I have been disappointed with the audio quality of some CDs I have
bought recently. Is there a free program I can use to get an accepted
measurement of fidelity? (like a signal to noise ratio)

I have my suspicious that some may have been stored an MP3s and then
"unripped" in the factory. So how can I tell for certain if my CD has
been an MP3, or other lossy format? I'd hope mp3 storage would leave
different markers than the original tape, for example.

To get a good measure I'd expect some Fourier transforms and signal
analysis to be done, so this should be relevant to sci.physics.

On Jun 22, 6:18 pm, Dave wrote:
I have been disappointed with the audio quality of some CDs I have
bought recently. Is there a free program I can use to get an accepted
measurement of fidelity? (like a signal to noise ratio)

I have my suspicious that some may have been stored an MP3s and then
"unripped" in the factory. So how can I tell for certain if my CD has
been an MP3, or other lossy format? I'd hope mp3 storage would leave
different markers than the original tape, for example.

There's no particularly good reason why the "factory"
would want to do such a things.

There's a far more mundane explanation. Recent
music distribution, including CDs, have suffered
from an industry-wide of sever over compression,
limiting and clipping, as an endemic result of the
mastering process. There's been this headlong
to produce "louder and louder" CDs. Many producers
have decided, quite incorrectly, to equate louder
with better.

The result is a dramatic deterioration of available
music,especially in the pop music genres. It
has nothing to do with MP3, it has everything to
do with overall incompetence and disregard of high
production standards.

To get a good measure I'd expect some Fourier transforms and signal
analysis to be done, so this should be relevant to sci.physics.

Nope, simply any peak-to-average measurement
should reveal an overl trend in this direction over the
last decade or so.

In rec.audio.tech wrote:
On Jun 22, 6:18 pm, Dave wrote:
I have been disappointed with the audio quality of some CDs I have
bought recently. Is there a free program I can use to get an accepted
measurement of fidelity? (like a signal to noise ratio)

I have my suspicious that some may have been stored an MP3s and then
"unripped" in the factory. So how can I tell for certain if my CD has
been an MP3, or other lossy format? I'd hope mp3 storage would leave
different markers than the original tape, for example.

There's no particularly good reason why the "factory"
would want to do such a things.

There's a far more mundane explanation. Recent
music distribution, including CDs, have suffered
from an industry-wide of sever over compression,
limiting and clipping, as an endemic result of the
mastering process.

I'd suggest that this isn't a recent phenomenon. I've got plenty of pop
vinyl from the 1970s and 1980s that has roughly no dynamics. Making crap
sound louder on the radio at the complete expense of quality is decades old.

Colin

In article ,
Colin B. wrote:
There's a far more mundane explanation. Recent
music distribution, including CDs, have suffered
from an industry-wide of sever over compression,
limiting and clipping, as an endemic result of the
mastering process.

I'd suggest that this isn't a recent phenomenon. I've got plenty of pop
vinyl from the 1970s and 1980s that has roughly no dynamics. Making crap
sound louder on the radio at the complete expense of quality is decades
old.

There's a difference in how this was acheived, though. In older days it
was through the arrangement of the music and studio recording practices.
The Phil Spector 'wall of sound' for example.
These days it's done using largely automatic processors after the studio
recording is signed off. Similar to the types used for processing radio at
the transmitters.

--
*Does fuzzy logic tickle? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 04:53:54 -0400, Dave Plowman (News) wrote
(in article ):

In article ,
Colin B. wrote:
There's a far more mundane explanation. Recent
music distribution, including CDs, have suffered
from an industry-wide of sever over compression,
limiting and clipping, as an endemic result of the
mastering process.

I'd suggest that this isn't a recent phenomenon. I've got plenty of pop
vinyl from the 1970s and 1980s that has roughly no dynamics. Making crap
sound louder on the radio at the complete expense of quality is decades
old.

There's a difference in how this was acheived, though. In older days it
was through the arrangement of the music and studio recording practices.
The Phil Spector 'wall of sound' for example.
These days it's done using largely automatic processors after the studio
recording is signed off. Similar to the types used for processing radio at
the transmitters.



I'll respectfully disgree, Dave. Colin's right. In the US, anyway.

In our local songwriters ass'n compilation CD, two years ago, we had several
entries that were mp3 and NOT particularly well done. We let it go in the
name of art. (Not this year though.)

Lots of artifacts and reduced bandwidth that's what you look (listen) for.
Try MP3ing them and see if they don't fall apart even more precipitously
relative to normal wav files.

Regards,

Ty Ford


--Audio Equipment Reviews Audio Production Services
Acting and Voiceover Demos http://www.tyford.com
Guitar player?:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RZJ9MptZmU

In article ,
Ty Ford wrote:
There's a difference in how this was acheived, though. In older days
it was through the arrangement of the music and studio recording
practices. The Phil Spector 'wall of sound' for example. These days
it's done using largely automatic processors after the studio
recording is signed off. Similar to the types used for processing
radio at the transmitters.



