TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Dear all,

I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Cheers Max

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

In article
,
max graff wrote:
Dear all,

I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Well Cobras produce snake oil but I don't know about Chameleons. Do they
change colour with the mod?

Cheers Max

--
*Elephants are the only mammals that can't jump *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

On Jul 11, 8:07*pm, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:
In article
,
* *max graff wrote:

Dear all,
I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Well Cobras produce snake oil but I don't know about Chameleons. Do they
change colour with the mod?

Cheers Max

--
*Elephants are the only mammals that can't jump *

* * Dave Plowman * * * * * * * * London SW
* * * * * * * * * To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Stop jumping you elephant. If you dun have an answer to my question
kindly sush up.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

max graff wrote:

Stop jumping you elephant. If you dun have an answer to my question
kindly sush up.

Try an audio forum. This lot here unfortunately have seen the light, and
won't be swayed from the facts.

--
Adrian C

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"max graff" wrote in message
...
On Jul 11, 8:07 pm, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:
In article
,
max graff wrote:

Dear all,
I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Well Cobras produce snake oil but I don't know about Chameleons. Do they
change colour with the mod?

Cheers Max

--
*Elephants are the only mammals that can't jump *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Stop jumping you elephant. If you dun have an answer to my question
kindly sush up.



Max as I have just posted to you on aus.hi-fi that you are on a hiding to
nowhere with this. Any reputable audio group will only have a laugh at your
expense with this question. I would suggest you do some more reading and
include Google search results on "Snake Oil" ;-)

Cheers TT

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected left channel and left
speaker with my chords and the right channel and right speaker with my
cobras. Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left, perfect right,
BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone ideas?

--
John the West Ham fan C.E.T.



"max graff" wrote in message
...
Dear all,

I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Cheers Max

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

housetrained wrote:
Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected left channel and
left speaker with my chords and the right channel and right speaker with
my cobras. Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left, perfect
right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone ideas?


Yup. First it wasn't blind - you knew what was connected where,
therefore all that follows is void. Second, the only way you could get
that result is if you were playing different material through the two
channels. A lesser effect would occur if you managed to wire the two
speakers out of phase with each other, but you wouldn't get perfect left
and perfect right. You would certainly get no centre, but everything
else wafting vaguely around the speaker space.

d

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

housetrained wrote:
Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected left channel and
left speaker with my chords and the right channel and right speaker with
my cobras. Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left, perfect
right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone ideas?

Reversed polarity in one cable.

--
Eiron.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"max graff" wrote in message

Dear all,

I have been using the adorable Chord Company
interconnects and speaker cables for a while.

I have two adorable grand daughters.

The previous sentence makes sense, and is even a little true. Your's doesn't
and can't be.

I checked the archives and found that you posted the following about a year
back:

"Explain this - what's a mere cable got to do with adding extra bass?
As far as I know a cable is a cable with no processing happening
within it. "

How come you weren't able to hold that thought?

Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects against the Chameleons?

So, we're talking orange-flavored versus lemon-flavored snake oil here?

Why would anybody with a brain and a life care?

If so I would like to know your experiences.

IOW Max, you're not the least interested in me as a person, just whether or
not I ever heard some certain audio cables?

Shallow or what? :-(

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"housetrained" wrote in message


Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected
left channel and left speaker with my chords and the
right channel and right speaker with my cobras.

What was blind about this?

Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left,
perfect right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone
ideas?

Yeah, this often happens with speaker cables. You inadvertently hooked one
cable up with reversed polarity as compared to the other.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

max graff wrote:

Dear all,

I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Why are you so stupid to think a piece of wire can 'have a sound' ?

Does you car stereo sound better when you fill the tank with Shell ?

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Adrian C wrote:

max graff wrote:

Stop jumping you elephant. If you dun have an answer to my question
kindly sush up.

Try an audio forum. This lot here unfortunately have seen the light, and
won't be swayed from the facts.

Audio Voodoo can only be practiced in the DARK !

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

housetrained wrote:

Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected left channel and left
speaker with my chords and the right channel and right speaker with my
cobras. Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left, perfect right,
BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone ideas?

You need balanced wiring.

An obvious example. ;~)

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Don Pearce wrote:

housetrained wrote:
Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected left channel and
left speaker with my chords and the right channel and right speaker with
my cobras. Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left, perfect
right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone ideas?

Yup. First it wasn't blind - you knew what was connected where,
therefore all that follows is void. Second, the only way you could get
that result is if you were playing different material through the two
channels. A lesser effect would occur if you managed to wire the two
speakers out of phase with each other, but you wouldn't get perfect left
and perfect right. You would certainly get no centre, but everything
else wafting vaguely around the speaker space.

Never mind how much his hearing altered in the intervening period.

