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Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On 21 Aug, 11:32, James Harris wrote:
My speakers have four spikes beneath them which makes it a pain to move the speakers even slightly as the length of at least one spike has to be adjusted to make all four rest on/in the floor. (The floor is solid - maybe concrete - and not wood.) Anyone heard of a kit to convert four spikes to three? It would have to fit beneath the existing arrangement as I don't want to modify the speakers (which are Dynaudio Audience 62 floorstanders). I'm thinking of something like a heavy duty plate with four solid fittings above and three below. I suppose an alteration to the sound is inevitable but would avoid scrap the idea if it has too much effect. An alternative is to put paving slabs on top of the carpet beneath the speakers. They should be heavy enough to not move and also present a more uniform surface for the speakers though even that would not be perfect. The slight problem here is the slabs sold by the local stores are fairly lightweight. Any ideas? Widening the net a little.... James |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
In article
, James Harris wrote: On 21 Aug, 11:32, James Harris wrote: My speakers have four spikes beneath them which makes it a pain to move the speakers even slightly as the length of at least one spike has to be adjusted to make all four rest on/in the floor. (The floor is solid - maybe concrete - and not wood.) I'd agree that three spikes are rather more practical than four. But afraid I don't know of any kits for the below. I'm thinking of something like a heavy duty plate with four solid fittings above and three below. I suppose an alteration to the sound is inevitable but would avoid scrap the idea if it has too much effect. An alternative is to put paving slabs on top of the carpet beneath the speakers. They should be heavy enough to not move and also present a more uniform surface for the speakers though even that would not be perfect. The slight problem here is the slabs sold by the local stores are fairly lightweight. TBH I have my doubts about such 'slabs' under 'spikes' being of much use. Have a look at http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/cones/speak.html to see why I have doubts about that. You might be better with a layer of something squidgy like 'Blu Tak' between speaker and a heavy slab. Or just don't bother. I've missed the previous parts of the thread is this is the first posting on this thread I've seen, so I wonder why you think the 'spikes' are desirable at all... Any ideas? Widening the net a little.... Open the window wider and.... :-) Slainte, Jim -- Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 01:34:32 -0700 (PDT), James Harris
wrote: My speakers have four spikes beneath them which makes it a pain to move the speakers even slightly as the length of at least one spike has to be adjusted to make all four rest on/in the floor. (The floor is solid - maybe concrete - and not wood.) Anyone heard of a kit to convert four spikes to three? It would have to fit beneath the existing arrangement as I don't want to modify the speakers (which are Dynaudio Audience 62 floorstanders). I don't understand spikes. Audiophiles talk about coupling and arrange heavy lumps of stone to couple to. But then they minimise that coupling by restricting it to three or four points! Perhaps the spikes are merely so you CAN adjust the speaker to stand level on a concrete floor? My practical experience of large speakers - some much larger than anything found in a domestic setup - is that they generally sound MUCH better mounted at least a small distance away from any flat surface, wall or floor. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
James Harris wrote:
My speakers have four spikes beneath them which makes it a pain to move the speakers even slightly as the length of at least one spike has to be adjusted to make all four rest on/in the floor. (The floor is solid - maybe concrete - and not wood.) Why do you want to move them around so much? Take the spikes off, experiment with positioning the speakers for a week or two. When you're satisfied they're optimally placed, put the spikes back on and leave them on and be done with it. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 11:15:21 GMT, "Brian Gaff"
wrote: I think the reason for four was health and safety actually, harder to wobble them over. By audiophile reasoning, would just ONE spike, perfectly balanced, be the ideal? :-) |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Brian Gaff" wrote in message om... I think the reason for four was health and safety actually, harder to wobble them over. Wobbling over has nothing to do with the number of points of support but is to do with the geometric relationship between the various points of support and the speaker's centre of mass/gravity/momentum - pick whichever takes yer fancy.... |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Laurence Payne" wrote in message ... On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 11:15:21 GMT, "Brian Gaff" wrote: I think the reason for four was health and safety actually, harder to wobble them over. By audiophile reasoning, would just ONE spike, perfectly balanced, be the ideal? :-) What do you mean by 