I'll respectfully disgree, Dave. Colin's right. In the US, anyway.

In our local songwriters ass'n compilation CD, two years ago, we had
several entries that were mp3 and NOT particularly well done. We let it
go in the name of art. (Not this year though.)

I'm not quite sure what that has to do with commercial recordings?

Lots of artifacts and reduced bandwidth that's what you look (listen)
for. Try MP3ing them and see if they don't fall apart even more
precipitously relative to normal wav files.

--
*Real men don't waste their hormones growing hair

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Colin B." wrote


I'd suggest that this isn't a recent phenomenon. I've got plenty of
pop
vinyl from the 1970s and 1980s that has roughly no dynamics.



Yep, you bought it so *they* kept on supplying it - same thing's
happening today, apparently. Where's the problem?


Making crap
sound louder on the radio at the complete expense of quality is
decades old.


Compressed audio like 'Classic FM' on a car radio works very well,
actually....

On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 07:13:28 -0400, Keith G wrote
(in article ):


"Colin B." wrote


I'd suggest that this isn't a recent phenomenon. I've got plenty of
pop
vinyl from the 1970s and 1980s that has roughly no dynamics.



Yep, you bought it so *they* kept on supplying it - same thing's
happening today, apparently. Where's the problem?


Making crap
sound louder on the radio at the complete expense of quality is
decades old.


Compressed audio like 'Classic FM' on a car radio works very well,
actually....



Not so well when they play MP3 versus CD cuts. Locally, the oldies station
WZBA has enough crunch on their MP3s that I can't really crank a CCR tune as
loud as I want in the car because the distortion stops me. That's just a buzz
kill. (could be another problem in their audio chain, but I don't think so.)

Regards,

Ty Forf

--Audio Equipment Reviews Audio Production Services
Acting and Voiceover Demos http://www.tyford.com
Guitar player?:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RZJ9MptZmU

"Ty Ford" wrote in message
. ..
On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 07:13:28 -0400, Keith G wrote
(in article ):


"Colin B." wrote


I'd suggest that this isn't a recent phenomenon. I've got plenty of
pop
vinyl from the 1970s and 1980s that has roughly no dynamics.



Yep, you bought it so *they* kept on supplying it - same thing's
happening today, apparently. Where's the problem?


Making crap
sound louder on the radio at the complete expense of quality is
decades old.


Compressed audio like 'Classic FM' on a car radio works very well,
actually....



Not so well when they play MP3 versus CD cuts. Locally, the oldies station
WZBA has enough crunch on their MP3s that I can't really crank a CCR tune
as
loud as I want in the car because the distortion stops me. That's just a
buzz
kill. (could be another problem in their audio chain, but I don't think
so.)

Regards,

Ty Forf

--Audio Equipment Reviews Audio Production Services
Acting and Voiceover Demos http://www.tyford.com
Guitar player?:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4RZJ9MptZmU

Maybe we should be grateful that here in the UK, the BBC and our larger
commercial stations won't allow the use of MP2/3 or MiniDisc source material
except in unusual circumstances. As far as I know, GCap (GWR and Capital
Groups) and the BBC's hard-disc playout systems are all linear, as are the
studio-transmitter links. Whilst they do have very heavy audio compression
in the transmission processor, the FM signal stays linear from CD through to
FM transmitter. The reason for this is that the same signal is used for the
DSat and DAB feeds, and they found that multiple codings gave unacceptable
results on DAB, especially at the low bit rates currently used.

S.

--
http://audiopages.googlepages.com

"Ty Ford" wrote in message
. ..
On Sat, 23 Jun 2007 07:13:28 -0400, Keith G wrote
(in article ):


"Colin B." wrote


I'd suggest that this isn't a recent phenomenon. I've got plenty of
pop
vinyl from the 1970s and 1980s that has roughly no dynamics.



Yep, you bought it so *they* kept on supplying it - same thing's
happening today, apparently. Where's the problem?


Making crap
sound louder on the radio at the complete expense of quality is
decades old.


Compressed audio like 'Classic FM' on a car radio works very well,
actually....



Not so well when they play MP3 versus CD cuts. Locally, the oldies
station
WZBA has enough crunch on their MP3s that I can't really crank a CCR
tune as
loud as I want in the car because the distortion stops me. That's just
a buzz
kill. (could be another problem in their audio chain, but I don't
think so.)


Once again, I didn't spot the crossposting!!

I should have said: In the UK, Classic FM don't sound too bad on the car
radio!! (I see others have said that we don't broadcast from lo-res MP3s
in the UK??)