You use it!

I've been meaning to throw a pair of OB speakers together for a while (had
the ideal drivers kicking about for ages - Visaton B200s) and never got
round to it, but I was sent a pic of some nice OBs the other day and they
got me thinking.....

They were stood out in the middle of a room which I thought wouldn't have
been doing them any favours and it caused me to wonder what slotting a pair
into the corners of my room and *using* the 'liveliness' to boost the bass
would work like? Add to that I've been falling over a bloody great, *heavy*
piece of board (white plastic faced 18mm MDF) in my garage for a while, so I
duly threw a pair together - it took about 3.5 hours and the only scrap left
over from a piece of board 54 x 48 inches was two 48 inch lengths about 1
inch wide and the circles from the cutouts for the drivers!!

So in true Show N Tell tradition*, here's the story:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers1.JPG

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers2.JPG


Miking them thus:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers3.JPG


I grabbed a couple of extracts from the 'Road To Hell' CD:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...0(Extract).mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Daytona.mp3



And some shorter samples from a fairly weedy 'test CD' (it's French - what
do you expect?) which, I think, demonstrate superb clarity - headphones will
give you a better idea but ignore the 'heartbeat' which seems to have crept
back into the equation.....

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2001.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2002.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2003.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2004.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2005.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2006.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2007.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2008.mp3


Anyway, I was very pleasantly surprised indeed - see what you think!

(The milkman freaked out and dropped his yoghourt...!! ;-)



*It's what I do, I don't have a past lifetime's experience of 'audio' - mine
is *here and now*!!

Keith G wrote:
You use it!

I've been meaning to throw a pair of OB speakers together for a while (had
the ideal drivers kicking about for ages - Visaton B200s) and never got
round to it, but I was sent a pic of some nice OBs the other day and they
got me thinking.....

They were stood out in the middle of a room which I thought wouldn't have
been doing them any favours and it caused me to wonder what slotting a pair
into the corners of my room and *using* the 'liveliness' to boost the bass
would work like? Add to that I've been falling over a bloody great, *heavy*
piece of board (white plastic faced 18mm MDF) in my garage for a while, so I
duly threw a pair together - it took about 3.5 hours and the only scrap left
over from a piece of board 54 x 48 inches was two 48 inch lengths about 1
inch wide and the circles from the cutouts for the drivers!!

So in true Show N Tell tradition*, here's the story:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers1.JPG

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers2.JPG


Miking them thus:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers3.JPG


I grabbed a couple of extracts from the 'Road To Hell' CD:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show...0(Extract).mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Daytona.mp3



And some shorter samples from a fairly weedy 'test CD' (it's French - what
do you expect?) which, I think, demonstrate superb clarity - headphones will
give you a better idea but ignore the 'heartbeat' which seems to have crept
back into the equation.....

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2001.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2002.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2003.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2004.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2005.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2006.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2007.mp3

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/Sample%2008.mp3


Anyway, I was very pleasantly surprised indeed - see what you think!

(The milkman freaked out and dropped his yoghourt...!! ;-)



*It's what I do, I don't have a past lifetime's experience of 'audio' - mine
is *here and now*!!




Keith,

As one who *does* have a lifetime's experience of audio (and I'm only
now realising how little I know)there's nothing new under the (audio)
sun. Corner enclosures were very popular in the late '50s and '60s in
part for the reasons you state: i.e. using the room corners to boost the
bass, but also to keep them out of the way of furnishings. It was hard
enough for people to find room for one large 'speaker, but when stereo
came along, finding room for two was difficult. The WAF was as alive
then as now.

However, putting 'speakers in the corners won't make much difference in
a live room over putting them elsewhere. The problem with a live room is
reflections, which affect the mid and treble. Bass sees hard walls
whatever they are covered with unless you take special steps to create
bass traps. However, using single drive units, the treble will beam more
than using separate dome tweeters, and angling them as you have will at
least help keep the treble away from the walls.

I have just received a copy of the 1959 Audio Year Book and a copy of
the July 1959 American "High Fidelity" magazine and they are full of
weird and wonderful enclosures trying to make stereo acceptable
domestically.

In spite of my long teeth, what's an OB 'speaker other than Outside
Broadcast?

S.

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
Keith G wrote:

Keith,

As one who *does* have a lifetime's experience of audio (and I'm only now
realising how little I know)there's nothing new under the (audio) sun.
Corner enclosures were very popular in the late '50s and '60s in part for
the reasons you state: i.e. using the room corners to boost the bass, but
also to keep them out of the way of furnishings. It was hard enough for
people to find room for one large 'speaker, but when stereo came along,
finding room for two was difficult. The WAF was as alive then as now.



Serge, no-one is more aware that there's 'nothing new under the (audio) sun'
than me - my amps date back to the 20s and 30s (design) and my speakers
feature drivers that have been in *continuous production* for the last 50
years in a design probably just as old!!



However, putting 'speakers in the corners won't make much difference in a
live room over putting them elsewhere. The problem with a live room is
reflections, which affect the mid and treble. Bass sees hard walls
whatever they are covered with unless you take special steps to create
bass traps. However, using single drive units, the treble will beam more
than using separate dome tweeters, and angling them as you have will at
least help keep the treble away from the walls.


Yes and the angled sides allow the air to move freely - I'm back to
thrumming doorframes here...!!



I have just received a copy of the 1959 Audio Year Book and a copy of the
July 1959 American "High Fidelity" magazine and they are full of weird and
wonderful enclosures trying to make stereo acceptable domestically.


:-)


In spite of my long teeth, what's an OB 'speaker other than Outside
Broadcast?


Open Baffle - see the view down the back:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/openbaffle.JPG


Also this, just to prove I can still do *handheld* at 1/8 of a second!!

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers4.JPG

:-)


Recording some much more impressive stuff atm and expecting P the T and
possibly Ray The Jay round anytime now for a listen. (As usual!! :-)

(Quite simply the *clearest* sound so far, by miles.....!! :-)

....................rent the room out for amateur dramatics.

In article , Keith G
writes

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
Keith G wrote:

Keith,

As one who *does* have a lifetime's experience of audio (and I'm only now
realising how little I know)there's nothing new under the (audio) sun.
Corner enclosures were very popular in the late '50s and '60s in part for
the reasons you state: i.e. using the room corners to boost the bass, but
also to keep them out of the way of furnishings. It was hard enough for
people to find room for one large 'speaker, but when stereo came along,
finding room for two was difficult. The WAF was as alive then as now.



Serge, no-one is more aware that there's 'nothing new under the (audio) sun'
than me - my amps date back to the 20s and 30s (design) and my speakers
feature drivers that have been in *continuous production* for the last 50
years in a design probably just as old!!



However, putting 'speakers in the corners won't make much difference in a
live room over putting them elsewhere. The problem with a live room is
reflections, which affect the mid and treble. Bass sees hard walls
whatever they are covered with unless you take special steps to create
bass traps. However, using single drive units, the treble will beam more
than using separate dome tweeters, and angling them as you have will at
least help keep the treble away from the walls.


Yes and the angled sides allow the air to move freely - I'm back to
thrumming doorframes here...!!



I have just received a copy of the 1959 Audio Year Book and a copy of the
July 1959 American "High Fidelity" magazine and they are full of weird and
wonderful enclosures trying to make stereo acceptable domestically.


:-)


In spite of my long teeth, what's an OB 'speaker other than Outside
Broadcast?


Open Baffle - see the view down the back:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/openbaffle.JPG


Also this, just to prove I can still do *handheld* at 1/8 of a second!!

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers4.JPG

:-)

Please sir!, what Mic amps RU using?.....


Recording some much more impressive stuff atm and expecting P the T and
possibly Ray The Jay round anytime now for a listen. (As usual!! :-)

(Quite simply the *clearest* sound so far, by miles.....!! :-)

Keithyphone label anyone?..




