I don't think anyone said anything about that cable - isn't it the speaker
cables which are being compared? The relevance of the DAC is the quality of
the source isn't it?

Mark

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...

"Glenn Richards" wrote in message
...
Mark R Penn wrote:


I then sent the digital output of the Technics player into an Arcam Black
Box 50 offboard DAC, and repeated the experiment.

This time there WAS a quite dramatic improvement in the sound each time
you went up the scale. Tighter and deeper bass, better projection and
soundstaging, more detail.

Now this I DO take issue with. The data that goes between player and DAC
is EXACTLY the same regardless of cable. In fact, I have done an
experiment where I used literally a short bit if wet salty string between
CD player and DAC, and the decoded audio was identical to using a
correctly matched 75 ohm cable. S-PDIF and AES/EBU is extremely rugged and
will withstand a lot of abuse. Cable-induced jitter could be an issue with
an inferior DAC that doesn't reclock the data adequately, and this may be
the case with the Arcam unit, I don't know the details of their receivers,
but even with a poor DAC receiver, whilst there may be a difference
between a good 75 ohm cable and something very inferior (very poor
impedance match) there would be negligible difference between two 75 ohm
cables of normal domestic lengths.

S.

Not sure I understand your reply:-

I understood Glen Richards to say that he changed the interconnects between
CD player and DAC and heard a difference. My contention is that there cannot
be a difference.

S.


"Mark R Penn" wrote in message
...
I don't think anyone said anything about that cable - isn't it the speaker
cables which are being compared? The relevance of the DAC is the quality of
the source isn't it?

Mark

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...

"Glenn Richards" wrote in message
...
Mark R Penn wrote:


I then sent the digital output of the Technics player into an Arcam
Black Box 50 offboard DAC, and repeated the experiment.

This time there WAS a quite dramatic improvement in the sound each time
you went up the scale. Tighter and deeper bass, better projection and
soundstaging, more detail.

Now this I DO take issue with. The data that goes between player and DAC
is EXACTLY the same regardless of cable. In fact, I have done an
experiment where I used literally a short bit if wet salty string between
CD player and DAC, and the decoded audio was identical to using a
correctly matched 75 ohm cable. S-PDIF and AES/EBU is extremely rugged
and will withstand a lot of abuse. Cable-induced jitter could be an issue
with an inferior DAC that doesn't reclock the data adequately, and this
may be the case with the Arcam unit, I don't know the details of their
receivers, but even with a poor DAC receiver, whilst there may be a
difference between a good 75 ohm cable and something very inferior (very
poor impedance match) there would be negligible difference between two 75
ohm cables of normal domestic lengths.

S.

Well I thought he was talking about speaker cables using different quality
sources to see if the quality of the source made any difference to the
"sensitivity" of the speaker cables, but reading it again, you could be
right. If you are, then I'd agree that a digital signal is a digital signal
is a digital signal, and it would be very difficult if not impossible to
degrade it using cables.

Mark

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
Not sure I understand your reply:-

I understood Glen Richards to say that he changed the interconnects
between CD player and DAC and heard a difference. My contention is that
there cannot be a difference.

S.


"Mark R Penn" wrote in message
...
I don't think anyone said anything about that cable - isn't it the speaker
cables which are being compared? The relevance of the DAC is the quality
of the source isn't it?

Mark

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...

"Glenn Richards" wrote in message
...
Mark R Penn wrote:


I then sent the digital output of the Technics player into an Arcam
Black Box 50 offboard DAC, and repeated the experiment.

This time there WAS a quite dramatic improvement in the sound each time
you went up the scale. Tighter and deeper bass, better projection and
soundstaging, more detail.

Now this I DO take issue with. The data that goes between player and DAC
is EXACTLY the same regardless of cable. In fact, I have done an
experiment where I used literally a short bit if wet salty string
between CD player and DAC, and the decoded audio was identical to using
a correctly matched 75 ohm cable. S-PDIF and AES/EBU is extremely rugged
and will withstand a lot of abuse. Cable-induced jitter could be an
issue with an inferior DAC that doesn't reclock the data adequately, and
this may be the case with the Arcam unit, I don't know the details of
their receivers, but even with a poor DAC receiver, whilst there may be
a difference between a good 75 ohm cable and something very inferior
(very poor impedance match) there would be negligible difference between
two 75 ohm cables of normal domestic lengths.

S.

Serge Auckland wrote:

I understood Glen Richards to say that he changed the interconnects
between CD player and DAC and heard a difference. My contention is
that there cannot be a difference.

growl I wish people would spell my name right! :-P

I was changing interconnects between the DAC and amp (and previously the
CD player and amp when using the CD player's onboard DAC), not the CD
and DAC. That will make virtually no difference.

I know someone who actually had the CD player hooked up to the amp (AV
amp with on-board DAC) using a bit of bell wire with a phono plug on
each end. It sounded fine... until someone turned a fluorescent light on
or off, at which point the sound would drop out for half a second or
so... :-)

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation

Mark R Penn wrote:

I don't think anyone said anything about that cable - isn't it the
speaker cables which are being compared? The relevance of the DAC is
the quality of the source isn't it?

No, I was comparing interconnects, firstly between the CD player and
amp, then between the DAC and amp. More than one person has incorrectly
assumed that I was talking about the cable between the CD player and DAC
(if you must know it was a Toslink, the Technics player only has an
optical out).

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation