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What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 12:20:43 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:04:04 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: OK, here's one for you and for 'someone else' to throw rocks at: Last week, quite out of the blue, I bumped into an old friend I hadn't seen for about TWENTY years!! And, yes, he lives only a couple of miles from here, which would have been a tragedy (as we have been here ourselves for getting for 10 years) *if* we had a lot more in common than we appear now to do!! (??) (I'm getting a little too old for ****-ups and skirt-chasing now!! ;-) Naturally, he got a demo of my kit (for at least 20 seconds - no interest in it whatsoever) of the track posted above when I got the standard 'Woah, that's nice and clear!' immediate reaction and then 'Here's comes a bit of 'bottom end!' a few moments later. Then switch off and no further reference to it. That is exactly the response I would expect. The initial reaction to any system with an exaggeration of any particular part of the frequency range is fairly predictable. That is well known to recording engineers who use the fact to inject the right mood into their product. No.... The truth is the speakers are so *clear and direct* it's quite breathtaking. They are 'stunning' in a totally *non spectacular* way - ie they are so comfortable to listen to.... Indicate when you have got/heard that track and I'll post it again recorded from my Ruarks a little later on, for comparison.... Bring 'em on! OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Now, before you tell me there's no bass on the Ruark track either - when I started it off I went over to the back door for a fag (as I do) and rested my elbow on the (patio door) pull handle. At about 1 minute in, the fekking door started thrumming and I was getting the bass through my elbow as well as hearing it!! (The Paladins quote 38 Hz at the bottom end...) As it's ****ing with rain here (on and off) I don't feel too guilty about this sort of dicking around - while I'm set up on the Ruarks what else would you rather hear? Gimme a slot and I'll see what I've got that best fits it! (Sorry if it's a bit sad, but I enjoy it and it's good practice for me!! ;-) Now, if nothing else, the recordings *look* a lot better these days, don't they?? :-) Plenty of bass on the Ruarks; in fact for smoothness and generally nice sound they have it by a mile from the other two. There is a series of low bass notes at about 35Hz. They are there quite nicely on the Ruarks, while on the other two they have simply vanished, although there is something there at 70Hz that seems to have replaced them For me that is a non-contest. The Ruarks have it by miles. The recordings are much better, too :-) d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
Don Pearce wrote:
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 12:20:43 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:04:04 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: OK, here's one for you and for 'someone else' to throw rocks at: Last week, quite out of the blue, I bumped into an old friend I hadn't seen for about TWENTY years!! And, yes, he lives only a couple of miles from here, which would have been a tragedy (as we have been here ourselves for getting for 10 years) *if* we had a lot more in common than we appear now to do!! (??) (I'm getting a little too old for ****-ups and skirt-chasing now!! ;-) Naturally, he got a demo of my kit (for at least 20 seconds - no interest in it whatsoever) of the track posted above when I got the standard 'Woah, that's nice and clear!' immediate reaction and then 'Here's comes a bit of 'bottom end!' a few moments later. Then switch off and no further reference to it. That is exactly the response I would expect. The initial reaction to any system with an exaggeration of any particular part of the frequency range is fairly predictable. That is well known to recording engineers who use the fact to inject the right mood into their product. No.... The truth is the speakers are so *clear and direct* it's quite breathtaking. They are 'stunning' in a totally *non spectacular* way - ie they are so comfortable to listen to.... Indicate when you have got/heard that track and I'll post it again recorded from my Ruarks a little later on, for comparison.... Bring 'em on! OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Now, before you tell me there's no bass on the Ruark track either - when I started it off I went over to the back door for a fag (as I do) and rested my elbow on the (patio door) pull handle. At about 1 minute in, the fekking door started thrumming and I was getting the bass through my elbow as well as hearing it!! (The Paladins quote 38 Hz at the bottom end...) As it's ****ing with rain here (on and off) I don't feel too guilty about this sort of dicking around - while I'm set up on the Ruarks what else would you rather hear? Gimme a slot and I'll see what I've got that best fits it! (Sorry if it's a bit sad, but I enjoy it and it's good practice for me!! ;-) Now, if nothing else, the recordings *look* a lot better these days, don't they?? :-) Plenty of bass on the Ruarks; in fact for smoothness and generally nice sound they have it by a mile from the other two. There is a series of low bass notes at about 35Hz. They are there quite nicely on the Ruarks, while on the other two they have simply vanished, although there is something there at 70Hz that seems to have replaced them For me that is a non-contest. The Ruarks have it by miles. The recordings are much better, too :-) d When I heard the Ruarks myself at Keith's, they were clearly better to my ears than the horns, much more what I'm used to. Not as "exciting" perhaps, but a lot less coloured, and with properly extended bass and good treble. S. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Keith G" wrote in message
OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Missing - track10 from the original source. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Missing - track10 from the original source. Here you go: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...0In%20Love.mp3 ....seein's as how ya arst so nice like.... (Straining my webspace to the limits here.....) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
My impression is that making a single driver speaker imposes such
demanding constraints on the design and use as to be rather limiting. But then my reaction is to prefer (phased array) electrostatics to cone-and-box speakers, anyway. JL Hi Jim. Yes, I agree about panel speakers - if I had more room I'd probably use Apogees. But, yes, I'm talking all sorts of compromises. First being a small speaker easy to locate (panels are wide and have to be away from walls) I try to get over cone-and-box problems with ultra stiff massy boxes. My front panel is a large thick aluminium U shape extrusion with the speaker unit bolted on it, and the sides (three layers MDF with damping beween) are then bolted to the sides of the U section. I just about get away with the frequency response - 40hz is there, and it goes up to 13k or so. The unit may well work better when it's not supplying the bass frequencies, but then I'd need a crossover and I am very wary of capacitors in the signal path - I really don't like them. I could go active - that would be a solution (though complex) - but I find I can live with the sound I have. It's not perfect but it's extremely clear and detailed and the tone is fine. I don't know what the term is for a single driver - coherent maybe? |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Don Pearce" wrote in message On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:22:47 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Also, what do you reckon to this little bugger: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...0656&rd=1&rd=1 Seems to be a convenient package. It looks neat. Self-noise is actually high enough to be of concern. For half the price I'd have a pair of Rhode NT1A, which I indeed already have. Quieter, and probably smoother. Hmm, my favourite supplier has them listed: http://www.nusystems.co.uk/product/R...A.Matched.Pair Very appealing - noted, bookmarked and *targetted*.... (So much stuff needed, so little money....!! :-( I have a mount for coincident micing that cost about $15. I got one in the 'flight case' with my 'factory pair' of SE1As.... http://www.nusystems.co.uk/product/S...ed.Stereo.Pair |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:16:43 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote: "Arny Krueger" wrote in message ... "Don Pearce" wrote in message On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:22:47 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Also, what do you reckon to this little bugger: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...0656&rd=1&rd=1 Seems to be a convenient package. It looks neat. Self-noise is actually high enough to be of concern. For half the price I'd have a pair of Rhode NT1A, which I indeed already have. Quieter, and probably smoother. Hmm, my favourite supplier has them listed: http://www.nusystems.co.uk/product/R...A.Matched.Pair Very appealing - noted, bookmarked and *targetted*.... (So much stuff needed, so little money....!! :-( Dolphin have them at £119 each. Forget matched pairs - they are all plenty well matched. d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote Plenty of bass on the Ruarks; in fact for smoothness and generally nice sound they have it by a mile from the other two. There is a series of low bass notes at about 35Hz. They are there quite nicely on the Ruarks, while on the other two they have simply vanished, although there is something there at 70Hz that seems to have replaced them For me that is a non-contest. The Ruarks have it by miles. Gor blimey, guvnah - yer could of knocked me dahn wiv a fevver!! I wuz *certain* you choose the others!! (Only kidding, of course!! :-) But let's get back on track here - it's the *treble* we're interested in, no-one's claimimg horns can match (or even compete) with speakers like the Paladins on bass!! What do say about the *treble*...??? (It's 'extremes' both ends that started this little lot off!!) Anyway, so what do I do now - drag the Ruarks back into my pokey little room (back to where I was 5 years ago) lose all my clarity and depth and start *wading* through the bass again...?? (Not to mention how they'll slop around hanging off my triodes.....!! ;-) The recordings are much better, too :-) Yes, I thought so - easier to control levels with proper pre's than on the computer only, as in the early days!! (I need all the encouragement I can get - there's one or two here got absolutely nothing better to do than hang around with their dicks out, waiting to give me a good *hosing*, it seems!! ;-) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message In article , Keith G wrote: Frankly, the numbers don't mean very much at all in the real world, other than to a designer or manufacturer - for example, the frequency range of a full orchestra is only about 40-14k and the *dink dink* 'Top C' on a piano is only about 4096 Hz with only weak (inaudible for most purposes) harmonics extending beyond 10 kHz.... If the harmonics were inaudible it would sound like a sine wave. So nothing like a piano at all. I'm amazed at you. You go on and on about the subtle differences you claim to hear then come up with rubbish like this... More to the point, is the lack of quality of reproduction that we get at high frequencies by single-way drivers. There are hard physical laws that say you can't have deep bass and high efficiency and small size at the same time. If you add good dynamic range, then things get that much more difficult. In a similar fashion, you can't have deep