--
Tony Sayer

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , Keith G
writes

"Serge Auckland" wrote in
message
.. .
Keith G wrote:

Keith,

As one who *does* have a lifetime's experience of audio (and I'm only
now
realising how little I know)there's nothing new under the (audio) sun.
Corner enclosures were very popular in the late '50s and '60s in part
for
the reasons you state: i.e. using the room corners to boost the bass,
but
also to keep them out of the way of furnishings. It was hard enough for
people to find room for one large 'speaker, but when stereo came along,
finding room for two was difficult. The WAF was as alive then as now.



Serge, no-one is more aware that there's 'nothing new under the (audio)
sun'
than me - my amps date back to the 20s and 30s (design) and my speakers
feature drivers that have been in *continuous production* for the last 50
years in a design probably just as old!!



However, putting 'speakers in the corners won't make much difference in
a
live room over putting them elsewhere. The problem with a live room is
reflections, which affect the mid and treble. Bass sees hard walls
whatever they are covered with unless you take special steps to create
bass traps. However, using single drive units, the treble will beam more
than using separate dome tweeters, and angling them as you have will at
least help keep the treble away from the walls.


Yes and the angled sides allow the air to move freely - I'm back to
thrumming doorframes here...!!



I have just received a copy of the 1959 Audio Year Book and a copy of
the
July 1959 American "High Fidelity" magazine and they are full of weird
and
wonderful enclosures trying to make stereo acceptable domestically.


:-)


In spite of my long teeth, what's an OB 'speaker other than Outside
Broadcast?


Open Baffle - see the view down the back:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/openbaffle.JPG


Also this, just to prove I can still do *handheld* at 1/8 of a second!!

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers4.JPG

:-)

Please sir!, what Mic amps RU using?.....


http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/feb0.../arttubemp.htm


If you ask because there's a channel imbalance in favour of the left
channel, that's down to me (my fault for not taking more care to set the
levels properly!) - I set the levels by eye and let the recording run for
the duration of the CD (one take only). Unfortunately, SoundForge doesn't
let you see the waveform 'til you stop recording - as that was about an
hour's worth of *real time*, I wasn't about to do it over!!

;-)

Keith G wrote:
"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
Keith G wrote:

Keith,

As one who *does* have a lifetime's experience of audio (and I'm only now
realising how little I know)there's nothing new under the (audio) sun.
Corner enclosures were very popular in the late '50s and '60s in part for
the reasons you state: i.e. using the room corners to boost the bass, but
also to keep them out of the way of furnishings. It was hard enough for
people to find room for one large 'speaker, but when stereo came along,
finding room for two was difficult. The WAF was as alive then as now.



Serge, no-one is more aware that there's 'nothing new under the (audio) sun'
than me - my amps date back to the 20s and 30s (design) and my speakers
feature drivers that have been in *continuous production* for the last 50
years in a design probably just as old!!


However, putting 'speakers in the corners won't make much difference in a
live room over putting them elsewhere. The problem with a live room is
reflections, which affect the mid and treble. Bass sees hard walls
whatever they are covered with unless you take special steps to create
bass traps. However, using single drive units, the treble will beam more
than using separate dome tweeters, and angling them as you have will at
least help keep the treble away from the walls.


Yes and the angled sides allow the air to move freely - I'm back to
thrumming doorframes here...!!


I have just received a copy of the 1959 Audio Year Book and a copy of the
July 1959 American "High Fidelity" magazine and they are full of weird and
wonderful enclosures trying to make stereo acceptable domestically.


:-)


In spite of my long teeth, what's an OB 'speaker other than Outside
Broadcast?


Open Baffle - see the view down the back:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/openbaffle.JPG


Also this, just to prove I can still do *handheld* at 1/8 of a second!!

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers4.JPG

:-)


Thanks, I'd forgotten about open baffles. However, what you have isn't
really an OB if you put them in the corner. If it fits tightly in the
corner it will approximate to a sealed box, sometimes referred to as an
Infinite Baffle, but as the fit isn't likely to be airtight, you will
have some gaps, so it will work to some extent something like a
Bass-reflex cabinet, but with very indeterminate performance. An OB
needs to be clear of the wall, or sealed to the wall in which case it is
an IB or, if vented, then a bass-reflex. Wharfedale used to do a
sand-filled open baffle with an upward firing tweeter, designed for
free-field siting.

