakers. Electrostatics. And watch the smoke come out of the Naim
with basic cable. ;-)

Aah, you've been around this game for a while, haven't you? :-)

--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

On Mon, 30 May 2005 17:46:08 +0100, "SteveB"
sbrads@nildramDOTcoDOTuk wrote:

I think I reused the same connectors for the headphone extension cable, they
certainly weren't anything special, it was the cables that made the
difference. I didn't need fancy wires to get a better sound, just shorter
ones with individual unscreened wires loosely spot tied instead of those
horrible sprung coil leads.

I don't believe a competition would have any merit at all as I'm convinced
most listeners don't listen properly and no offence but how do I know you
aren't in that category?

It's not a competition, it's just *you* backing up your bull**** and
picking up an easy £1,000 if these differences are really 'night and
day', like you claim they are. Or even audible at all, to *you*, in
your own system, in your own time, and with your own choice of music.

Sorry, but listening is a skill that I'm willing
to teach to anyone with an open mind but only on my system which is far from
perfect, but has been tweaked over the years to give its best and I know it
inside out.

Yeah, right, asshole...................

You are free to use your own system and your own choice of music, the
only precondition is that the cables have the same FR over the audio
band. I've yet to see any 'audiophile' cable that claimed any FR
difference, so that shouldn't be a problem, should it? :-)
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

Come off it, I can't see there being any problem with me being able to hear
differences, but you would just say there's no difference. Perhaps people's
hearing is different in ways we can't describe, it would be unprovable,
which is why there's no way of resolving debates about the existence or not
of 'cable sound'.

As an electronics engineer mainly working on switch mode power supplies
running between frequencies of 10kHz and 2 MHz, I can see scope waveforms or
spectrum analysis change dramatically with cable lengths of 2 inches or
copper track changes of a few mm, so 4 metres of audio cable has a lot of
potential with all that nasty music stuff flying around but music's 'jumbled
mess' just doesn't lend itself to easy analytical observation, that's what
our ears are for.



"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...

Yeah, right, asshole...................

You are free to use your own system and your own choice of music, the
only precondition is that the cables have the same FR over the audio
band. I've yet to see any 'audiophile' cable that claimed any FR
difference, so that shouldn't be a problem, should it? :-)
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

In article ,
Fleetie wrote:
You don't need screened wire for headphones anyway - they're a high
level low impedance device, just like a speaker. Something like four
core burglar alarm cable at pennies a metre will do just fine.

Yeah, but you'd like something nice and flexible, and something that
doesn't fail if bent and flexed a lot.

Burglar alarm cable is multi-strand, and at least as flexible as most
normal cables - unless of the textile cored types.

--
*Never miss a good chance to shut up *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.