bass, extended treble, smooth response, and broad dispersion at the same time. I still remember doing some frequency response measurements on a "full range" JBL 15" driver in engineerings school in the middlee 1960s. Believe it or not, it had response at 13 KHz. But only on-axis. And only after a number of audible dips and peaks at lower frequencies. You could set fire to vintage JBLs (horn tweeter models?) and there's one or two around these parts would *still* buy them while they burned, but I'm not so sure about the new stuff....??? |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:16:43 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Arny Krueger" wrote in message m... "Don Pearce" wrote in message On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:22:47 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Also, what do you reckon to this little bugger: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...0656&rd=1&rd=1 Seems to be a convenient package. It looks neat. Self-noise is actually high enough to be of concern. For half the price I'd have a pair of Rhode NT1A, which I indeed already have. Quieter, and probably smoother. Hmm, my favourite supplier has them listed: http://www.nusystems.co.uk/product/R...A.Matched.Pair Very appealing - noted, bookmarked and *targetted*.... (So much stuff needed, so little money....!! :-( Dolphin have them at £119 each. OK - even better yet!! Forget matched pairs - they are all plenty well matched. The only thing that appeals to me with 'matched pairs' is you usually tend to get the shockmounts and wind thingies thrown in and all in a nice little flight case if you're lucky, from what I have seen...? Otherwise, I'm not bothered - although the Oktavas are not a pair and we know where that has led us, don't we...??? |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:42:23 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote Plenty of bass on the Ruarks; in fact for smoothness and generally nice sound they have it by a mile from the other two. There is a series of low bass notes at about 35Hz. They are there quite nicely on the Ruarks, while on the other two they have simply vanished, although there is something there at 70Hz that seems to have replaced them For me that is a non-contest. The Ruarks have it by miles. Gor blimey, guvnah - yer could of knocked me dahn wiv a fevver!! I wuz *certain* you choose the others!! (Only kidding, of course!! :-) But let's get back on track here - it's the *treble* we're interested in, no-one's claimimg horns can match (or even compete) with speakers like the Paladins on bass!! What do say about the *treble*...??? (It's 'extremes' both ends that started this little lot off!!) If it's treble we're talking about, god yes - get those Ruarks back in. They are smoother by miles than the horns. I know they will take some getting used to because you are used to mega brightness, but it will be worth the effort. The bass sounds nice too; I can actually hear it. Anyway, so what do I do now - drag the Ruarks back into my pokey little room (back to where I was 5 years ago) lose all my clarity and depth and start *wading* through the bass again...?? (Not to mention how they'll slop around hanging off my triodes.....!! ;-) You never know - we may even civilize you in that department too... The recordings are much better, too :-) Yes, I thought so - easier to control levels with proper pre's than on the computer only, as in the early days!! (I need all the encouragement I can get - there's one or two here got absolutely nothing better to do than hang around with their dicks out, waiting to give me a good *hosing*, it seems!! ;-) I won't lose too much sleep - I think you probably give as good as you get. Incidentally I've just ordered a pair of those NT1-A's for myself - they look very handy. d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Serge Auckland" wrote When I heard the Ruarks myself at Keith's, they were clearly better to my ears than the horns, much more what I'm used to. Not as "exciting" perhaps, but a lot less coloured, and with properly extended bass and good treble. You are not alone, others have made the same choice but the 'horns' have come on a bit since you were here - I finally gave up on the Jerichos only a few days ago and am settling on the (In)Fidelios with Lowther drivers for the time being. Lowthers themselves being a definite 'cut above' the drivers you heard also.... (The Pinkies still do sterling service on CD, the radio and TV... :-) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:48:02 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote: The only thing that appeals to me with 'matched pairs' is you usually tend to get the shockmounts and wind thingies thrown in and all in a nice little flight case if you're lucky, from what I have seen...? Otherwise, I'm not bothered - although the Oktavas are not a pair and we know where that has led us, don't we...??? Well, they were a mirrored pair. I think you can rest easy with Rode, though - they don't share the unfortunate reputation of the Oktavas - also they don't have transformers, which is where I'd put money the confusion happened. d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote Here's my frequency analysis of the Paladin and the other speaker (Lowther?). It scans the whole file, so it isn't just a snapshot. The difference is clear - top end as well as bass. http://81.174.169.10/odds/kspkr/paladin.gif http://81.174.169.10/odds/kspkr/other.gif OK, got those - thanks! Bass - yes, top end - yes maybe in the pix, no in real life I would say. Unless a harder, more 'brittle' bass is what is generally considered to be better? I'll play both the recordings back to back a bit later and see if I can get a clearer picture, but I don't think I would pick the Paladin's treble from what I've heard here....?? (Bear in mind, the Paladins are my *pick of the bunch* from the long stream of speakers that have been through here during the last few years and are definite keepers....) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:59:14 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote Here's my frequency analysis of the Paladin and the other speaker (Lowther?). It scans the whole file, so it isn't just a snapshot. The difference is clear - top end as well as bass. http://81.174.169.10/odds/kspkr/paladin.gif http://81.174.169.10/odds/kspkr/other.gif OK, got those - thanks! Bass - yes, top end - yes maybe in the pix, no in real life I would say. Unless a harder, more 'brittle' bass is what is generally considered to be better? Not sure what you mean - extending the bottom end will result in the opposite of brittle. d I'll play both the recordings back to back a bit later and see if I can get a clearer picture, but I don't think I would pick the Paladin's treble from what I've heard here....?? Do play 'em through the Paladins though - you won't hear the difference through the horns. (Bear in mind, the Paladins are my *pick of the bunch* from the long stream of speakers that have been through here during the last few years and are definite keepers....) Quite right. d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:48:02 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: The only thing that appeals to me with 'matched pairs' is you usually tend to get the shockmounts and wind thingies thrown in and all in a nice little flight case if you're lucky, from what I have seen...? Otherwise, I'm not bothered - although the Oktavas are not a pair and we know where that has led us, don't we...??? Well, they were a mirrored pair. I think you can rest easy with Rode, though - they don't share the unfortunate reputation of the Oktavas - also they don't have transformers, which is where I'd put money the confusion happened. I haven't been able to bring myself to butcher them yet (well, No. 63). Tbh, I see myself using them singly most often if the 'mono clart' thing works out, anyway - and I haven't been able to try that yet either!! I still like the sound from them very much though.... |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Keith G" wrote in message
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:16:43 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Don Pearce" wrote in message On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:22:47 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Also, what do you reckon to this little bugger: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...0656&rd=1&rd=1 Seems to be a convenient package. It looks neat. Self-noise is actually high enough to be of concern. For half the price I'd have a pair of Rhode NT1A, which I indeed already have. Quieter, and probably smoother. Hmm, my favourite supplier has them listed: http://www.nusystems.co.uk/product/R...A.Matched.Pair Very appealing - noted, bookmarked and *targetted*.... (So much stuff needed, so little money....!! :-( Dolphin have them at £119 each. OK - even better yet!! Forget matched pairs - they are all plenty well matched. The only thing that appeals to me with 'matched pairs' is you usually tend to get the shockmounts and wind thingies thrown in and all in a nice little flight case if you're lucky, from what I have seen...? Here's that sort of treatment for singles, pairs, whatever: http://www.digitalplayroom.com/rode/nt1.htm Oh, I forgot about the freebie cables. ;-) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:42:23 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote Plenty of bass on the Ruarks; in fact for smoothness and generally nice sound they have it by a mile from the other two. There is a series of low bass notes at about 35Hz. They are there quite nicely on the Ruarks, while on the other two they have simply vanished, although there is something there at 70Hz that seems to have replaced them For me that is a non-contest. The Ruarks have it by miles. Gor blimey, guvnah - yer could of knocked me dahn wiv a fevver!! I wuz *certain* you choose the others!! (Only kidding, of course!! :-) But let's get back on track here - it's the *treble* we're interested in, no-one's claimimg horns can match (or even compete) with speakers like the Paladins on bass!! What do say about the *treble*...??? (It's 'extremes' both ends that started this little lot off!!) If it's treble we're talking about, god yes - get those Ruarks back in. They are smoother by miles than the horns. I know they will take some getting used to because you are used to mega brightness, but it will be worth the effort. Streuth! We certainly do seem to hear different things with these! Not only me though - there's Swim to contend with also!! The bass sounds nice too; I can actually hear it. You can sodding *wear it* here....!! Anyway, so what do I do now - drag the Ruarks back into my pokey little room (back to where I was 5 years ago) lose all my clarity and depth and start *wading* through the bass again...?? (Not to mention how they'll slop around hanging off my triodes.....!! ;-) You never know - we may even civilize you in that department too... I doubt it....!! ;-) Nothing's cast in stone and things change - unlike some here, these things are not mutually exclusive to me. The Ruarks are used every day on the telly and for movies and I have 3 ss amps and (only) 1 valve amp here in daily use also.... The recordings are much better, too :-) Yes, I thought so - easier to control levels with proper pre's than on the computer only, as in the early days!! (I need all the encouragement I can get - there's one or two here got absolutely nothing better to do than hang around with their dicks out, waiting to give me a good *hosing*, it seems!! ;-) I won't lose too much sleep - I think you probably give as good as you get. Yep, I pay back in the same coin as I get - you and I don't agree on everything (anything?? :-) but we don't get all ****ty about it... Incidentally I've just ordered a pair of those NT1-A's for myself - they look very handy. Fark.... Dolphin? (Nusystems will always price-match, I gather!!) Are you getting the shockmounts with them? Fark... Don't know why, but I *do* fancy a pair myself - blame Arny!! :-) I think it's the 'ultra low noise' claim, absence of unnecessary pads/filters, included shockmounts and the 'Neuman' look to them...?? (I know I don't need multiple pairs of similarish mics, but wtf has that got to do with anything...?? :-) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Keith G" wrote in message
