"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

In article ,
Glenn Richards wrote:
Radio is the problem - the record producers figure that as you are
hopping through the channels, you will stop on the one that is the
loudest. A ridiculous concept, but it is what drives the music
industry right now.

Except the track that I posted the visualisations of was recorded in
1981, before such nonsense existed.

Not really. Think of Spector's 'Wall of Sound'. You could use most of his
stuff as line up tone. ;-)

Looks like the rot started in the early 90s (the first remaster was
1994), and by last year any sense of dynamics were lost in brick-wall
limiting...

Yes. But it seems to be what the 'public' wants. Look at the number of
those who complain about ads in TV sounding louder than the progs. The
only practical way round that is to process the whole lot to within an
inch of its life. And make it sound like Talk Radio.

--
*If a parsley farmer is sued, can they garnish his wages?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

In article ,
Glenn Richards wrote:
Anyway... what is it with "remasters" destroying the music like
that?
Makes them play *better* in noisy cars, offices, and elevators.

So why not have the compressor built into the playback device? Like
with, say, DRC on Dolby Digital? Where you can choose what dynamic range
to have.

DAB offers this facility.

--


Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

In article ,
Stewart Pinkerton wrote:
Actually, it started *way* back in the '50s, when radio stations
discovered compression, and a little ten kilowatt local radio station
could sound like the national networks on passing car radios, just by
cranking up the modulation.

We didn't have local radio stations in the '50s.

--
*Xerox and Wurlitzer will merge to market reproductive organs.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...

Yes. But it seems to be what the 'public' wants. Look at the number of
those who complain about ads in TV sounding louder than the progs. The
only practical way round that is to process the whole lot to within an
inch of its life. And make it sound like Talk Radio.

That's nothing to do with dynamics, merely balance. The ads industry demands
impact so that's what the TV companies gives them. I certainly don't approve
of having my ears blasted when the ads come on, so as soon as they start,
the mute button is hit (if I can find the remote in the cushions of course).
It's a shame really, there are some quite good ads - better than a lot of
the other output.

Roy.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Stewart Pinkerton wrote:
Actually, it started *way* back in the '50s, when radio stations
discovered compression, and a little ten kilowatt local radio station
could sound like the national networks on passing car radios, just by
cranking up the modulation.

We didn't have local radio stations in the '50s.



;-)

And not one in a hundred cars had a radio - I remember stickers in
secondhand cars proudly proclaiming *Heater* back in the 50s.....

(I think Pinky was Googling American sites..... ;-)

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

Glenn Richards wrote:


And if you don't know the difference, does that mean I get to call *you*
an "ignorant ****wit", simply because you have gaps in your knowledge
OUTSIDE YOUR SPECIALIST FIELD?

You would have to be a dumb stupid prick like pinkerton and his
suck-puppets to be able to do so.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

In article ,
Roy roy wrote:
Yes. But it seems to be what the 'public' wants. Look at the number of
those who complain about ads in TV sounding louder than the progs. The
only practical way round that is to process the whole lot to within an
inch of its life. And make it sound like Talk Radio.

That's nothing to do with dynamics, merely balance.

Eh?

The ads industry demands impact so that's what the TV companies gives
them.

The TV companies don't make the ads - and the 'rules' say they must peak
to a maximum of 4dB below the maximum progs may peak to, on ITV 1 at
least, which they do.

I certainly don't approve of having my ears blasted when the ads
come on, so as soon as they start, the mute button is hit (if I can
find the remote in the cushions of course). It's a shame really, there
are some quite good ads - better than a lot of the other output.

Do you find that all DVDs, CDs, etc sound as loud as one another?

--
*How much deeper would the oceans be without sponges? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

In article ,
Keith G wrote:
We didn't have local radio stations in the '50s.

;-)

And not one in a hundred cars had a radio - I remember stickers in
secondhand cars proudly proclaiming *Heater* back in the 50s.....

Remember my father getting an HMV Radiomobile for his new Morris Oxford in
'56. And that was valve. ;-)

I wonder what it cost in today's money?

--
*When companies ship Styrofoam, what do they pack it in? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

"Glenn Richards" wrote in
message
Arny Krueger wrote:

Anyway... what is it with "remasters" destroying the
music like that?

Makes them play *better* in noisy cars, offices, and
elevators.

So why not have the compressor built into the playback
device? Like with, say, DRC on Dolby Digital? Where you
can choose what dynamic range to have.