I thought it was a joke though ?

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Eiron wrote:

housetrained wrote:
Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected left channel and
left speaker with my chords and the right channel and right speaker with
my cobras. Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left, perfect
right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone ideas?

Reversed polarity in one cable.

On an UNbalanced cable ?

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Arny Krueger wrote:

"housetrained" wrote

Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected
left channel and left speaker with my chords and the
right channel and right speaker with my cobras.

What was blind about this?

Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left,
perfect right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone
ideas?

Yeah, this often happens with speaker cables. You inadvertently hooked one
cable up with reversed polarity as compared to the other.

Now if they used XLRs or SPEAKONs there'd be no chance of that !

He didn't say there was no bass though.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Eeyore" wrote in
message
Arny Krueger wrote:

"housetrained" wrote

Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected
left channel and left speaker with my chords and the
right channel and right speaker with my cobras.

What was blind about this?

Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left,
perfect right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone
ideas?

Yeah, this often happens with speaker cables. You
inadvertently hooked one cable up with reversed polarity
as compared to the other.

Now if they used XLRs or SPEAKONs there'd be no chance
of that !

Right, but pro audio technology is verboten in the weird world of
audiophilia. Just because it was the technology that was used to make the
recordings in the first place is meaningless to your average audiophile.
Remember those idiots from aus.hi-fi who thought that balanced interfaces
would not be beneficial in home audio systems?

He didn't say there was no bass though.

A lot of audiophile speakers are so weak in the bass department that there
may be nothing to cancel out.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Eeyore wrote:

Eiron wrote:

housetrained wrote:
Tried a blind listening test the other day. Connected left channel and
left speaker with my chords and the right channel and right speaker with
my cobras. Absolutely amazing - no centre AT ALL. Perfect left, perfect
right, BUT NO centre stage. Phenomenal. Anyone ideas?
Reversed polarity in one cable.

On an UNbalanced cable ?

Graham

You're an ass, Eeyore. He's referring to speaker cable.

--
Eiron.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"max graff" wrote in message
...
Dear all,

I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Cheers Max

I did lots of reviews when companies made wild and incredible claims about
audio cables and video cables. I found that 6mm twin and earth mains cable
give perfect results, exactly the same as the leads costing hundreds of
pounds.
Even 2.5mm mains cable was better than some of the audio leads on sale.
Quality would only be reduced if you used hundreds of feet of normal speaker
cable. Power handling is related to the size of the cable too.

Don't be conned, don't throw your money away.

HDMI cables are the next big con. A £2 one from your local shop is just as
good as a £50 one from a company making claims they can't prove.
Trading Standards should really move in but they are cowards.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Paul P" wrote in message
...

"max graff" wrote in message
...
Dear all,

I have been using the adorable Chord Company interconnects and speaker
cables for a while. Has anyone reviewed TCI Cobra interconnects
against the Chameleons? If so I would like to know your experiences.

Cheers Max

I did lots of reviews when companies made wild and incredible claims about
audio cables and video cables. I found that 6mm twin and earth mains
cable
give perfect results, exactly the same as the leads costing hundreds of
pounds.
Even 2.5mm mains cable was better than some of the audio leads on sale.
Quality would only be reduced if you used hundreds of feet of normal
speaker
cable. Power handling is related to the size of the cable too.


I'd be interested in any evidence that there is any audible difference in
normal domestic use between 6sqmm and 2.5sqmm for lengths up to 10m.

Don't be conned, don't throw your money away.

Agreed.

David.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Paul P wrote:

I did lots of reviews when

You did nothing of the sort, Tiscali Idiot!!!!

--
Adrian C

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

In article ,
Paul P wrote:
I did lots of reviews when companies made wild and incredible claims
about audio cables and video cables. I found that 6mm twin and earth
mains cable give perfect results, exactly the same as the leads costing
hundreds of pounds. Even 2.5mm mains cable was better than some of the
audio leads on sale. Quality would only be reduced if you used hundreds
of feet of normal speaker cable. Power handling is related to the size
of the cable too.

Just what sort of runs are you talking about to need 6mm cable? Or amp
power? 2.5mm is more than adequate for most domestic runs.

--
*Who are these kids and why are they calling me Mom?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Paul P wrote:

Trading Standards should really move in but they are cowards.

When I have a spare moment I have one example in particular.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

David Looser wrote:

I'd be interested in any evidence that there is any audible difference in
normal domestic use between 6sqmm and 2.5sqmm for lengths up to 10m.

What does the resistance difference work out to ? Data should be readily
available.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Eeyore wrote:

Paul P wrote:

Trading Standards should really move in but they are cowards.

When I have a spare moment I have one example in particular.