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Missing - track10 from the original source. Here you go: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...0In%20Love.mp3 ...seein's as how ya arst so nice like.... Clipped to blue blazes. Is that what you played through the speakers? |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 09:20:55 -0500, "Arny Krueger"
wrote: "Keith G" wrote in message "Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:16:43 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Don Pearce" wrote in message On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:22:47 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Also, what do you reckon to this little bugger: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...0656&rd=1&rd=1 Seems to be a convenient package. It looks neat. Self-noise is actually high enough to be of concern. For half the price I'd have a pair of Rhode NT1A, which I indeed already have. Quieter, and probably smoother. Hmm, my favourite supplier has them listed: http://www.nusystems.co.uk/product/R...A.Matched.Pair Very appealing - noted, bookmarked and *targetted*.... (So much stuff needed, so little money....!! :-( Dolphin have them at £119 each. OK - even better yet!! Forget matched pairs - they are all plenty well matched. The only thing that appeals to me with 'matched pairs' is you usually tend to get the shockmounts and wind thingies thrown in and all in a nice little flight case if you're lucky, from what I have seen...? Here's that sort of treatment for singles, pairs, whatever: http://www.digitalplayroom.com/rode/nt1.htm Oh, I forgot about the freebie cables. ;-) I quite like "This mic is sensitive enough to pick up explosive consonents (sic)". How sensitive does one need to be to register the diaphragm slamming into the back plate? d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:22:36 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote: Fark.... Dolphin? (Nusystems will always price-match, I gather!!) Are you getting the shockmounts with them? Yup, shockmounts are included, and the soft bag. I have plenty of old cases I can put them in, so I'm not fussed about that - or cables, I them coming out of ears. d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:59:14 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote Here's my frequency analysis of the Paladin and the other speaker (Lowther?). It scans the whole file, so it isn't just a snapshot. The difference is clear - top end as well as bass. http://81.174.169.10/odds/kspkr/paladin.gif http://81.174.169.10/odds/kspkr/other.gif OK, got those - thanks! Bass - yes, top end - yes maybe in the pix, no in real life I would say. Unless a harder, more 'brittle' bass is what is generally considered to be better? Not sure what you mean - extending the bottom end will result in the opposite of brittle. That's an 'oops' - I meant brittle treble! (Is how they seemed to me...??) d I'll play both the recordings back to back a bit later and see if I can get a clearer picture, but I don't think I would pick the Paladin's treble from what I've heard here....?? Do play 'em through the Paladins though - you won't hear the difference through the horns. (Bear in mind, the Paladins are my *pick of the bunch* from the long stream of speakers that have been through here during the last few years and are definite keepers....) Quite right. :-) Glad you approve - can I send you some colour swatches through and we'll get next year's decor plan sorted out while we're on? ;-) I'm in the poop - I just had a call from the dentist! (Apparently I should have been in for a checkup at 2 o' clock....!!) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:32:40 GMT, (Don Pearce)
wrote: On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:22:36 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Fark.... Dolphin? (Nusystems will always price-match, I gather!!) Are you getting the shockmounts with them? Yup, shockmounts are included, and the soft bag. I have plenty of old cases I can put them in, so I'm not fussed about that - or cables, I them coming out of ears. d My computer is losing whole words - no idea where it's putting them d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message "Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Missing - track10 from the original source. Here you go: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...0In%20Love.mp3 ...seein's as how ya arst so nice like.... Clipped to blue blazes. Is that what you played through the speakers? Yes and no - that's a straight computer CD to HDD rip via Sound Forge (in the normal manner, done some time back), what I played (and recorded yesterday and today) was the *original* CD (in two different Pioneer DVDPs)....??? Weird - my 'open mic' recordings are better (levelswise) than the computer rip...??? (Beats the crap outta me...??) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:32:40 GMT, (Don Pearce) wrote: On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:22:36 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Fark.... Dolphin? (Nusystems will always price-match, I gather!!) Are you getting the shockmounts with them? Yup, shockmounts are included, and the soft bag. I have plenty of old cases I can put them in, so I'm not fussed about that - or cables, I them coming out of ears. I also don't need extra cables and pop filters but I never turn down freebies...!! :-) I've emailed Arny's mates for a price to the UK (I don't have too many suitable cases) http://www.digitalplayroom.com/cgi-b...micsrodent1amp but expect the shipping will kill it! (The weight of the freebie cables, I expect! :-) d My computer is losing whole words - no idea where it's putting them Do what Arny does - when you find them, gather them up into a heap until you have enough to make a whole post and send it off.... |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 15:13:20 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:32:40 GMT, (Don Pearce) wrote: On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:22:36 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Fark.... Dolphin? (Nusystems will always price-match, I gather!!) Are you getting the shockmounts with them? Yup, shockmounts are included, and the soft bag. I have plenty of old cases I can put them in, so I'm not fussed about that - or cables, I them coming out of ears. I also don't need extra cables and pop filters but I never turn down freebies...!! :-) I've emailed Arny's mates for a price to the UK (I don't have too many suitable cases) http://www.digitalplayroom.com/cgi-b...micsrodent1amp but expect the shipping will kill it! (The weight of the freebie cables, I expect! :-) Don't forget the dreaded import duty either. d My computer is losing whole words - no idea where it's putting them Do what Arny does - when you find them, gather them up into a heap until you have enough to make a whole post and send it off.... Now now, that one was unprovoked - that gives him a free shot, you know. d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 15:13:20 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote in message .. . On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:32:40 GMT, (Don Pearce) wrote: On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:22:36 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Fark.... Dolphin? (Nusystems will always price-match, I gather!!) Are you getting the shockmounts with them? Yup, shockmounts are included, and the soft bag. I have plenty of old cases I can put them in, so I'm not fussed about that - or cables, I them coming out of ears. I also don't need extra cables and pop filters but I never turn down freebies...!! :-) I've emailed Arny's mates for a price to the UK (I don't have too many suitable cases) http://www.digitalplayroom.com/cgi-b...micsrodent1amp but expect the shipping will kill it! (The weight of the freebie cables, I expect! :-) Don't forget the dreaded import duty either. Oh, **** - I did forget that.... :-) Actually, I've got away with it more times than I should admit out loud, but I suspect the package would be a wee bit too big this time.... d My computer is losing whole words - no idea where it's putting them Do what Arny does - when you find them, gather them up into a heap until you have enough to make a whole post and send it off.... Now now, that one was unprovoked - that gives him a free shot, you know. :-) Nah, he's *way ahead*......!! |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
In article ,
Keith G wrote: If the harmonics from a musical instrument were unimportant then top C from a piano would sound exactly the same as from a violin. Of course perhaps they do on your setup... Didn't take you long, did it...?? Perfectly valid comment given your love of devices which alter the harmonic content of a signal. You can't have it both ways, dear boy. ;-) -- *Funny, I don't remember being absent minded. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Don Pearce" wrote in message
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 09:20:55 -0500, "Arny Krueger" wrote: "Keith G" wrote in message "Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 13:16:43 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Don Pearce" wrote in message On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:22:47 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Also, what do you reckon to this little bugger: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...0656&rd=1&rd=1 Seems to be a convenient package. It looks neat. Self-noise is actually high enough to be of concern. For half the price I'd have a pair of Rhode NT1A, which I indeed already have. Quieter, and probably smoother. Hmm, my favourite supplier has them listed: http://www.nusystems.co.uk/product/R...A.Matched.Pair Very appealing - noted, bookmarked and *targetted*.... (So much stuff needed, so little money....!! :-( Dolphin have them at £119 each. OK - even better yet!! Forget matched pairs - they are all plenty well matched. The only thing that appeals to me with 'matched pairs' is you usually tend to get the shockmounts and wind thingies thrown in and all in a nice little flight case if you're lucky, from what I have seen...? Here's that sort of treatment for singles, pairs, whatever: http://www.digitalplayroom.com/rode/nt1.htm Oh, I forgot about the freebie cables. ;-) I quite like "This mic is sensitive enough to pick up explosive consonents (sic)". Agreed, that is like saying that this truck is fast enough to go 3 mph. How sensitive does one need to be to register the diaphragm slamming into the back plate? Well, we both know that with its max SPL rating of something like 137 dB, the diaphragm mostly never does that. However, its 13.7 dBu maximum undistorted output might just clip some lesser line inputs! ;-) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Keith G" wrote in message
