As a break from worrying about my listening room acoustics, I had a play
with the 1920s acoustic gramophone I recently got down from my loft.

This has a Swiss Paillard turntable, but there are no other manufacturer's
marks on the box, except for ALBA on the pick-up.

It runs well to speed, and the arm is rather remarkable for its build
quality. The horizontal bearing has no perceptible play or friction, and the
vertical articulation seems fluid damped. Rather lovely. Note the three
boxes of needles. The green Pyramid contains "soft-tone" needles whilst the
two HMV boxes are of "half-tone" No idea what the difference is.

Here are some pics:-

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/Gr...phone-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...oseup-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...e-arm-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ck-up-full.jpg

So what does it sound like?

Here are a couple of recordings:

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ightandday.mp3

The song is Night and Day by Cole Porter, sung by the Comedy Harmonists.

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gramophoneGuilty.mp3

The song is Guilty by Kahn, Akst, Whiting and sung by Steve Conway with Jack
Byfield & his Orchestra.

Both records were rescued from the dump, so are of unknown condition, but
were both cleaned with the RCM. They were played with the HMV needles, which
have to be changed for each side played.


I think we have come a long way since 1920.

S.

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
As a break from worrying about my listening room acoustics, I had a play
with the 1920s acoustic gramophone I recently got down from my loft.

This has a Swiss Paillard turntable, but there are no other manufacturer's
marks on the box, except for ALBA on the pick-up.

It runs well to speed, and the arm is rather remarkable for its build
quality. The horizontal bearing has no perceptible play or friction, and
the vertical articulation seems fluid damped. Rather lovely. Note the
three boxes of needles. The green Pyramid contains "soft-tone" needles
whilst the two HMV boxes are of "half-tone" No idea what the difference
is.

Here are some pics:-

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/Gr...phone-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...oseup-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...e-arm-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ck-up-full.jpg

So what does it sound like?

Here are a couple of recordings:

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ightandday.mp3

The song is Night and Day by Cole Porter, sung by the Comedy Harmonists.

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gramophoneGuilty.mp3

The song is Guilty by Kahn, Akst, Whiting and sung by Steve Conway with
Jack Byfield & his Orchestra.

Both records were rescued from the dump, so are of unknown condition, but
were both cleaned with the RCM. They were played with the HMV needles,
which have to be changed for each side played.


I think we have come a long way since 1920.

S.


Oh, by the way, the recordings were made with the doors open, then closed
(and the other way round). I thought at first that the doors would mostly be
a volume control, but they act as much as a tone control, getting rid of
some of the horrible screechiness when closed.

S.

On Thu, 8 Mar 2007 16:48:41 -0000, "Serge Auckland"
wrote:

As a break from worrying about my listening room acoustics, I had a play
with the 1920s acoustic gramophone I recently got down from my loft.

This has a Swiss Paillard turntable, but there are no other manufacturer's
marks on the box, except for ALBA on the pick-up.

It runs well to speed, and the arm is rather remarkable for its build
quality. The horizontal bearing has no perceptible play or friction, and the
vertical articulation seems fluid damped. Rather lovely. Note the three
boxes of needles. The green Pyramid contains "soft-tone" needles whilst the
two HMV boxes are of "half-tone" No idea what the difference is.

Here are some pics:-

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/Gr...phone-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...oseup-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...e-arm-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ck-up-full.jpg

So what does it sound like?

Here are a couple of recordings:

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ightandday.mp3

The song is Night and Day by Cole Porter, sung by the Comedy Harmonists.

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gramophoneGuilty.mp3

The song is Guilty by Kahn, Akst, Whiting and sung by Steve Conway with Jack
Byfield & his Orchestra.

Both records were rescued from the dump, so are of unknown condition, but
were both cleaned with the RCM. They were played with the HMV needles, which
have to be changed for each side played.


I think we have come a long way since 1920.

S.