'audiophile'...??? |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"James Harris" wrote in message ... On 21 Aug, 11:32, James Harris wrote: My speakers have four spikes beneath them which makes it a pain to move the speakers even slightly as the length of at least one spike has to be adjusted to make all four rest on/in the floor. (The floor is solid - maybe concrete - and not wood.) Anyone heard of a kit to convert four spikes to three? It would have to fit beneath the existing arrangement as I don't want to modify the speakers (which are Dynaudio Audience 62 floorstanders). I'm thinking of something like a heavy duty plate with four solid fittings above and three below. I suppose an alteration to the sound is inevitable but would avoid scrap the idea if it has too much effect. An alternative is to put paving slabs on top of the carpet beneath the speakers. They should be heavy enough to not move and also present a more uniform surface for the speakers though even that would not be perfect. The slight problem here is the slabs sold by the local stores are fairly lightweight. Any ideas? Widening the net a little.... James IIRC, WW Greener's formula was that the projectile to be fired from a rifle should not exceed that of 1/96th of the rifle's total weight (mass?) - whether a speaker would need coupling to a firm foundation would depend upon its overall weight (mass?) I suspect.... |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Laurence Payne wrote:
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 11:15:21 GMT, "Brian Gaff" wrote: I think the reason for four was health and safety actually, harder to wobble them over. By audiophile reasoning, would just ONE spike, perfectly balanced, be the ideal? :-) O yes, it has to be gold plated, have directionality marks for gravity, cosmic and magnetic influence, machined to 1 thou of nothing, made in a total vacuum - and have an impressive price. Probably needs degaussing regulary ... -- Adrian C |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
James Harris wrote:
On 21 Aug, 11:32, James Harris wrote: My speakers have four spikes beneath them which makes it a pain to move the speakers even slightly as the length of at least one spike has to be adjusted to make all four rest on/in the floor. (The floor is solid - maybe concrete - and not wood.) Anyone heard of a kit to convert four spikes to three? It would have to fit beneath the existing arrangement as I don't want to modify the speakers (which are Dynaudio Audience 62 floorstanders). The sound is supposed to come in a straight line from the speaker, through the air, to your lugholes. It is not supposed to go via some random scenic route involving whatever your loudspeaker is parked on. Therefore your speakers should not be mechanically coupled to anything. They should be mechanically isolated. Spikes are audiophool nonsense. What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. -- Richard Lamont http://www.lamont.me.uk/ OpenPGP Key ID: 0xBD89BE41 Fingerprint: CE78 C285 1F97 0BDA 886D BA78 26D8 6C34 BD89 BE41 |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
In article ,
Brian Gaff wrote: I think the reason for four was health and safety actually, harder to wobble them over. Wouldn't they be banned totally, then, since they're more likely to make a floor speaker topple than without? ;-) -- *Don't worry; it only seems kinky the first time.* Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 12:57:11 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote: By audiophile reasoning, would just ONE spike, perfectly balanced, be the ideal? :-) What do you mean by 'audiophile'...??? The sort of reasoning that puts spikes on speakers but doesn't really know why. Some say it's to "couple". Others to "decouple". What do you think they're for? |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 13:39:28 +0100, Richard Lamont
wrote: What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. What's the "speaker"? The drive unit? That plus the box it's in? That plus the room it's in? |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Richard Lamont" wrote The sound is supposed to come in a straight line from the speaker, through the air, to your lugholes. It is not supposed to go via some random scenic route involving whatever your loudspeaker is parked on. Therefore your speakers should not be mechanically coupled to anything. They should be mechanically isolated. Spikes are audiophool nonsense. What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. I think you are missing the point entirely - the purpose of the spikes on speakers it to enable them to be pushed through a carpet or any other squidgy floorcovering (like you are recommending) to enable the speaker to be coupled directly to the floor underneath and remove/reduce the ability of the speaker to move in reaction (recoil) to the cone movements which some claim 'blurs/renders less accurate' the created sound. The usual comment is 'tighten up the bass' (treble not affected) and I wouldn't argue with it, but I think the speaker's mass has a lot to do with it irrespective of the floorcovering and is why I posted my comment about WW Greener's formula.... |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Richard Lamont wrote:
