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-   -   Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's) (https://www.audiobanter.co.uk/uk-rec-audio-general-audio/7186-improving-loudspeaker-crossovers-sbls.html)

Keith G January 7th 08 01:34 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Keith G" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Eeyore" wrote
in message
Keith G wrote:

but let's not forget the far superior 'information
carrying' capacity of CDs - the average LP lasts
approximately 7 minutes per side;

Uh ? More like 20 mins IIRC.

Agreed. Except that LPs are generally so bad that it is
questionable whether you can call the corrupted mess
that can be recovered from them *music*.


Catch a grip, Arny....


Pseudo-Dr., cure yourself first!




What cure do I need? I use SS and valve amps, 'horns' and 'normal' speakers
on a regular (daily) basis; I listen to analogue and digital audio according
to my requirements at any particular time and I simply don't care who else
does what and which they prefer...

Look to yourself, Arny - you're the one with a serious bug up your arse...



Keith G January 7th 08 01:36 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Keith G" wrote in message

"Eiron" wrote in message
...
Eeyore wrote:

I HAVE heard bad CD players such as the original Sony
CDP-101. It souded 'harsh'
to me (one can speculate over what casued that) and I
was convinced that reverberation was being truncated
(although that could have been the result of
flawed mastering).

Me too. I never discovered whether it was my neighbour's
CDP-101, the 'Realistic'
amp and speakers or the 1980's music but something gave
me a headache.



Hmm, spoilt for choice there...


Perhaps he's still got it in the junk box; it would be
interesting to find out how bad it was.



Then you could stick pins in your eyes to round the
evening off....


Or, listen to LPs through a SET amplifier and a metal-coned full-range
speaker driver.



Playing one of your 'purple smock' Gospel recordings?




Keith G January 7th 08 01:38 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Serge Auckland" wrote in
message
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Eeyore" wrote
in message
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with
the sound of the CD format since it is sonically
transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different
for the sake of being different, and gettting attention
is behind most of the adamant LP preference we see
expressed around here.


Add to that a liking for horn loudspeakers, and we have
the triumvirate - vinyl-valves-horns. Coloration rules OK?


Agreed. It's the "Look at me, I'm weird" effect. These days, we might
call it the "Britney Spears Effect".


What is it *exactly* that you fear, Arny?



Keith G January 7th 08 01:42 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Eeyore" wrote in
message
Arny Krueger wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with
the sound of the CD format since it is sonically
transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different
for the sake of being different, and gettting attention
is behind most of the adamant LP preference we see
expressed around here.


One thing for sure ... I used to do a lot of headphone
listening. Still do in fact.


Other than doing live sound, I primarily listen through headphones.



Aha! Now that *does* explain a few things - all your bloody silly comments
about LPs are based on *headphone listening*??


Headphones reveal the failings of LPs very cruelly.
Listening on speakers seems to be less unkind to them.


That's because most rooms pretty well conceal tons of distortion and
noise.



That's a good 'un - even for you!! (Horse****ting himself now, it
seems...???)

'Nuff said, Arny - I, for one, know exactly where you're coming from now!







Keith G January 7th 08 01:54 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Bob Latham" wrote in message


Why would DVD A or Sony's super effort (can't remember)
even exist if CDs were transparent?


It's hardly the first time someone tried to make money by making
nonsensical technical claims. It looks like Sony and Philips lost
millions, so they got their just desserts.




Admirable the way Arnold B Katzenjammer struggles on with the English
language - he's getting quite a lot of it right these days!!

:-)


Now, Philips and Sony losing millions?

Don't know about Sony - they might be sweating, but Philips losing
'millions' would be a lot less devastating than Arny leaving his umbrella
down at the Welfare Offices, I would have thought....


Keith G January 7th 08 02:13 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Bob Latham" wrote in message


Why would DVD A or Sony's super effort (can't remember)
even exist if CDs were transparent?


It's hardly the first time someone tried to make money by making
nonsensical technical claims. It looks like Sony and Philips lost
millions, so they got their just desserts.




Admirable the way Arnold B Katzenjammer struggles on with the English
language - he's getting quite a lot of it right these days!!

:-)


Now, Philips and Sony losing millions?

Don't know about Sony - they might be sweating, but Philips losing
'millions' would be a lot less devastating than Arny leaving his umbrella
down at the Welfare Offices, I would have thought....



