The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

Those of you with a predilection for copious amounts of glass and iron in
your amplifiers go scrute this site thoroughly:

http://www.sacthailand.com/


See the fabulous range of choice - 300Bs and 2A3s in particular and tell me
there's no demand for these seriously *broken* amps....???


Then see the 'Swing 32' and 'Swing 40' speakers and tell me they *ain't*
Jerichos:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/fostexfe206e/fostex.htm

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/L1070577.JPG

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/L1070580.JPG

:-)

(Serious valve freaks note the Ulyanov GM-70s, btw....)

And finally, just for a laff, make your way to the Kiwame resistor page and
clock the nice Fluke Multimeter and tell me it ain't *identical* (apart from
the yellow case) from my trusty old Maplins Pro4 meter:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Meter.JPG

:-)

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

Those of you with a predilection for copious amounts of glass and iron in
your amplifiers go scrute this site thoroughly:

http://www.sacthailand.com/


See the fabulous range of choice - 300Bs and 2A3s in particular and tell
me there's no demand for these seriously *broken* amps....???


Then see the 'Swing 32' and 'Swing 40' speakers and tell me they *ain't*
Jerichos:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/fostexfe206e/fostex.htm

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/L1070577.JPG

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/L1070580.JPG

:-)

(Serious valve freaks note the Ulyanov GM-70s, btw....)

And finally, just for a laff, make your way to the Kiwame resistor page
and clock the nice Fluke Multimeter and tell me it ain't *identical*
(apart from the yellow case) from my trusty old Maplins Pro4 meter:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Meter.JPG

:-)


Keith, congratulations:- An audio-relevant post on this ng.......

I don't think anyone has suggested there isn't a demand for these types of
amps, but then these things go in fashions. It certains avoids the
manufacturer having to worry that their products will meet tight
specs........

One oddity I've noticed. On the SILK attenuator pages, they say of
conventional resistor attenuators "That's why at high attenuation level (low
signal out, low listening level) the bandwidth of such volume control is
very poor and the bandwidth is not constant over any switch position."

This is only relevant if using very long high-capacitance cables. If using
cables of normal capacitance, and of normal domestic lengths, it has no
relevance as the bandwidth is already well in excess of the audio bandwidth.
Although I think a multi-tapped transformer as an attenuator is a bit of
overkill, it is a theoretically sound solution as the output impedance will
reduce as the attenuation increases. Pity they couldn't have 23 separate
secondaries, and keep the whole thing balanced input to output. Now that
*would* have given them a winding challenge!


They are AudioNote distributors..... nuff said....

As to the Maplins meter, there is a whole raft of Chinese OEM product
available for badging. I can't see why Fluke shouldn't do it like Maplins.
Going back a few years, before China became the manufacturing centre of the
World, thre was a magazine called JEI, the journal of the Japanese
Electronics Industry. In there you could find almost anything you wanted to
badge, provided you bought enough of them. I was particularly amused to see
several of the pick-up arms and cartridges sold by turntable manufacturers
as their standard product in the JEI.

Anyway, the SAC stuff looks nice, and if you like that sort of thing, I'm
sure it will give pleasure.

S.

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

Those of you with a predilection for copious amounts of glass and iron in
your amplifiers go scrute this site thoroughly:

http://www.sacthailand.com/


See the fabulous range of choice - 300Bs and 2A3s in particular and tell
me there's no demand for these seriously *broken* amps....???


Keith. This is something that has been puzzling me for a very long time.
My local dealer tells me that the interest in single-ended is unprecidented.
and that second hand quality valve PP amps, particularly Quad, Radford and
McIntosh are especially "hot" items.

What does that tell us????

Iain

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

Regarding attenuators, I've been looking at alternatives for tube
equipment. As I see it:
- autoformer attenuators need such low impedence in that you're looking
at big caps before them to stop the DC. So anything you gain on the
autoformer you lose on the cap. I use russian teflon caps of 0.1uf
value, so I'm not keen on large multiples of them. I'm OK with up to
..3, maybe .5 in extremis.
- true transformer attenuators are interesting - eliminates the cap if
it allows DC.
- On the other hand you could, in balanced mode, just use a PP output
stage for the line out, and position the volume control after that - no
cap.
- Cap before stepped attenuator is what I use right now. It works, and
sounds good with teflon caps. My line stage is balanced, so I use a
shunt attenuator between legs, which in the present case is 47K shunt
with two series resistors of 22K before it, one in each leg. So the
resistance in the stepped attenuator isn't exactly constant.
- for convenience of input between SE and balanced, the next way I'm
going to build is integrated mono amps with stepped attenuator after
the first valve stage. this means I can use the same shunt attenuator,
but I can accept input as SE or balanced, depending on whether or not I
earth the second grid of the input pair.
Thoughts and ideas? Andy

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

"Serge Auckland" wrote


Keith, congratulations:- An audio-relevant post on this ng.......