Graham



"Paul P" for the uninitiated is another dress for the morphing troll
known as the Tiscali Idiot. Don't expect much brilliance from him - it's
mostly fake.... Reviewers don't write with the fervour of a madman...

But not as fake as the story exposed from googling "asa russ andrews"

It would be interesting if googling just the words "russ andrews" would
show up all the derisory scam busting sites first. If you run an audio
web site visited by google's robots, you know exactly what to do....

Consider it a public service :-)

--
Adrian C

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

In article ,
Eeyore wrote:


David Looser wrote:

I'd be interested in any evidence that there is any audible difference
in normal domestic use between 6sqmm and 2.5sqmm for lengths up to 10m.

What does the resistance difference work out to ? Data should be readily
available.

Here's a handy voltage drop calculator which should give you the data you
want - with a bit of maths.

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technica...ltageDrop.html

Graham

--
*He who dies with the most toys is, nonetheless, dead.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Adrian C wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
Paul P wrote:

Trading Standards should really move in but they are cowards.

When I have a spare moment I have one example in particular.

"Paul P" for the uninitiated is another dress for the morphing troll
known as the Tiscali Idiot. Don't expect much brilliance from him - it's
mostly fake.... Reviewers don't write with the fervour of a madman...

But not as fake as the story exposed from googling "asa russ andrews"

Uh ? The ASA DID demand Russ Andrews remove certain claims.

Let me tell you how the ASA repsonded on another mattter.

Oh and now let me shoot myself for not organising my email better ! I can't
find the damn reply !

False or unverifiable claims ARE illegal under British Law.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

In article ,
Eeyore wrote:

David Looser wrote:

I'd be interested in any evidence that there is any audible difference
in normal domestic use between 6sqmm and 2.5sqmm for lengths up to 10m.

What does the resistance difference work out to ? Data should be readily
available.

Here's a handy voltage drop calculator which should give you the data you
want - with a bit of maths.

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technica...ltageDrop.html

I was hoping you'd do it for me since it was you who expressed interest.

It's more than 'volt drops' btw since speakers do not have constant impedance.

You need to know the R, L and C of cable. It makes a complex filter.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

In article , Eeyore
wrote:


"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

In article , Eeyore
wrote:

David Looser wrote:

I'd be interested in any evidence that there is any audible
difference in normal domestic use between 6sqmm and 2.5sqmm for
lengths up to 10m.

What does the resistance difference work out to ? Data should be
readily available.

Here's a handy voltage drop calculator which should give you the data
you want - with a bit of maths.

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technica...ltageDrop.html

I was hoping you'd do it for me since it was you who expressed interest.

No I didn't. ;-)

It's more than 'volt drops' btw since speakers do not have constant
impedance.

You need to know the R, L and C of cable. It makes a complex filter.

With the output impedance of a decent amp being 2 10ths of FA, the
capacitance of any practical cable doesn't matter. Nor should the
inductance with a properly designed amp. The only thing left - under
normal circumstances, ie likely domestic speaker runs - is the resistance.

Graham

--
*Someday, we'll look back on this, laugh nervously and change the subject

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , Eeyore
wrote:


I was hoping you'd do it for me since it was you who expressed interest.

No I didn't. ;-)

It was me, I'll have a go.

It's more than 'volt drops' btw since speakers do not have constant
impedance.

So the "volt drop" will vary with frequency, which will cause an additional
departure from a flat frequency response, to go with all the other
variations from a flat FR due to the recording, the speakers themselves, the
room, etc. etc. The question is how much does this actually matter?

You need to know the R, L and C of cable. It makes a complex filter.

With the output impedance of a decent amp being 2 10ths of FA, the
capacitance of any practical cable doesn't matter. Nor should the
inductance with a properly designed amp. The only thing left - under
normal circumstances, ie likely domestic speaker runs - is the resistance.

Precisely.

David.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

Eeyore wrote:
But not as fake as the story exposed from googling "asa russ andrews"

Uh ? The ASA DID demand Russ Andrews remove certain claims.

Oh, err, Opps :-)

I mean't to scribble "the story about the fake as exposed by googling"....

--
Adrian C

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"David Looser" wrote in message
...
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article , Eeyore
wrote:


I was hoping you'd do it for me since it was you who expressed interest.

No I didn't. ;-)

It was me, I'll have a go.


OK, according to that calculator 10m of 2.5sqmm cable will have a loop
resistance of 0.18 ohm, and 6sqmm 0.07 ohm. Into a 4 ohm load that
corresponds to a loss of 0.15dB for the 6sqmm and 0.38dB for the 2.5sqmm.

So if we have a hypothetical speaker with a minimum impedance of 4 ohm the
maximum possible variation from flat caused by this particular effect with
2.5sqmm cable is 0.38dB. This will be far smaller than variations due to the
frequency response of the speaker itself or due to the room, so I'm pretty
happy to declare it negligible.