OK, I am informed that Philip's 2006 turnover was 27,000,000,000 Euros and
that Sony has just done 18,000,000,000 USD in 'Quarter 2', 2007 (?) so maybe
they ain't sweating that hard after all....



Arny Krueger January 7th 08 06:37 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

What cure do I need?


I'm not a Dr., but I know sick when I see it sometimes.

I use SS and valve amps, 'horns' and 'normal' speakers on a regular
(daily) basis;


Begging the question why you claim that the bottles always sound better,
given all the contrary evidence that must be at hand.

I listen to analogue and digital audio according


Begging the question why you claim that the rock being dragged in a ditch
always sounds better, given all the contrary evidence that must be at hand.




Arny Krueger January 7th 08 06:37 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Keith G" wrote in message

"Eiron" wrote in message
...
Eeyore wrote:

I HAVE heard bad CD players such as the original Sony
CDP-101. It souded 'harsh'
to me (one can speculate over what casued that) and I
was convinced that reverberation was being truncated
(although that could have been the result of
flawed mastering).

Me too. I never discovered whether it was my neighbour's
CDP-101, the 'Realistic'
amp and speakers or the 1980's music but something gave
me a headache.


Hmm, spoilt for choice there...


Perhaps he's still got it in the junk box; it would be
interesting to find out how bad it was.


Then you could stick pins in your eyes to round the
evening off....


Or, listen to LPs through a SET amplifier and a metal-coned full-range
speaker driver.


Playing one of your 'purple smock' Gospel recordings?


Wrong style of worship.



Arny Krueger January 7th 08 06:38 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Serge Auckland" wrote in
message
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Eeyore" wrote
in message
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with
the sound of the CD format since it is sonically
transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different
for the sake of being different, and gettting attention
is behind most of the adamant LP preference we see
expressed around here.

Add to that a liking for horn loudspeakers, and we have
the triumvirate - vinyl-valves-horns. Coloration rules OK?


Agreed. It's the "Look at me, I'm weird" effect. These days, we might
call it the "Britney Spears Effect".


What is it *exactly* that you fear, Arny?


No fear.



Arny Krueger January 7th 08 06:39 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

Now, Philips and Sony losing millions?


On the specific product lines mentioned.




Keith G January 7th 08 10:35 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

What cure do I need?


I'm not a Dr., but I know sick when I see it sometimes.

I use SS and valve amps, 'horns' and 'normal' speakers on a regular
(daily) basis;


Begging the question why you claim that the bottles always sound better,
given all the contrary evidence that must be at hand.



Done tole you a hunnerd times - there's mo

space
air
depth
tone
clarity
sweetness

with valves...



I listen to analogue and digital audio according


Begging the question why you claim that the rock being dragged in a ditch
always sounds better, given all the contrary evidence that must be at
hand.



And this one again (do you *ever* pay any attention?) - because there's
mo

detail
imaging
soundstaging
warmth
bass
realism


What about the 'horns'? Don't you want to ask about them too?





Keith G January 7th 08 10:44 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Keith G" wrote in message

"Eiron" wrote in message
...
Eeyore wrote:

I HAVE heard bad CD players such as the original Sony
CDP-101. It souded 'harsh'
to me (one can speculate over what casued that) and I
was convinced that reverberation was being truncated
(although that could have been the result of
flawed mastering).

Me too. I never discovered whether it was my neighbour's
CDP-101, the 'Realistic'
amp and speakers or the 1980's music but something gave
me a headache.


Hmm, spoilt for choice there...


Perhaps he's still got it in the junk box; it would be
interesting to find out how bad it was.


Then you could stick pins in your eyes to round the
evening off....

Or, listen to LPs through a SET amplifier and a metal-coned full-range
speaker driver.


Playing one of your 'purple smock' Gospel recordings?


Wrong style of worship.




Oh, so this wasn't one of your gigs then?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHDw6...eature=related





Keith G January 7th 08 10:47 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Serge Auckland" wrote in
message
"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Eeyore" wrote
in message
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with
the sound of the CD format since it is sonically
transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different
for the sake of being different, and gettting attention
is behind most of the adamant LP preference we see
expressed around here.

Add to that a liking for horn loudspeakers, and we have
the triumvirate - vinyl-valves-horns. Coloration rules OK?

Agreed. It's the "Look at me, I'm weird" effect. These days, we might
call it the "Britney Spears Effect".


What is it *exactly* that you fear, Arny?


No fear.



Impressive...

(To fear *no fear* is very wise indeed...)