Once in a while I manage to get one loosely on-topic....!! ;-)


I don't think anyone has suggested there isn't a demand for these types of
amps, but then these things go in fashions.


Possibly, but I think we're looking at decades for complete trend swings. My
guess is SE is back for a while now - especialli in the East.


It certains avoids the
manufacturer having to worry that their products will meet tight
specs........


Well, all I can say is that earlier this evening I was running the German PP
against one of the SETs and there's *no way* I'd pick the PP if it was an
'either or' situation....???



One oddity I've noticed. On the SILK attenuator pages, they say of
conventional resistor attenuators "That's why at high attenuation level
(low signal out, low listening level) the bandwidth of such volume control
is very poor and the bandwidth is not constant over any switch position."

This is only relevant if using very long high-capacitance cables. If using
cables of normal capacitance, and of normal domestic lengths, it has no
relevance as the bandwidth is already well in excess of the audio
bandwidth. Although I think a multi-tapped transformer as an attenuator is
a bit of overkill, it is a theoretically sound solution as the output
impedance will reduce as the attenuation increases. Pity they couldn't
have 23 separate secondaries, and keep the whole thing balanced input to
output. Now that *would* have given them a winding challenge!


I'm sure if there was enough of a potential market for them they would offer
them thus. I thought the Silk transformers at least *looked* the blx and the
website is very good with plenty of pictorial information - always a good
thing in my book!!



They are AudioNote distributors..... nuff said....


I have an 'efriend' who is a bit susceptible to AN stuff. I pointed out to
him the following, earlier this evening:

AN TT1 = Systemdek

AN Arm1/2/3 = Rega

AN IQ2 = Goldring

Then he was asking me about Linn, so I told him Linn Decks werre Ariston
ripoffs with Audio Technica arms and carts!

(I hope that wasn't too far from the truth!!)


As to the Maplins meter, there is a whole raft of Chinese OEM product
available for badging. I can't see why Fluke shouldn't do it like Maplins.

I bet my Maplins version was a lot cheaper than the Fluke!!


Going back a few years, before China became the manufacturing centre of
the World, thre was a magazine called JEI, the journal of the Japanese
Electronics Industry. In there you could find almost anything you wanted
to badge, provided you bought enough of them. I was particularly amused to
see several of the pick-up arms and cartridges sold by turntable
manufacturers as their standard product in the JEI.

:-)

See above re. 'Brand Name Bull****'...!!


Anyway, the SAC stuff looks nice, and if you like that sort of thing, I'm
sure it will give pleasure.


I thought the whole site was very appealing! - *Thailand* this one, don't
forget!!

(Scary innit?? :-)

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

"Andy Evans" wrote in message
oups.com...
The Silk stuff is nice, and the James as well.


And 'Custom Made To Order'!! If Pat Turner sees this site he'll have a fit!!
:-)

Did you see also:

"
SACThailand presents

UDC400 Class-D power amplifier with 200 watt RMS/CH"...???

I tell ya, these buggers have only just *started* to take the ****!! :-)


but all this fixation on
300b amps tends to lose the plot a bit. So as to sell an amp as a "DHT
amp" what's being done is to plonk the 300b or sometimes 2a3 or
sometimes 845 into the output and then fill the input stages with
mediocre 9 pin triodes - 12AU7, 12AT7, 12AX7 and the like. If you're
lucky you get a 5687 or a 6SN7. But when we take into account the fact
that the first two stages have a strong influence on the final sound,
it makes just as much sense to start with a 26 DHT - that's what I've
done and the effect is considerably more than I expected. Even better,
for a driver use a 46 or a 71A. While everyone is thinking "300b" I'm
quietly buying up some DHTs before they're too expensive - they sure
are going up in price, driven partly by the old radio collectors who
need them to fire up their old sets. My 26 line stage is a real
challenge - I'm building some Ronan Regs for the filaments - a lot of
work but it's seriously worth it. One day, Keith, you'll discover 26
line stages and say "why didn't I use that before"!!!! Andy


:-)

OK, but I gotta say my (possible) future amp plans would probably be more
along the lines of a top-flight 300B with '****-off' iron.....

(Not only is that on the back burner, but the cooker ain't even switched
on!!)

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
...

