Jim Lesurf wrote:

So far as I can recall, it isn't 'news' that caps can have mechanical
resonances. The claim that is interesting is that they are audible. But to
decide, I'd need to know a lot more about how the 'results' were obtained.
For reasons like those others have already mentioned.

Crappy quality ones (electrolytics at least) can be bad. I've come across some.
Doesn't mean you have to use magic dust or incantations to fix it though, just
buy well-made quality product.

Graham

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...

I presume the above URL sends a 'stream' of some kind. My browser simply
tells me that it doesn't have a Flash plugin enabled and the page text
seems void of info.


To be honest it was an 11 min clip that was plenty of waffle,
related by a poor chap who looked uncomfortable and not at
ease being filmed though he certainly knew his onions.
But it has to be said the clip was of impressively high resolution
and the sound was OK too.

Don Pearce wrote:

Please don't be too impressed by this. When someone passes off an advert
as an academic paper, you really must smell a rat.

You mean a fraud of course.

Graham

Nick Gorham wrote:

Don Pearce wrote:
Nick Gorham wrote:

This might be of interest

http://www.sonicstate.com/news/shownews.cfm?newsid=6667


He dropped some rather interesting info when he was talking about the
blind testing "70% of the people in most of the tests preferred our
capacitors". It is the word "most" that is telling. Suppose by most he
meant perhaps as many as 70%.... Then just under half of the people
tested would have preferred his caps.

Well, I head it as the fact that in blind tests most people prefered the
low resonance caps (ie more than 50%), and in some tests up to 70%
prefered them.

WTF is a 'low resonance cap' other than audiophool bull**** ?

Graham

Don Pearce wrote:

He is also talking about something rather different than most people
when considering the sound of the capacitor - he is talking literally;
the capacitor is physically making sounds. All you need to do is pop it
in a box, and you won't hear it.

You mean like a box poly capacitor ?

Graham

Nick Gorham wrote:

This might be of interest

No they don't. But only crappy ones.

High-K ceramics are fabulously non-linear. Med-K ones are only slightly
better. But no competent designer would use them in an audio path.

As for plastic film dielectrics, I doubt STRONGLY there's even any
remote hope of an audible difference.

However using the right VALUE and considering TOLERANCES is VERY
important and may mislead people into wandering up blind alleys.

Heck, even zero-bias electrolytics are audibly blameless when used
corrrectly. That's where an experienced designer's skill counts.

Graham

As for plastic film dielectrics, I doubt STRONGLY there's even any
remote hope of an audible difference.

I actually did some sighted tests with a range of ICW caps and I
believe I could hear a difference. Same value, just different voltage
ratings so different bulk. The bulkier ones appeared better damped and
the sound was slightly cleaner. Makes sense.

Andy

Andy Evans wrote:

As for plastic film dielectrics, I doubt STRONGLY there's even any
remote hope of an audible difference.

I actually did some sighted tests with a range of ICW caps and I
believe I could hear a difference. Same value,

Did you measure that the values matched to within 0.1% ?


just different voltage
ratings so different bulk. The bulkier ones appeared better damped and
the sound was slightly cleaner. Makes sense.

These were circular ones were they ?

Graham

Eeyore wrote:

Nick Gorham wrote:

This might be of interest

No they don't. But only crappy ones.

High-K ceramics are fabulously non-linear. Med-K ones are only slightly
better. But no competent designer would use them in an audio path.

As for plastic film dielectrics, I doubt STRONGLY there's even any
remote hope of an audible difference.

However using the right VALUE and considering TOLERANCES is VERY
important and may mislead people into wandering up blind alleys.

Heck, even zero-bias electrolytics are audibly blameless when used
corrrectly. That's where an experienced designer's skill counts.

Graham

A client of mine had me replace all the Wima polypropylene MKP caps in
his tube amps
with Auricaps, and he reckoned his music sounded better, even though in
an AB test using
one channel with Auricaps and the other with Wimas, he couldn't pick
which one had which caps.
But when he had all the caps in both channels replaced, he still said it
made a difference for the better.

Then he had me replace all the small sized NP electros and polyester
bypasses in his speaker crossovers
with Obligato polyprops which meant the crossover boards had to become
much larger
to accomodate the much larger caps.
Even the caps in the impedance equalizing Zobels were changed to
Obligato.
The caps were of various sizes and types, and some looked like standard
polyprop motor starts,
and others were the same type of cap but encased in epoxy resin and
inside copper
and brass plumbing tubing, obviously aimed at impressing audiophiles.
So all the Obligatos were well sealed inside their containers, and had
little chance to
resonate physically.
The change to Obligatos made a difference to reduce the "edginess" of
the sound,
and made sound staging more defined, and made sound more "fluid", and
less tiring,
and more involving, and bass was especially better.
Great care was taken to adhere to the same values of C used as in the
original crossovers.

The client said the speakar upgrade expense was worth every cent of the
$600.

Methinks motor start polyprops in series with midrange drivers instead
of electros
need only be generic motor starts, not necessarily the Obligato brand,
and you should get good results.

Bean counters in up-market speaker companies hate such cap expense
because the cheapskate opposition
won't use them.

But expense on caps is a complete waste if the amps have high THD/IMD,
and the speakers have crap drivers
and poor boxes and were not made with a flat response, and the rest of
the system is crap.

Anyway, my client has the only system I know which I can listen to vinyl
or CD all night
without feeling "sounded out". It is streets ahead of everyone else's
systems I know.

Patrick Turner.

"Patrick Turner" wrote in message
...


A client of mine had me replace all the Wima polypropylene MKP caps in
his tube amps
with Auricaps, and he reckoned his music sounded better, even though in
an AB test using
one channel with Auricaps and the other with Wimas, he couldn't pick
which one had which caps.
But when he had all the caps in both channels replaced, he still said it
made a difference for the better.


So he couldn't tell the difference, but he still thought it sounded better?
Clearly the man was infected by a bad case of "audiophile disease"

Anyway, my client has the only system I know which I can listen to vinyl
or CD all night
without feeling "sounded out". It is streets ahead of everyone else's
systems I know.


Sounds like you caught the disease too.

David.