Keith G January 7th 08 10:48 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

Now, Philips and Sony losing millions?


On the specific product lines mentioned.



When outfits like Philips and Sony 'lose money' it's the taxpayers who make
up the shortfall....



Eeyore January 7th 08 11:51 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

space
air
depth
tone
clarity
sweetness

with valves...


SNORT.

I wonder if AP will make a 'sweetness' meter one day ?

Graham


Eeyore January 7th 08 11:53 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

realism


Realistic to YOU or to ME ?

That's where using subjective judgements falls right on its face.

Graham


Keith G January 8th 08 01:28 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

space
air
depth
tone
clarity
sweetness

with valves...


SNORT.



****.



I wonder if AP will make a 'sweetness' meter one day ?



You already got a spacemeter, airmeter, depthmeter, tonemeter and
claritymeter then?




Keith G January 8th 08 01:31 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

realism


Realistic to YOU or to ME ?



Me - who GAS what sounds realistic to you?



That's where using subjective judgements falls right on its face.



Don't be silly....




Eeyore January 8th 08 08:27 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

realism


Realistic to YOU or to ME ?


Me - who GAS what sounds realistic to you?


And who GAS what sounds realistic to YOU ?


That's where using subjective judgements falls right on its face.


Don't be silly....


What's silly about pointing out the huge failings of a merit system that
relies on one person's individual foibles ?

Graham



Keith G January 8th 08 11:07 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

realism

Realistic to YOU or to ME ?


Me - who GAS what sounds realistic to you?


And who GAS what sounds realistic to YOU ?



You, evidently - by the way you keep responding to my posts....




That's where using subjective judgements falls right on its face.


Don't be silly....


What's silly about pointing out the huge failings of a merit system that
relies on one person's individual foibles ?



You've pointed out nothing....




Arny Krueger January 8th 08 06:38 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

What cure do I need?


I'm not a Dr., but I know sick when I see it sometimes.

I use SS and valve amps, 'horns' and 'normal' speakers on a regular
(daily) basis;


Begging the question why you claim that the bottles always sound better,
given all the contrary evidence that must be at hand.


Done tole you a hunnerd times - there's mo


space
air
depth
tone
clarity
sweetness

with valves...


It is almost like Keith doesn't understand that I come from a generation
that had nothing but tubes to listen to for almost 20 years.

All but a tiny minority of people from my generation know that there's less

space
air
depth
tone
clarity
sweetness


and far more expense and general hassle

with valves...


The billions of us who happily switched to solid state can't be wrong! ;-)



Keith G January 8th 08 07:16 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

What cure do I need?

I'm not a Dr., but I know sick when I see it sometimes.

I use SS and valve amps, 'horns' and 'normal' speakers on a regular
(daily) basis;

Begging the question why you claim that the bottles always sound better,
given all the contrary evidence that must be at hand.


Done tole you a hunnerd times - there's mo


space
air
depth
tone
clarity
sweetness

with valves...


It is almost like Keith doesn't understand that I come from a generation
that had nothing but tubes to listen to for almost 20 years.



And then dropped his trousers for the 'perfect sound forever' on the latest
'solid state' gadgets because some marketing **** told him it was better!


The billions of us who happily switched to solid state can't be wrong! ;-)



Except the umpteen thousands who are now waking up and moving back to 'valve
and vinyl' now that the penny's finally dropped that they'd been had!




Arny Krueger January 8th 08 07:41 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..


It is almost like Keith doesn't understand that I come from a generation
that had nothing but tubes to listen to for almost 20 years.


And then dropped his trousers for the 'perfect sound forever' on the
latest 'solid state' gadgets because some marketing **** told him it was
better!


No, my ears told me that if a piece of tubed equipment didn't already sound
like **** compared to SS, just run the tubed piece for a few months to a
year or two until the tubes got tired.

There was a reason why there were tube checkers in just about every
electronics, hardware and drug store in the US in those days - the tubed
gear stopped working so well, and a bad tube was a likely explanation.

The billions of us who happily switched to solid state can't be wrong!
;-)


Except the umpteen thousands who are now waking up and moving back to
'valve and vinyl' now that the penny's finally dropped that they'd been
had!


There's a few bad apples in every bunch - people who simply don't get it no
matter how obvious the relevant facts are.




Eeyore January 8th 08 11:25 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

"Arny Krueger" wrote

The billions of us who happily switched to solid state can't be wrong! ;-)


Except the umpteen thousands who are now waking up and moving back to 'valve
and vinyl' now that the penny's finally dropped that they'd been had!


