On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 16:00:36 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote:


"Wally" wrote in message
...
Don Pearce wrote:

And sound from an audio system differs from this... how?

In that there is an original to which it may aspire. ...

What does aspiration to an original have to do with getting the emotional
response you want from what you hear?


It is perfectly possible, as Keith has ably demonstrated, to put
together a system with totally different aspirations, but that is a
very idiosyncratic point of view and hence in the long run probably
unhelpful as a paradigm.

Why is it unhelpful?



Because it jars all those people on the cheap SS kit (playing the CDs
mentioned elsewhere) when they *know*, deep down, they ain't getting the
Full Monty from their audio kit, I suspect!! ;-)


Now, now. You're just being naughty! ;-)

d

--
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

Don Pearce wrote:

Who cares about what the musicians want to impart?

Ever been to a concert?

Yup. What's your point? Where does it say that the only way to get an
emotional response from music is to somehow imbibe whatever it is that the
musician seeks to impart?

Ever been a musician?


The root of the word is "Idios" which means the self. It means that
the view would be applicable that one person alone.

Which means 'applicable to one person alone'? Idios, or idiosyncratic?


WHy are you not getting this?

I know what it means - I'm asking you why you think it's unhelpful.


--
Wally
www.wally.myby.co.uk
Things are always clearer in the cold, post-upload light.

"Don Pearce" wrote

snipt 4 now

OK. What do we try next - different flavour ice cream??

:-)


Well, OK. Provided they are from Marine Ices opposite the Roundhouse.
They've been there about fifty years, make their own and they are
incomparable. Sorry, that means we can't compare them, I think ;-)


Don, I'm late for outta here - I'll get back later or tomorrow am.

I think the bottom line is you're going to hafta pootle up here with a
selection of those ices in a cold box and here my stuff for yourself. Then
you can report back to the group how crap it all is!! :-)


tugs waistband straight on underpants, flings back cloak


**Up, up and awaaaaayyyy**....!!

whoooossshhhh

:-))

On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 16:38:51 +0100, "Wally" wrote:

Don Pearce wrote:

Who cares about what the musicians want to impart?

Ever been to a concert?

Yup. What's your point? Where does it say that the only way to get an
emotional response from music is to somehow imbibe whatever it is that the
musician seeks to impart?


This is getting silly. If you really go to concerts with no interest
in emotional involvement with what the composer and musicians are
trying to say, then I'm sorry, but you may as well save your money.

Ever been a musician?


Yup. I played lead guitar in blues bands.


The root of the word is "Idios" which means the self. It means that
the view would be applicable that one person alone.

Which means 'applicable to one person alone'? Idios, or idiosyncratic?

Both - it is th "Idios" bit that carries that meaning.


WHy are you not getting this?

I know what it means - I'm asking you why you think it's unhelpful.

But you just said you didn't know what it means. Make your mind up.

d

--
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 16:42:50 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote:


"Don Pearce" wrote

snipt 4 now

OK. What do we try next - different flavour ice cream??

:-)


Well, OK. Provided they are from Marine Ices opposite the Roundhouse.
They've been there about fifty years, make their own and they are
incomparable. Sorry, that means we can't compare them, I think ;-)


Don, I'm late for outta here - I'll get back later or tomorrow am.

I think the bottom line is you're going to hafta pootle up here with a
selection of those ices in a cold box and here my stuff for yourself. Then
you can report back to the group how crap it all is!! :-)


tugs waistband straight on underpants, flings back cloak


**Up, up and awaaaaayyyy**....!!

whoooossshhhh

:-))


Now there's a thought; may well happen too. I'll have to check out the
temperature profile of cold boxes first.

d

--
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

Don Pearce wrote:

This is getting silly. If you really go to concerts with no interest
in emotional involvement with what the composer and musicians are
trying to say, then I'm sorry, but you may as well save your money.

Oh, I'm interested in emotional involvement, but any emotions I feel at a
concert, or when listening to reproduced music, are entirely my own. I don't
presume to be inside the heads of those that are creating the music, and I
don't see how they can be inside mine.


Ever been a musician?

Yup. I played lead guitar in blues bands.

Ever felt what the audience felt when you played something? I haven't. When
I play, I feel *my* emotions - and what, or how, I play changes in
accordance with those emotions - each feeds the other. If what I do triggers
the same emotional response in someone else, or if they get some other
response, what difference does it make to me?


Both - it is th "Idios" bit that carries that meaning.

So, you're saying that his idiosyncratic point of view is an unhelpful
paradigm because it applies to him, and him alone? If so, then what is his
"idiosyncratic point of view"?


--
Wally
www.wally.myby.co.uk
You're unique - just like everybody else.

On Sat, 29 Jul 2006 17:02:14 +0100, "Wally" wrote:

Don Pearce wrote:

This is getting silly. If you really go to concerts with no interest
in emotional involvement with what the composer and musicians are
trying to say, then I'm sorry, but you may as well save your money.

Oh, I'm interested in emotional involvement, but any emotions I feel at a
concert, or when listening to reproduced music, are entirely my own. I don't
presume to be inside the heads of those that are creating the music, and I
don't see how they can be inside mine.

The music is designed to stimulate emotional responses and the
musicians do their best to convey that.

Ever been a musician?

Yup. I played lead guitar in blues bands.

Ever felt what the audience felt when you played something? I haven't. When
I play, I feel *my* emotions - and what, or how, I play changes in
accordance with those emotions - each feeds the other. If what I do triggers
the same emotional response in someone else, or if they get some other
response, what difference does it make to me?

So you are quite happy to see the audience giggling during a sad song?
I think you need to be a bit more connected than that.


Both - it is th "Idios" bit that carries that meaning.

So, you're saying that his idiosyncratic point of view is an unhelpful
paradigm because it applies to him, and him alone? If so, then what is his
"idiosyncratic point of view"?

No, I've been round the circle once - I'm not up for another circuit.

d

--
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

In article ,
Wally wrote:
Then perhaps you'd use universally accepted technical terms when you
next describe the sound of your latest speaker/amplifier?

Why should he?

So that it has some meaning?

--
*I'm not your type. I'm not inflatable.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Why should he?

So that it has some meaning?

What makes you think it hasn't?


--
Wally
www.wally.myby.co.uk
Things are always clearer in the cold, post-upload light.

Don Pearce wrote:

Oh, I'm interested in emotional involvement, but any emotions I feel
at a concert, or when listening to reproduced music, are entirely my
own. I don't presume to be inside the heads of those that are
creating the music, and I don't see how they can be inside mine.

The music is designed to stimulate emotional responses and the
musicians do their best to convey that.

Good for them. Makes no difference to me. My emotional response will still
be mine, regardless of what the composer intended, or the musician tried to
convey (or even what the improvising musician is feeling as he plays).


So you are quite happy to see the audience giggling during a sad song?
I think you need to be a bit more connected than that.

My point is that, to play at your best, you have to play for yourself. The
musician knows better than anyone when he's in the groove - direct,
instantaneous feedback.


No, I've been round the circle once - I'm not up for another circuit.

I disagree with the notion that putting together a system with totally
different aspirations is an unhelpful paradigm. The aim isn't audiophonic
perfection for its own sake, but some sort of emotional response to music.
The 'accuracy' approach is one that people use to attain the said response,
and it works for many. However, it should be pretty obvious that, if Keith
gets the emotional thing he's after from his kit, then it follows that the
accuracy approach cannot be the only one.


--
Wally
www.wally.myby.co.uk
If it ain't broke, fix it until it is.