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

Those of you with a predilection for copious amounts of glass and iron in
your amplifiers go scrute this site thoroughly:

http://www.sacthailand.com/


See the fabulous range of choice - 300Bs and 2A3s in particular and tell
me there's no demand for these seriously *broken* amps....???


Keith. This is something that has been puzzling me for a very long time.
My local dealer tells me that the interest in single-ended is
unprecidented.
and that second hand quality valve PP amps, particularly Quad, Radford and
McIntosh are especially "hot" items.

What does that tell us????



Well, add that info to the *many* sites like the SAC Thailand site I
referenced and I would say the future's looking very bright for valves in
audio!!

Valves or SS, the better legacy 'names' are commanding big money everywhere
(as your dealer is telling you and as the two Sugdens I was watching on eBay
told me) and I suspect you could easily sell empty cardboard boxes with the
names Tannoy or Lowther on them these days! But I hesitate to suggest why
there is great interest in SE - obviously it could be a 'sound quality'
thing (as it is for me) but there's no escaping the increased publicity and
much easier availability of SET amps will have some effect?

(One thing's for certain - they won't be buying them on the basis of spec
sheets, as so many here will tell you!! :-)

I think it's all very healthy - a number of the people I 'speak to' who are
getting (or have just got) valve amps are quite young, so it's not a
'nostalgia thing' for them and, if it is simply a question of free choice
falling in favour of valves, then all I can safely say is 'Well, it ain't
just me!'!!

:-)

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

OK, but I gotta say my (possible) future amp plans would probably be
more along the lines of a top-flight 300B with '****-off' iron.....

This is what I'm saying - you're thinking the end of the chain rather
than the start - everything goes through the input! You're amp is
ultimately never going to be better than the first two stages - put
ECC**s in it and its an ECC** amp.

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

"Andy Evans" wrote in message
oups.com...
OK, but I gotta say my (possible) future amp plans would probably be
more along the lines of a top-flight 300B with '****-off' iron.....

This is what I'm saying - you're thinking the end of the chain rather
than the start - everything goes through the input! You're amp is
ultimately never going to be better than the first two stages - put
ECC**s in it and its an ECC** amp.


Andy. I must agree with you that "octals have the magic"
but good results can be obtained with miniature nin-pin valves too.
I believe it is the topology that is most important.

People rattle on about "the dreadful high-gain minature pentode"
but seem to forget that both Peter Walker and Arthur Radford
understood its use in amplifiers which still perform exceptionally
well to this day.

I would think that when Keith begins to think about his top-flight
300B amp, miniature triodes will be conspicuous in their
absence:-)

Regards to all
--
Iain
www.kolumbus.fi/iain.churches

The things you see when ya go lookin'......
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Iain Churches" wrote in message
...


Keith. This is something that has been puzzling me for a very long time.
My local dealer tells me that the interest in single-ended is
unprecidented.
and that second hand quality valve PP amps, particularly Quad, Radford
and
McIntosh are especially "hot" items.

What does that tell us????

Well, add that info to the *many* sites like the SAC Thailand site I
referenced and I would say the future's looking very bright for valves in
audio!!

Valves or SS, the better legacy 'names' are commanding big money
everywhere (as your dealer is telling you and as the two Sugdens I was
watching on eBay told me) and I suspect you could easily sell empty
cardboard boxes with the names Tannoy or Lowther on them these days!

:-) Indeed. I am happy to have a workshop full of worthless
old retro crap:-))

But I hesitate to suggest why there is great interest in SE - obviously it
could be a 'sound quality' thing (as it is for me) but there's no escaping
the increased publicity and much easier availability of SET amps will have
some effect?

It seems that people find SET pleasing in a musical way.
However, I am not sure if the Chinese presence is a good or a bad
thing. These amps do perhaps give people an "entry level" perspective
into thermionic audio, but at the same time the modest performance
may give the wrong impression of what a valve amp can do.

Few valve amps from Asia are sold through dealers, and so have
very questionable warranty rights. The component and build quality
is not too good at the moment (it will take them a while to get it right)
so failures within the first year are commom. This too creates a negative
impression.

I think it's all very healthy - a number of the people I 'speak to' who
are getting (or have just got) valve amps are quite young, so it's not a
'nostalgia thing' for them and, if it is simply a question of free choice
falling in favour of valves, then all I can safely say is 'Well, it ain't
just me!'!!

There was a whole generation that missed out on thermionic audio.

The members of the music appreciation group to which I belong
(now twenty two strong) have thirteen valve power amps between
them. These people are very serious listeners, so a thermionic
presence well in excess of 50% speaks for itself.


Iain