You really should try a corner horn or Transmission Line someday.

S.

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
Keith G wrote:
"Serge Auckland" wrote in
message ...
Keith G wrote:

Keith,

As one who *does* have a lifetime's experience of audio (and I'm only
now realising how little I know)there's nothing new under the (audio)
sun. Corner enclosures were very popular in the late '50s and '60s in
part for the reasons you state: i.e. using the room corners to boost the
bass, but also to keep them out of the way of furnishings. It was hard
enough for people to find room for one large 'speaker, but when stereo
came along, finding room for two was difficult. The WAF was as alive
then as now.



Serge, no-one is more aware that there's 'nothing new under the (audio)
sun' than me - my amps date back to the 20s and 30s (design) and my
speakers feature drivers that have been in *continuous production* for
the last 50 years in a design probably just as old!!


However, putting 'speakers in the corners won't make much difference in
a live room over putting them elsewhere. The problem with a live room is
reflections, which affect the mid and treble. Bass sees hard walls
whatever they are covered with unless you take special steps to create
bass traps. However, using single drive units, the treble will beam more
than using separate dome tweeters, and angling them as you have will at
least help keep the treble away from the walls.


Yes and the angled sides allow the air to move freely - I'm back to
thrumming doorframes here...!!


I have just received a copy of the 1959 Audio Year Book and a copy of
the July 1959 American "High Fidelity" magazine and they are full of
weird and wonderful enclosures trying to make stereo acceptable
domestically.


:-)


In spite of my long teeth, what's an OB 'speaker other than Outside
Broadcast?


Open Baffle - see the view down the back:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/openbaffle.JPG


Also this, just to prove I can still do *handheld* at 1/8 of a second!!

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/obspeakers4.JPG

:-)


Thanks, I'd forgotten about open baffles. However, what you have isn't
really an OB if you put them in the corner. If it fits tightly in the
corner it will approximate to a sealed box, sometimes referred to as an
Infinite Baffle, but as the fit isn't likely to be airtight, you will have
some gaps, so it will work to some extent something like a Bass-reflex
cabinet, but with very indeterminate performance. An OB needs to be clear
of the wall, or sealed to the wall in which case it is an IB or, if
vented, then a bass-reflex.



Yep, in other words I'm *using* the room, like I said originally but it's no
way *sealed* - you could stand behind it!! There's no doubt it's very
effective what ever you might want to call it!! I don't say it's a permanent
arrangement - it has to beat the Fidelios to stay, for starters!!


Wharfedale used to do a
sand-filled open baffle with an upward firing tweeter, designed for
free-field siting.


Yes, when my friend P the T called earlier he started waffling about Briggs
and early Wharfedales!



You really should try a corner horn or Transmission Line someday.


It's in there with all the other little 'maybe projects'! ;-)

Now, have a go at this one - one of the *inimitable* Laurie Anderson's
tracks:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/laurieanderson.mp3


Remember it's miked (silly cheap CAD GXL2400 large condensers at 49 quid a
pop from UKProAudio on eBay*) - there's a nice lot going on in there and I
think the single driver acquits itself rather well...!!??


* What? You thought they were Neumann U87s...?? :-)

In article ,
Keith G wrote:
Yep, in other words I'm *using* the room, like I said originally but
it's no way *sealed* - you could stand behind it!! There's no doubt
it's very effective what ever you might want to call it!! I don't say
it's a permanent arrangement - it has to beat the Fidelios to stay, for
starters!!

As you move that type of speaker into a corner it will load the bass
somewhat - but not evenly. The frequency response will look like a dogs
hind leg...

--
*Heart attacks... God's revenge for eating his animal friends

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Keith G wrote:

Serge, no-one is more aware that there's 'nothing new under the (audio) sun'
than me - my amps date back to the 20s and 30s (design) and my speakers
feature drivers that have been in *continuous production* for the last 50
years in a design probably just as old!!

From what I've heard, they sound like it too !

Graham