Sadly barely audible. I've tried the standard clean-up methods, but
nothing seems to do a great deal for the rice crispies without also
killing the music.

d

--
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

"Don Pearce" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Mar 2007 16:48:41 -0000, "Serge Auckland"
wrote:

As a break from worrying about my listening room acoustics, I had a play
with the 1920s acoustic gramophone I recently got down from my loft.

This has a Swiss Paillard turntable, but there are no other manufacturer's
marks on the box, except for ALBA on the pick-up.

It runs well to speed, and the arm is rather remarkable for its build
quality. The horizontal bearing has no perceptible play or friction, and
the
vertical articulation seems fluid damped. Rather lovely. Note the three
boxes of needles. The green Pyramid contains "soft-tone" needles whilst
the
two HMV boxes are of "half-tone" No idea what the difference is.

Here are some pics:-

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/Gr...phone-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...oseup-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...e-arm-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ck-up-full.jpg

So what does it sound like?

Here are a couple of recordings:

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ightandday.mp3

The song is Night and Day by Cole Porter, sung by the Comedy Harmonists.

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gramophoneGuilty.mp3

The song is Guilty by Kahn, Akst, Whiting and sung by Steve Conway with
Jack
Byfield & his Orchestra.

Both records were rescued from the dump, so are of unknown condition, but
were both cleaned with the RCM. They were played with the HMV needles,
which
have to be changed for each side played.


I think we have come a long way since 1920.

S.




Sadly barely audible. I've tried the standard clean-up methods, but
nothing seems to do a great deal for the rice crispies without also
killing the music.

d

--
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

They do sound like a breakfast frying don't they......

S.

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
As a break from worrying about my listening room acoustics, I had a play
with the 1920s acoustic gramophone I recently got down from my loft.

This has a Swiss Paillard turntable, but there are no other manufacturer's
marks on the box, except for ALBA on the pick-up.

It runs well to speed, and the arm is rather remarkable for its build
quality. The horizontal bearing has no perceptible play or friction, and
the vertical articulation seems fluid damped. Rather lovely. Note the
three boxes of needles. The green Pyramid contains "soft-tone" needles
whilst the two HMV boxes are of "half-tone" No idea what the difference
is.

Here are some pics:-

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/Gr...phone-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...oseup-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...e-arm-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ck-up-full.jpg

So what does it sound like?

Here are a couple of recordings:

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ightandday.mp3

The song is Night and Day by Cole Porter, sung by the Comedy Harmonists.

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gramophoneGuilty.mp3

The song is Guilty by Kahn, Akst, Whiting and sung by Steve Conway with
Jack Byfield & his Orchestra.

Both records were rescued from the dump, so are of unknown condition, but
were both cleaned with the RCM. They were played with the HMV needles,
which have to be changed for each side played.


I think we have come a long way since 1920.



Woah, hold on....!!!

If you take (most probably knackered) records off a dump, play them and
record them close enough to get spattered with alpha particles then that's
the sound you'll get. But I have heard 78 samples that were much, much
better and would suggest it would be a mistake to dismiss our ancestors as
having no standards at all!

See this site:

http://www.enhancedaudio.com/78_restoration.htm

Where you will find a 'noisy' version:

http://www.tracertek.com/Waves/MYSIN1.mp3

And a 'cleaned' (digital filtered, I believe) version:

http://www.tracertek.com/Waves/MYSINCLEAN.mp3

of the same clip.

It doesn't seem to take much to get a pretty good reproduction and I would
suggest/suspect the latter would be closer to SOA 78 of the era (pristine
discs and the right needles/methodology) when listened to at a normal,
'across the room' distance....??

(Even if not, it's a damn site more convenient than having to make the
crossing by sea to hear a bit of Caruso, at any rate!! ;-)

Nice Show N Tell though!! :-)

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
As a break from worrying about my listening room acoustics, I had a play
with the 1920s acoustic gramophone I recently got down from my loft.

This has a Swiss Paillard turntable, but there are no other
manufacturer's marks on the box, except for ALBA on the pick-up.

It runs well to speed, and the arm is rather remarkable for its build
quality. The horizontal bearing has no perceptible play or friction, and
the vertical articulation seems fluid damped. Rather lovely. Note the
three boxes of needles. The green Pyramid contains "soft-tone" needles
whilst the two HMV boxes are of "half-tone" No idea what the difference
is.

Here are some pics:-

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/Gr...phone-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...oseup-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...e-arm-full.jpg

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ck-up-full.jpg

So what does it sound like?

Here are a couple of recordings:

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gr...ightandday.mp3

The song is Night and Day by Cole Porter, sung by the Comedy Harmonists.

http://audiopages.googlepages.com/gramophoneGuilty.mp3

The song is Guilty by Kahn, Akst, Whiting and sung by Steve Conway with
Jack Byfield & his Orchestra.

Both records were rescued from the dump, so are of unknown condition, but
were both cleaned with the RCM. They were played with the HMV needles,
which have to be changed for each side played.


I think we have come a long way since 1920.



Woah, hold on....!!!

If you take (most probably knackered) records off a dump, play them and
record them close enough to get spattered with alpha particles then that's
the sound you'll get. But I have heard 78 samples that were much, much
better and would suggest it would be a mistake to dismiss our ancestors as
having no standards at all!

See this site:

http://www.enhancedaudio.com/78_restoration.htm

Where you will find a 'noisy' version:

http://www.tracertek.com/Waves/MYSIN1.mp3

And a 'cleaned' (digital filtered, I believe) version:

http://www.tracertek.com/Waves/MYSINCLEAN.mp3

of the same clip.

It doesn't seem to take much to get a pretty good reproduction and I would
suggest/suspect the latter would be closer to SOA 78 of the era (pristine
discs and the right needles/methodology) when listened to at a normal,
'across the room' distance....??

(Even if not, it's a damn site more convenient than having to make the
crossing by sea to hear a bit of Caruso, at any rate!! ;-)

Nice Show N Tell though!! :-)


The mic was at 1.5m from the horn mouth, and at ear height. I accept,
however, that the records were most probably at fault, as I don't remember
it sounding so bad when I first got the thing almost 20 years ago. Sadly, I
don't have any other 78s to play.

S.

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
news

"Keith G" wrote


It doesn't seem to take much to get a pretty good reproduction and I
would suggest/suspect the latter would be closer to SOA 78 of the era
(pristine discs and the right needles/methodology) when listened to at a
normal, 'across the room' distance....??


The mic was at 1.5m from the horn mouth, and at ear height.


Still a bit fierce I would have thought? Difficult with a recording but very
easy to *listen* at say 2.5 - 3.5m which I would have thought would have
been probably the norm?? (Or it'd have to be the *sock*...!! ;-)

What mic, out of interest btw??



I accept,
however, that the records were most probably at fault, as I don't remember
it sounding so bad when I first got the thing almost 20 years ago.



I think I actually *regret* not getting into 78s a while back. Now that I
have a deck (3 of 'em, actually) that'll turn at 78 rpm, I'm *very* tempted
to get a 78 needle for one of my M75s......

???

Would be interesting....


Sadly, I
don't have any other 78s to play.


Time I post this you are probably going to miss out on this 'Hot Diggity' by
Perry Como:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HOT-DIGGITY-PE...QQcmdZViewItem

:-)

(I remember telling you this a while back - there's 874 various 78s on eBay
atm - if you get a move on, you could grab Tubby The Tuba by no less than
Danny Kaye!! :-)

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
news

"Keith G" wrote


It doesn't seem to take much to get a pretty good reproduction and I
would suggest/suspect the latter would be closer to SOA 78 of the era
(pristine discs and the right needles/methodology) when listened to at a
normal, 'across the room' distance....??


The mic was at 1.5m from the horn mouth, and at ear height.