You like to flaunt your gullibility do you ?

I suspect you've never heard a really good solid state amplifier. For one thing,
your bias would probably exclude one from your consideration.

Graham



Keith G January 9th 08 01:02 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..


It is almost like Keith doesn't understand that I come from a generation
that had nothing but tubes to listen to for almost 20 years.


And then dropped his trousers for the 'perfect sound forever' on the
latest 'solid state' gadgets because some marketing **** told him it was
better!


No, my ears told me that if a piece of tubed equipment didn't already
sound like **** compared to SS,



In your dreams....


just run the tubed piece for a few months to a
year or two until the tubes got tired.

There was a reason why there were tube checkers in just about every
electronics, hardware and drug store in the US in those days - the tubed
gear stopped working so well, and a bad tube was a likely explanation.



From what I gather most of those stores had a foot pedal on the checker that
made every valve look like it needed replacing - how many times you got took
like that, Arny?




The billions of us who happily switched to solid state can't be wrong!
;-)


Except the umpteen thousands who are now waking up and moving back to
'valve and vinyl' now that the penny's finally dropped that they'd been
had!


There's a few bad apples in every bunch - people who simply don't get it
no matter how obvious the relevant facts are.



You're just a tad outta date - I think you should make the effort to read
one or two of the current UK audio comix to get an idea which way the wind's
blowing these days...



Keith G January 9th 08 01:07 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

"Arny Krueger" wrote

The billions of us who happily switched to solid state can't be wrong!
;-)


Except the umpteen thousands who are now waking up and moving back to
'valve
and vinyl' now that the penny's finally dropped that they'd been had!


You like to flaunt your gullibility do you ?



No more than you like to flaunt your silliness...



I suspect you've never heard a really good solid state amplifier.



No, I have to say I haven't really - but then I suspect you haven't
either...


For one thing,
your bias would probably exclude one from your consideration.



No - given that it seems you've got to spend about £3.5K to match a 300 quid
Chinese valve amp, it's my pocket that exludes them from casual
investigation...




David Looser January 9th 08 05:22 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 
"Keith G" wrote in message
...


No - given that it seems you've got to spend about £3.5K to match a 300
quid Chinese valve amp, it's my pocket that exludes them from casual
investigation...


How on earth can an amplifier cost £3.5K? Unless the chassis is gold-plated,
or it's hand-built by a Swiss craftsman. Neither of which make any
difference to the performance.

David.



Serge Auckland January 9th 08 05:43 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 
"David Looser" wrote in message
...
"Keith G" wrote in message
...


No - given that it seems you've got to spend about £3.5K to match a 300
quid Chinese valve amp, it's my pocket that exludes them from casual
investigation...


How on earth can an amplifier cost £3.5K? Unless the chassis is
gold-plated, or it's hand-built by a Swiss craftsman. Neither of which
make any difference to the performance.

David.

I think the answer is that it doesn't *cost* £3.5K, that's the *price*. The
factory cost, excluding marketing expenses, dealer's margin etc will be a
*whole* lot less.

S.


--
http://audiopages.googlepages.com



Keith G January 9th 08 06:40 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"David Looser" wrote in message
...
"Keith G" wrote in message
...


No - given that it seems you've got to spend about £3.5K to match a 300
quid Chinese valve amp, it's my pocket that exludes them from casual
investigation...


How on earth can an amplifier cost £3.5K?



See Serge's reply.....


Unless the chassis is gold-plated,
or it's hand-built by a Swiss craftsman. Neither of which make any
difference to the performance.



How do you know that?




Keith G January 9th 08 06:49 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Serge Auckland" wrote in message
...
"David Looser" wrote in message
...
"Keith G" wrote in message
...


No - given that it seems you've got to spend about £3.5K to match a 300
quid Chinese valve amp, it's my pocket that exludes them from casual
investigation...


How on earth can an amplifier cost £3.5K? Unless the chassis is
gold-plated, or it's hand-built by a Swiss craftsman. Neither of which
make any difference to the performance.

David.

I think the answer is that it doesn't *cost* £3.5K, that's the *price*.
The factory cost, excluding marketing expenses, dealer's margin etc will
be a *whole* lot less.



On the nail as usual, Serge....

But my remark was not as facetious as it might have appeared - there's not
much doubt that the normal 'thin-slice' SS amplifiers stand no chance
against an OK valve amp in my book, but once you get up into the
'arc-welder' bracket to the amps which weigh a bit and have serious power
supplies I'm sure (but I don't *know*) that a 3 cwt/3 grand solid state amp
(running as hot as a forge) can probably offer the same 'sonics' as a valve
amp probably weighing a bit less and probably costing a lot less (but
probably still running just as hot) - no?

Anybody got first hand experience of a truly *serious* SS amp?

(Where's Pinky when you need him? :-)



Eeyore January 9th 08 08:21 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


David Looser wrote:

"Keith G" wrote

No - given that it seems you've got to spend about £3.5K to match a 300
quid Chinese valve amp, it's my pocket that exludes them from casual
investigation...


How on earth can an amplifier cost £3.5K? Unless the chassis is gold-plated,
or it's hand-built by a Swiss craftsman. Neither of which make any
difference to the performance.


And since when was a £300 Chinese amp any benchmark ?

Graham


Eeyore January 9th 08 08:23 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

I'm sure (but I don't *know*) that a 3 cwt/3 grand solid state amp
(running as hot as a forge) can probably offer the same 'sonics' as a valve
amp


No. The SS amp will never produce as much distortion as the valve amp. Unless
it's been designed to distort of course,

Graham


Eeyore January 9th 08 08:24 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

Anybody got first hand experience of a truly *serious* SS amp?


Yes. One I designed myself. Mosfet output stage with 24 power devices.

Graham


Keith G January 9th 08 10:01 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

I'm sure (but I don't *know*) that a 3 cwt/3 grand solid state amp
(running as hot as a forge) can probably offer the same 'sonics' as a
valve
amp


No. The SS amp will never produce as much distortion as the valve amp.
Unless
it's been designed to distort of course,




Anybody runs any amp into audible distortion deserves all he gets....




Keith G January 9th 08 10:03 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

Anybody got first hand experience of a truly *serious* SS amp?


Yes. One I designed myself. Mosfet output stage with 24 power devices.



Sounds pretty efficient - beats the **** out of one triode per channel then?




Keith G January 9th 08 10:06 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


David Looser wrote:

"Keith G" wrote

No - given that it seems you've got to spend about £3.5K to match a 300
quid Chinese valve amp, it's my pocket that exludes them from casual
investigation...


How on earth can an amplifier cost £3.5K? Unless the chassis is
gold-plated,
or it's hand-built by a Swiss craftsman. Neither of which make any
difference to the performance.


And since when was a £300 Chinese amp any benchmark ?




Since that's all I spent on one - which, asitappens, after a phone call
earlier this evening appears now to be sold to a bloke who came here to
see/hear my Dynaco Mk IIIs and went away with my Bez 300B SET to try on his,
er, ESL57s...!!!



Eeyore January 9th 08 10:22 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

I'm sure (but I don't *know*) that a 3 cwt/3 grand solid state amp
(running as hot as a forge) can probably offer the same 'sonics' as a
valve amp


No. The SS amp will never produce as much distortion as the valve amp.
Unless it's been designed to distort of course,


Anybody runs any amp into audible distortion deserves all he gets....


Define audible.

Graham



Eeyore January 9th 08 10:24 PM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 


Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

Anybody got first hand experience of a truly *serious* SS amp?


Yes. One I designed myself. Mosfet output stage with 24 power devices.


Sounds pretty efficient - beats the **** out of one triode per channel then?


It'll drive rock and roll rigs too. 600wpc into 4 ohms - around 900 wpc into 2.

As a monitor amplifier it was just lovely. Totally neutral.

Graham



Keith G January 10th 08 12:06 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

I'm sure (but I don't *know*) that a 3 cwt/3 grand solid state amp
(running as hot as a forge) can probably offer the same 'sonics' as a
valve amp

No. The SS amp will never produce as much distortion as the valve amp.
Unless it's been designed to distort of course,


Anybody runs any amp into audible distortion deserves all he gets....


Define audible.



Define 'define'...




Keith G January 10th 08 12:08 AM

Improving loudspeaker crossovers (SBL's)
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

Anybody got first hand experience of a truly *serious* SS amp?

Yes. One I designed myself. Mosfet output stage with 24 power devices.


Sounds pretty efficient - beats the **** out of one triode per channel
then?


It'll drive rock and roll rigs too. 600wpc into 4 ohms - around 900 wpc
into 2.

As a monitor amplifier it was just lovely. Totally neutral.




'Was'...??

You don't still have it?





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