David.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:
Eeyore wrote:
David Looser wrote:

I'd be interested in any evidence that there is any audible
difference in normal domestic use between 6sqmm and 2.5sqmm for
lengths up to 10m.

What does the resistance difference work out to ? Data should be
readily available.

Here's a handy voltage drop calculator which should give you the data
you want - with a bit of maths.

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Technica...ltageDrop.html

I was hoping you'd do it for me since it was you who expressed interest.

No I didn't. ;-)

No ?


It's more than 'volt drops' btw since speakers do not have constant
impedance.

You need to know the R, L and C of cable. It makes a complex filter.

With the output impedance of a decent amp being 2 10ths of FA,

So NOT a valve amp ?


the capacitance of any practical cable doesn't matter. Nor should the
inductance with a properly designed amp. The only thing left - under
normal circumstances, ie likely domestic speaker runs - is the resistance.

I think you need to revise that supposition. R dominates for sure but don't
ignore L and C. You may be surprised.

Active speakers aren't there by accident.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

David Looser wrote:

"Dave Plowman wrote
Eeyore wrote

I was hoping you'd do it for me since it was you who expressed interest.

No I didn't. ;-)

It was me, I'll have a go.

It's more than 'volt drops' btw since speakers do not have constant
impedance.

So the "volt drop" will vary with frequency, which will cause an additional
departure from a flat frequency response,

Absolutely RIGHT.

Any long speaker cable + uncompensated speaker load will form a complex filter
with a non-uniform frequency response.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

David Looser wrote:

"David Looser" wrote in message
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message

I was hoping you'd do it for me since it was you who expressed interest.

No I didn't. ;-)

It was me, I'll have a go.

OK, according to that calculator 10m of 2.5sqmm cable will have a loop
resistance of 0.18 ohm, and 6sqmm 0.07 ohm. Into a 4 ohm load that
corresponds to a loss of 0.15dB for the 6sqmm and 0.38dB for the 2.5sqmm.

Asssuming constant impedance across the frequency band. NOT very likely.


So if we have a hypothetical speaker with a minimum impedance of 4 ohm the
maximum possible variation from flat caused by this particular effect with
2.5sqmm cable is 0.38dB. This will be far smaller than variations due to the
frequency response of the speaker itself or due to the room, so I'm pretty
happy to declare it negligible.

Oh, for God's sake get a simulation package and see the horrible truth.

The ONLY accurate speakers are actively driven ones.

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


I think you need to revise that supposition. R dominates for sure but
don't
ignore L and C. You may be surprised.

OK then, suprise us.

Active speakers aren't there by accident.

No, most of them are connected to computers.

David.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

In article ,
Eeyore wrote:
the capacitance of any practical cable doesn't matter. Nor should the
inductance with a properly designed amp. The only thing left - under
normal circumstances, ie likely domestic speaker runs - is the
resistance.

I think you need to revise that supposition. R dominates for sure but
don't ignore L and C. You may be surprised.

Active speakers aren't there by accident.

Does anyone make a high quality single channel active speaker? All the
ones I know use a multi channel amp to get rid of the passive crossover.
Or, of course, to avoid long speaker runs in a commercial etc installation.

But non I know of to specifically get round problems caused by domestic
speaker runs. Any problems caused by capacitance and inductance are
equally valid at line levels.

--
*Toilet stolen from police station. Cops have nothing to go on.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

David Looser wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote in message
I think you need to revise that supposition. R dominates for sure but
don't ignore L and C. You may be surprised.

OK then, suprise us.

How about YOU DO ? Why do do you expect me to do YOUR work ?


Active speakers aren't there by accident.

No, most of them are connected to computers.

A: ********

B: You're obviously not living in the pro-audio world. Now do you like
'shoot-em-ups' ?

Graham

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote:

Does anyone make a high quality single channel active speaker?

God Yes !

Ans were I not so astonished you asked I'd answer right now !

Graham stunned to hell

TCI Cobra interconnects against Chord Chameleon
 

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


David Looser wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote in message
I think you need to revise that supposition. R dominates for sure but
don't ignore L and C. You may be surprised.

OK then, suprise us.

How about YOU DO ? Why do do you expect me to do YOUR work ?


I'm not the one claiming that L & C are significant, so it's *your* work.


Active speakers aren't there by accident.

No, most of them are connected to computers.

A: ********

It's not "********" at all. The majority of active speakers are connected to
computers, very few are connected to domestic Hi-Fi systems.

B: You're obviously not living in the pro-audio world.

So there are some active speakers used in pro-audio, the numbers are trivial
compared to those used with computers.

Now do you like
'shoot-em-ups' ?

No, do you?

David.