Still a bit fierce I would have thought? Difficult with a recording but
very easy to *listen* at say 2.5 - 3.5m which I would have thought would
have been probably the norm?? (Or it'd have to be the *sock*...!! ;-)

What mic, out of interest btw??



I accept,
however, that the records were most probably at fault, as I don't
remember it sounding so bad when I first got the thing almost 20 years
ago.



I think I actually *regret* not getting into 78s a while back. Now that I
have a deck (3 of 'em, actually) that'll turn at 78 rpm, I'm *very*
tempted to get a 78 needle for one of my M75s......

???

Would be interesting....


Sadly, I
don't have any other 78s to play.


Time I post this you are probably going to miss out on this 'Hot Diggity'
by Perry Como:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/HOT-DIGGITY-PE...QQcmdZViewItem

:-)

(I remember telling you this a while back - there's 874 various 78s on
eBay atm - if you get a move on, you could grab Tubby The Tuba by no less
than Danny Kaye!! :-)


Microphone was the one part of the Radio Shack SLM. I sold my STC ribbons a
while back when I found I didn't have any use for them. Perhaps not the best
of microphones, but I would have thought quite good enough for this purpose.
The recording sounds pretty much as the real thing, so the mic isn't the
problem. As to buying 78s, the real problem is that as they aren't making
any more, *all* 78s are now 50 years old or more, and have had an uncertain
life. Even much later electric pickups were still groove-grinders. Buying
off Ebay won't be any more secure than car boot sales or the local dump. I
would also like to try a 78 stylus on my TTs, but, frankly, I have better
things to spend money on when all 78s I'm likely to play will be of
uncertain origins.

The gramophone sounds best when I'm in another room......

S.

"Serge Auckland" wrote


Microphone was the one part of the Radio Shack SLM.


OK.....


I sold my STC ribbons a
while back when I found I didn't have any use for them.


That sounds a bit precipitous....??


Perhaps not the best
of microphones, but I would have thought quite good enough for this
purpose. The recording sounds pretty much as the real thing, so the mic
isn't the problem. As to buying 78s, the real problem is that as they
aren't making any more, *all* 78s are now 50 years old or more, and have
had an uncertain life. Even much later electric pickups were still
groove-grinders. Buying off Ebay won't be any more secure than car boot
sales or the local dump.



Hmm, I would perhaps tend to disagree with that somewhat if the auction was
from a respectable dealer or someone who knew what they were doing...??


I
would also like to try a 78 stylus on my TTs, but, frankly, I have better
things to spend money on when all 78s I'm likely to play will be of
uncertain origins.



Yes, I think I'm going to resist the urge myself - what a Pandora's Box the
whole 78 thing could turn into!!!



The gramophone sounds best when I'm in another room......



Yep! Got one singing away right now (LP) - no surface noise out here!! ;-)

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Serge Auckland" wrote


Microphone was the one part of the Radio Shack SLM.


OK.....


I sold my STC ribbons a
while back when I found I didn't have any use for them.


That sounds a bit precipitous....??


Perhaps not the best
of microphones, but I would have thought quite good enough for this
purpose. The recording sounds pretty much as the real thing, so the mic
isn't the problem. As to buying 78s, the real problem is that as they
aren't making any more, *all* 78s are now 50 years old or more, and have
had an uncertain life. Even much later electric pickups were still
groove-grinders. Buying off Ebay won't be any more secure than car boot
sales or the local dump.



Hmm, I would perhaps tend to disagree with that somewhat if the auction
was from a respectable dealer or someone who knew what they were
doing...??


I
would also like to try a 78 stylus on my TTs, but, frankly, I have better
things to spend money on when all 78s I'm likely to play will be of
uncertain origins.



Yes, I think I'm going to resist the urge myself - what a Pandora's Box
the whole 78 thing could turn into!!!



The gramophone sounds best when I'm in another room......



Yep! Got one singing away right now (LP) - no surface noise out here!!
;-)


Just what we need!

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Gramophone-Rec...QQcmdZViewItem

S.