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message "Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Missing - track10 from the original source. Here you go: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...0In%20Love.mp3 ...seein's as how ya arst so nice like.... Clipped to blue blazes. Is that what you played through the speakers? Yes and no - that's a straight computer CD to HDD rip via Sound Forge (in the normal manner, done some time back), Good enough. what I played (and recorded yesterday and today) was the *original* CD (in two different Pioneer DVDPs)....??? Probably much the same was coming out of the optical players. Weird - my 'open mic' recordings are better (levelswise) than the computer rip...??? No, but the frequency response variations make the clipped signals appear to be unclipped. I've seen this many times. The same is true of compression. Highly compressed songs will lose their flat envelope look (and to some degree their flat sound) if you apply some eq. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
Keith G wrote:
"Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 15:13:20 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: "Don Pearce" wrote in message ... On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:32:40 GMT, (Don Pearce) wrote: On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 14:22:36 -0000, "Keith G" wrote: Fark.... Dolphin? (Nusystems will always price-match, I gather!!) Are you getting the shockmounts with them? Yup, shockmounts are included, and the soft bag. I have plenty of old cases I can put them in, so I'm not fussed about that - or cables, I them coming out of ears. I also don't need extra cables and pop filters but I never turn down freebies...!! :-) I've emailed Arny's mates for a price to the UK (I don't have too many suitable cases) http://www.digitalplayroom.com/cgi-b...micsrodent1amp but expect the shipping will kill it! (The weight of the freebie cables, I expect! :-) Don't forget the dreaded import duty either. Oh, **** - I did forget that.... :-) And don't forget 17.5% VAT on the *total* price, goods, carriage and any duty. My understanding is that UK Customs don't bother to collect VAT on items worth less than £ 100 ex VAT. I once got caught with a set of DVDs from the US, the cost was £102 or thereabouts, and I got a bill for the VAT. Duty is normally only a few percent, often zero, but some strange items can be very high. For example, at one time a tape recorder was zero rated whilst a tape player was 18%. All the NAB cart machines we imported were record versions....... S. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... In article , Keith G wrote: If the harmonics from a musical instrument were unimportant then top C from a piano would sound exactly the same as from a violin. Of course perhaps they do on your setup... Didn't take you long, did it...?? Perfectly valid comment given your love of devices which alter the harmonic content of a signal. You can't have it both ways, dear boy. ;-) snip silly sig yet again... Really? That'll be Rule Number what from the 'Plowman's Intergalactic Guide To Pub Lunches And How It Is'....?? Here's one from my very own wipe-clean, laminated plastic set of 'How To Scrape By Without Having To Get Too Far In' handy hint cards: No. 3 - "Try to resist grabbing *every single* opportunity to make yourself look a tit and you'll probably win greater respect from your fellow man/other posters in this group....!!" (Asitappens, if you had been following today's fun and games with my recordings of *both* my triode/horn and ss/ordinary speaker setups you'd have maybe twigged I've already *got it* both ways....?? ;-) Er.... *Dear boy*.... ;-) |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message "Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message "Arny Krueger" wrote in message . .. "Keith G" wrote in message OK, here we go - this is the setup: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2001.JPG http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...Setup%2002.JPG and here is the track: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...,%20SE1As).mp3 ...and here's the Lowther track again for direct comparison (if anyone else is interested): http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Track10.mp3 Missing - track10 from the original source. Here you go: http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...0In%20Love.mp3 ...seein's as how ya arst so nice like.... Clipped to blue blazes. Is that what you played through the speakers? Yes and no - that's a straight computer CD to HDD rip via Sound Forge (in the normal manner, done some time back), Good enough. what I played (and recorded yesterday and today) was the *original* CD (in two different Pioneer DVDPs)....??? Probably much the same was coming out of the optical players. Weird - my 'open mic' recordings are better (levelswise) than the computer rip...??? No, but the frequency response variations make the clipped signals appear to be unclipped. I've seen this many times. The same is true of compression. Highly compressed songs will lose their flat envelope look (and to some degree their flat sound) if you apply some eq. OK, that's very interesting. I routinely rip each and every CD that comes my way and a lot of them are painted the same colour (blue in SF) all the way from *ceiling to floor* these days and I've long since stopped noticing it!! Aside, I contacted your link on the Rode mics and got a shipping price of 52+ bucks and notification of a very *helpful* 'standard value' that is put on the packaging in 'export' circumstances..!!?? Probably still going to stack up uneconomic (oops - little pun there) though.... |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Serge Auckland" wrote And don't forget 17.5% VAT on the *total* price, goods, carriage and any duty. My understanding is that UK Customs don't bother to collect VAT on items worth less than £ 100 ex VAT. I once got caught with a set of DVDs from the US, the cost was £102 or thereabouts, and I got a bill for the VAT. Duty is normally only a few percent, often zero, but some strange items can be very high. For example, at one time a tape recorder was zero rated whilst a tape player was 18%. All the NAB cart machines we imported were record versions....... Of course.... :-) I've contacted the outfit on the link Arny posted and they've quoted 52 odd bucks UPS Air Parcel and said that they mark all such overseas shipments at a helpful price (about half) but I'll have to see how it stacks up - I ain't got all the spare kit/cases Don's got and wouldn't sniff at a pair of freebie 20' cables - I got stoked about 30 quid a go for the 10' cables I've got...!! (No need for pop filters either, but you never know with 'plosives' - I just might get the job of recording a nice little local Bimbo Band...!! ;-) Anyway, it still hangs on cashflow atm.... |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