Implementing a proper compressor is still not trivial, certainly not
something that would be added as a feature to a dirt-cheap radio or player.

When I'm in the car, at a volume setting of -36dB on the
head unit, the 1994 remaster sounds better than the 1981
original. But turn the volume up to -30dB (same perceived
loudness) and the original version sounds much better.

There you go!

Favorite consumer complaint - "Why do I have to adjust the volume when I
change from FM to the CD"

Although my car isn't terribly noisy (it's a 2003 Audi A4
Quattro 1.9TDI 130), so perhaps not a fair comparison.
80mph in it feels more like you're doing 40.

I have a remaster of Dire Straits "Brothers In Arms",
and it does actually sound better than the original
release.

Might be a remix.

No, because I borrowed the original CD off someone to
compare. The mixes are identical.

OK, its a remaster and the mastering engineer got things more to your liking
the second time around. Stuff happens.

The remaster is Super Bit Mapping, whatever that's
supposed to represent.

It's a methodology for obtaining bragging rights from some people who think
they are technically sophisticated. It does have a positive technical
effect, but the benefit gets washed out in just about any practical use.

Ditto with Paul Simon's "Graceland". But they're the
exceptions.

Buying remasters is at best a crap shoot.

These two sound good. Others... less so. For ABBA's
earlier recordings go for the remasters, they were "wall
of sound" anyway, and the remasters have quite effective
noise reduction. For their later recordings (certainly
1979 onwards) go for the Polydor/Polar originals.

If the recording was fully digital, generally don't touch
the remaster. Dire Straits and Paul Simon are the
exceptions. My copy of Genesis "Invisible Touch" and
Fleetwood Mac's "Tango In The Night" are the
non-remastered versions.

Most of what I have the time to listen to (still over a dozen hours a week)
is either live performances or recordings (both stereo and multitrack) of
the same. That means that I'm the recording engineer, I'm the mixdown
engineer and I'm the mastering engineer. It's nice to know who to blame and
have his ear for any and all complaints.

"Remastered" CDs - the truth
 

On Thu, 09 Mar 2006 09:17:55 +0000, Glenn Richards
wrote:

Stewart Pinkerton wrote:

AVOID LIKE THE PLAGUE if you need *technical* advice!!!

FFS... I do *IT* consultancy, not audio.

Oh c'mon, you're a one-man band installing boxes and cables to
standard setups, using the supplied manuals.

Do you know what a "working
set" is? Do you know the optimum size of a swap partition on a BSD based
unix system? Do you know the difference between UFS, FFS and ext2fs? Or
the difference between zip, gzip and bzip2? Do you know how to configure
BIND, or squid, or samba? Just to give you a few examples.

More to the point, do you? So far, you have shown little sign of any
ability to tie your own shoelaces....

And if you don't know the difference, does that mean I get to call *you*
an "ignorant ****wit", simply because you have gaps in your knowledge
OUTSIDE YOUR SPECIALIST FIELD?

This is an audio forum, into which you blew making lots of wild
assertions with no substance to them. Turns out you know sod all about
audio, but you're such an arrogant prick that you won't admit it. In
my experience, that tends to translate right back to whatever field
people claim as their 'speciality'.

I do not design amplifiers, or CD players. I install and support IT
systems. The closest my work brings me to audio is plugging the audio
cable between the PC base unit and TFT monitor. Audio and hi-fi is an
interest, not a profession.

I don't make a living from it, therefore I
don't *need* to know all the ins and outs of how various technologies
like HDCD work.

Neither do I, but since I'm an engineer and audio is my hobby, I've
made a point of finding out these things.

(For the record, I'm actually very interested as to how
they work, but it doesn't have any bearing on what I do for a living.)

Doesn't seem to have had any bearing on how much you've chosen to
learn about it, either......

And if you continue to libel me and my company, I *will* be making a
complaint to your ISP.

**** off, asshole. What libel is there in pointing out that an
ignorant arrogant clown in one field, is likely to be an ignorant
arrogant clown in another field? My ISP will tell you just what
'Squirrel Solutions' can do with its resident nuts.

Now GROW UP, get back on your medication, and stop picking a fight with
everyone you come into contact with online that dares to have a
differing opinion to yours.

Opinions are fine, but when an ignorant clown like you makes absolute
claims and then ducks out of picking up an easy grand for proving his
claims in an independent test, my bull**** detector pegs the stop....

--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering