wrote in message
ps.com...

Keith G wrote:


Scott, I really wouldn't waste my life's breath arguing with Plowie - he
thinks he knows summat and wants to be my uncle and I won't let him is
how
it is....

You are right. especially now that a couple big jobs are about to start
up. I have a suggestion for you. Check out Stevehoffman.tv. This is
your kind of forum. friendly folks that actually have passion for music
and audio and a wealth of information when it comes to the sound
quality of the many LPs and CDs out there. I think I am done after
today with these losers. I walked away from rec.auio.opinion for the
same reason. Haven't looked at for a year. I'll bet that it's the same
people saying the same things. But i 'm not even going to check.



Don't blame you - the simple truth is Usenet's had its day and all the
groups I've ever looked into (in the past - I only subscribe to ukra) have
the same few sad ****s wanking out the same old **** over and over again!
And, tbh, I guess I'm getting a bit fed up of 'winding them up and setting
them off' - it's just too easy to do!

(I simply can't believe their *unending* capacity to type so much samey-samo
crap so many times over - it's *gotta* be driven by insecurity and
fear...!!??)

Thanks for the tip about the Stevehoffman.tv. forum! Ordinarily, I'm not all
that good with 'forums' as such - to fiddly to 'work' them mostly (or
*klugey* as Barmy Arny would have it... :-) and, apart from anything else,
they also usually have a few *stars* who get on everybody's tits as well!!
But with over 2 million posts and about 10 thousand members, it's certainly
a lot more going for it than this place! (Kinda shoots the 'small vinylist
minority' theories up the arse a tad, don't it??!! :-)




(The reason I'm sorry to see you and Don trading blows is that Don really
*does* know summat and he *can* be my uncle, despite being about 5 years
younger than me!! ;-)


If Don chooses to play nice I will too. Not that it matters. I'm done
with uk.rec.audio after today. Slapping aound meter readers gets boring
and I have a lot more on my plate. The nature of the business you know.
Things are about to get crazy. looks like they will be crazy for a
couple years, maybe four or five years.


OK. Hope it all goes nicely for you!! :-)

Arny Krueger wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com
Mr.T wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
I said that I can't distinguish between an LP and a
24/96 copy of that LP

It's nice of you to finally admit there is no problem
with digital recording then.

Finally? Did you "finally" pull your head out of your ass?


All we need to know now is whether you think you can
hear above 22
kHz, and why it is more important than the bottom octave
or so, where vinyl fails miserably. After all the only
other difference for 24/96 over CD is dynamic range
beyond 96dB. It's obviously NOT that! :-)


Prove it.

It is your claim to prove, Scott.

You seem to be confused Arny. Mr.T claimed the following.
"All we need to know now is whether you think you can hear above 22
kHz, and why it is more important than the bottom octave or so, where
vinyl fails miserably. After all the only other difference for 24/96
over CD is dynamic range beyond 96dB. It's obviously NOT that! :-)"

His claim his burden of proof.

Scott

Don Pearce wrote:
On 1 Nov 2006 08:40:42 -0800, wrote:

It was a loaded question. Like do you still beat your wife? The point
is they are independent. You have been trying to assert they are
related.

So at the end of all this, which are they, mutually exclusive or
independent? Just so I know.

Hey Don, how are you doing today? Independent. not mutually exclusive.




See Kieth, I am being nice to Don.


Scott

wrote in message
oups.com...

Arny Krueger wrote:
"Keith G" wrote in message


What kills me is these clowns don't seem to realise there
is no small degree of *engineering* in vinyl and vinyl
playback systems...

The opposite is true. I know from personal experience a great deal about
the
engineering that is required in vinyl production and playback systems.
It's
all a kluge with obvious limitations in terms of noise and distortion.


:-)

Ooh! Another chance to that *kluge* again - how sweet!! :-)

(Arny's a fully paid-up member of the Creeps Club* and now resides in my
****ter with all his crap scraped off my newsreader, so I couldn't look at
it and *admire* it again....!! :-)


Here's a movie line I love (5th Element): "She *dove* off....!!"

('Dove' as in 'stove' - fekkin' priceless, innit? :-)



Do tell us about your experience with actually recording and mastering
LPs.



Leave him alone, Scott - he's way past that bit in The Caine Mutiny where
Bogey sits rattling his balls with his mind gone...

(Just to keep with the *movie theme*...!!)



* Better make that *Kreeps Klub* in Kruger's Kase - or he'll think it's a
Kluge.....!!! :-))


Ooh, dear - YHFL, do you not..??!!

:-))

In article .com,
wrote:
The opposite is true. I know from personal experience a great deal
about the engineering that is required in vinyl production and
playback systems. It's all a kluge with obvious limitations in terms
of noise and distortion.

Do tell us about your experience with actually recording and mastering
LPs.

Do tell us about yours?

--
*Why are a wise man and a wise guy opposites? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

wrote in message
ups.com


But here you are claiming that the real top
flight pros don't know what they are listening to.

Surprise, surprise, people with commercial axes to grind favoring vinyl,
favor vinyl.

Arny went after James Boyk
infering that he has an anti digital agenda.

Boyk has a number of interesting agendas including one against stranded
wire. Seriously, he claims some kind of loss of musicality when stranded
wire is used to carry audio signals. I'm glad that I don't cite him as an
authority!

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...32f66b7ce31d49

"Good question, especially given that solid-core sounds better."

http://groups.google.com/group/rec.a...4382f8cafebd67

"I suggested using a wire identical to one of them *but* non-stranded. He
tried it
and found it far better than any others he'd tried."

But the fact
is he is an actual pro and has a fantastic ear.

Proof?

I suspect he's approaching or has reached an age where his hearing apparatus
is slowling slip-slip sliding away. He was artist-in-residence for 30 years
which puts him up around 60+.

I can
assure you he knows far better than you what he is
listening to yet he finds the vinyl more faithful to the
original than the CD of his recording made for the
purpose of comparison.

See Boyk's former comments about wire. There's one word for this sort of
thing: "Hysterical".

In article . com,
wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Arny Krueger wrote:
I wonder how Scott would feel if someone who had as little knowlege
of cosmetology as he has of audio would try to tell him how to do
his job. After all, cosmetology is all just about aesthetics, right?
Anybody with a good eye for aesthetics should be able to do his job
better than Scott does, right?

Happens all the time here in low budget TV. Every woman does her own
makeup - so why is it different just because a camera is involved? The
same happens with other skills - after all most now shoot holiday
movies. And when those skills are dispensed with to be replaced by
amateurs it doesn't half show.

It doesn't? I think quite the opposite is true. Audiences are getting
more and more sophisticated.

I suppose I'm guilty of using a local expression. 'Doesn't half' means
'does'.

Maybe with the sort of production you are talking about the expectations
just aren't very high.

I don't see how you can have high expectations with a low budget
production. Very few are willing to work for free - and those that do
fools.


But only possibly to those with the skills to notice the difference.
As is apparently the case with those who find vinyl more 'realistic'
than CD. They just don't know what they're listening to.

Now that is an interesting claim. Arny just went on about how I might
feel about non-pros telling me how to do my job etc. But here you are
claiming that the real top flight pros don't know what they are
listening to. Can anyone else see the irony? Arny went after James Boyk
infering that he has an anti digital agenda. But the fact is he is an
actual pro and has a fantastic ear. I can assure you he knows far better
than you what he is listening to yet he finds the vinyl more faithful to
the original than the CD of his recording made for the purpose of
comparison.
You can 'assure' me of anything. Doesn't make it anymore true. The way
Boyk goes about things is designed to prove his theories. Equally easy to
do the opposite.
He listens to live music on a daily basis. He teaches other
musicians how to listen to sound! He has access to the the original
master and had access to the original mic feed of his recordings. So,
unlike you, he had an actual reference to make his claims.

Err, how do you know what I do (did) and do not have access to?

And it isn't just him. You will find a number of *top industry pros*
that have the same preference for vinyl.

And you'll find even more *top industry pros* who don't. Oh - and simply
having a preference for something - work wise - doesn't make it the most
'realistic'. Look at the number of top photographers who work in B&W.

So maybe it is you who doesn't know what he is listening to.

Oh but I do.

To me, you are simply one of those who prefers listening to vinyl. I've no
argument with that - or with anyone else who holds that view. Only when
they start talking about 'realism'. Which is simply the bull**** they've
convinced themselves to believe for whatever reason.

--
*Laugh alone and the world thinks you're an idiot.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

wrote in message
ups.com
Arny Krueger wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com
Mr.T wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

Now where is your proof to the contrary?

I see no proof in the link you have quoted?

It's an email address Einstien not a link. wow.

Fear not, we were able to circumvent your inability to
provide a proper cite, Scott.

Apparently not.

Apparently so, your denials notwithstanding.

The point of offering an email address is
so that one can send an inquiry via email.

No need to when he has enough relevant details on his web site as I showed
in another post.


The
information is not at Boyk's website but with Boyk
himself.

Wrong, there's enough info on the web site to suffice.

In article ,
Keith G wrote:
Don't blame you - the simple truth is Usenet's had its day and all the
groups I've ever looked into (in the past - I only subscribe to ukra)
have the same few sad ****s wanking out the same old **** over and over
again!

You can put that mirror down now.

--
*Reality is the illusion that occurs due to the lack of alcohol *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

wrote in message
ups.com
Arny Krueger wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com
Mr.T wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
I said that I can't distinguish between an LP and a
24/96 copy of that LP

It's nice of you to finally admit there is no problem
with digital recording then.

Finally? Did you "finally" pull your head out of your
ass?


All we need to know now is whether you think you can
hear above 22
kHz, and why it is more important than the bottom
octave or so, where vinyl fails miserably. After all
the only other difference for 24/96 over CD is dynamic
range beyond 96dB. It's obviously NOT that! :-)


Prove it.

It is your claim to prove, Scott.

You seem to be confused Arny. Mr.T claimed the following.
"All we need to know now is whether you think you can
hear above 22 kHz, and why it is more important than the
bottom octave or so, where vinyl fails miserably. After
all the only other difference for 24/96 over CD is
dynamic range beyond 96dB. It's obviously NOT that! :-)"

His claim his burden of proof.


Not at all Scott. His comments were based on earlier claims that you
apparently now don't want to stand behind.