On Mon, 20 Nov 2006 10:55:13 -0500, "Arny Krueger"
wrote: Well, we both know that with its max SPL rating of something like 137 dB, the diaphragm mostly never does that. However, its 13.7 dBu maximum undistorted output might just clip some lesser line inputs! ;-) With self-powered mics I frequently use them straight on the line-in sockets; I've made a few adaptors just for that job. Never been anywhere loud enough to overload them though - not sure I'd particularly want to either. But there's plenty of things you can record into line-in with about 20dB of headroom left. That makes for a perfectly acceptable recording in my books. d -- Pearce Consulting http://www.pearce.uk.com |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
In article ,
Serge Auckland wrote: Don't forget the dreaded import duty either. Oh, **** - I did forget that.... And don't forget 17.5% VAT on the *total* price, goods, carriage and any duty. Plus admin fee from the PO. -- *It is easier to get older than it is to get wiser. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
In article ,
Keith G wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... In article , Keith G wrote: If the harmonics from a musical instrument were unimportant then top C from a piano would sound exactly the same as from a violin. Of course perhaps they do on your setup... Didn't take you long, did it...?? Perfectly valid comment given your love of devices which alter the harmonic content of a signal. You can't have it both ways, dear boy. ;-) snip silly sig yet again... That's what the sig separator is there for - if you know how to configure your newsreader. Really? That'll be Rule Number what from the 'Plowman's Intergalactic Guide To Pub Lunches And How It Is'....?? Here's one from my very own wipe-clean, laminated plastic set of 'How To Scrape By Without Having To Get Too Far In' handy hint cards: No. 3 - "Try to resist grabbing *every single* opportunity to make yourself look a tit and you'll probably win greater respect from your fellow man/other posters in this group....!!" So you don't think you've made yourself look a fool by saying harmonics don't matter? Because I've got news for you. They are the very essence of music. Without them it would be pretty boring. (Asitappens, if you had been following today's fun and games with my recordings of *both* my triode/horn and ss/ordinary speaker setups you'd have maybe twigged I've already *got it* both ways....?? ;-) I've not been following your latest blog, no. Haven't got the time to waste. -- *A picture may be worth a thousand words, but it uses up a thousand times more memory. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... In article , Serge Auckland wrote: Don't forget the dreaded import duty either. Oh, **** - I did forget that.... And don't forget 17.5% VAT on the *total* price, goods, carriage and any duty. Plus admin fee from the PO. ?? Thought you said you were too busy to follow my blog....?? confused... ?? And still **** the stoopid sig: -- *It is easier to get older than it is to get wiser. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
What's your view of speaker crossovers?
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... In article , Keith G wrote: "Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... In article , Keith G wrote: If the harmonics from a musical instrument were unimportant then top C from a piano would sound exactly the same as from a violin. Of course perhaps they do on your setup... Didn't take you long, did it...?? Perfectly valid comment given your love of devices which alter the harmonic content of a signal. You can't have it both ways, dear boy. ;-) snip silly sig yet again... That's what the sig separator is there for - if you know how to configure your newsreader. I've got *configure* my newsreader to delete your silly sig? I don't think so.... Really? That'll be Rule Number what from the 'Plowman's Intergalactic Guide To Pub Lunches And How It Is'....?? Here's one from my very own wipe-clean, laminated plastic set of 'How To Scrape By Without Having To Get Too Far In' handy hint cards: No. 3 - "Try to resist grabbing *every single* opportunity to make yourself look a tit and you'll probably win greater respect from your fellow man/other posters in this group....!!" So you don't think you've made yourself look a fool by saying harmonics don't matter? Because I've got news for you. Actually not - there isn't *anything* you think you might know that I need to know from you. (Hope that isn't too *devastating* for you?? :-) They are the very essence of music. Without them it would be pretty boring. Tell you what - could you give me a little notice of the things I'm about to say and I'll get some snappy replies roughed out in readiness....??? (Asitappens, if you had been following today's fun and games with my recordings of *both* my triode/horn and ss/ordinary speaker setups you'd have maybe twigged I've already *got it* both ways....?? ;-) I've not been following your latest blog, no. Haven't got the time to waste. Ooh dear, let's not *kid* ourselves, shall we....?? :-) **** the sig..... -- *A picture may be worth a thousand words, but it uses up a thousand times more memory. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
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