The sound is supposed to come in a straight line from the speaker, through the air, to your lugholes. It is not supposed to go via some random scenic route involving whatever your loudspeaker is parked on. Agreed. Therefore your speakers should not be mechanically coupled to anything. They should be mechanically isolated. Spikes are audiophool nonsense. As I understand things, mechanical isolation is exactly what spikes do. Maybe they can transmit some high frequencies but I don't see them able to transmit low frequencies since the point of the cone would have to vibrate at those frequencies. If the point is on something rigid, like a slab of something, it's not going to move much. What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. I can see low frequencies moving quite easily through neoprene and carpet. Paul P |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Laurence Payne" wrote in message ... On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 12:57:11 +0100, "Keith G" wrote: By audiophile reasoning, would just ONE spike, perfectly balanced, be the ideal? :-) What do you mean by 'audiophile'...??? The sort of reasoning that puts spikes on speakers but doesn't really know why. OK, not what I understand the word to mean.... Some say it's to "couple". Others to "decouple". What do you think they're for? Couple, of course - what would be the point of 'decoupling' unless you were talking about a record deck and one lived directly over the Underground...?? |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Keith G wrote:
"Richard Lamont" wrote The sound is supposed to come in a straight line from the speaker, through the air, to your lugholes. It is not supposed to go via some random scenic route involving whatever your loudspeaker is parked on. Therefore your speakers should not be mechanically coupled to anything. They should be mechanically isolated. Spikes are audiophool nonsense. What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. I think you are missing the point entirely - the purpose of the spikes on speakers it to enable them to be pushed through a carpet or any other squidgy floorcovering (like you are recommending) to enable the speaker to be coupled directly to the floor underneath and remove/reduce the ability of the speaker to move in reaction (recoil) to the cone movements which some claim 'blurs/renders less accurate' the created sound. As the mass of the cone is so much less than the mass of the speaker cabinet as a whole, this is surely idiotic. Besides, any such reaction will also occur during manufacturer's testing and will therefore be taken into account at the design stage. -- Richard Lamont http://www.lamont.me.uk/ OpenPGP Key ID: 0xBD89BE41 Fingerprint: CE78 C285 1F97 0BDA 886D BA78 26D8 6C34 BD89 BE41 |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Laurence Payne wrote:
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 13:39:28 +0100, Richard Lamont wrote: What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. What's the "speaker"? The drive unit? That plus the box it's in? That plus the room it's in? The box, obviously. -- Richard Lamont http://www.lamont.me.uk/ OpenPGP Key ID: 0xBD89BE41 Fingerprint: CE78 C285 1F97 0BDA 886D BA78 26D8 6C34 BD89 BE41 |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Paul P wrote:
As I understand things, mechanical isolation is exactly what spikes do. Maybe they can transmit some high frequencies but I don't see them able to transmit low frequencies since the point of the cone would have to vibrate at those frequencies. If the point is on something rigid, like a slab of something, it's not going to move much. Rigid materials provide mechanical coupling. I don't understand how being pointy would make any difference. Squidgy materials have 'give' that attenuates the coupling. It's a basic matter of mechanical engineering, not unique to audio. Every anti-vibration device I've seen involved things like rubber and maybe springs, but never spikes. What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. I can see low frequencies moving quite easily through neoprene and carpet. But not as easily as through a rigid object, whatever its shape. -- Richard Lamont http://www.lamont.me.uk/ OpenPGP Key ID: 0xBD89BE41 Fingerprint: CE78 C285 1F97 0BDA 886D BA78 26D8 6C34 BD89 BE41 |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Point proved, I think!
One person thinks spikes couple. Another thinks they decouple. Someone else wants to consider the box containing the drivers (the "speaker") separately from the room it's heard in. Some would put a record deck on an absorbent mat. Some on wooden cones then on a glass shelf then on more cones, or maybe spikes. But I think they'd all leave the deck's suspended sub-chassis alone? Audiophle logic. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Richard Lamont" wrote in message ... Keith G wrote: "Richard Lamont" wrote The sound is supposed to come in a straight line from the speaker, through the air, to your lugholes. It is not supposed to go via some random scenic route involving whatever your loudspeaker is parked on. Therefore your speakers should not be mechanically coupled to anything. They should be mechanically isolated. Spikes are audiophool nonsense. What you need is a nice thick sheet of neoprene rubber instead. Then the sound will come from your speakers and not from whichever bits of your building happen to radiate the coupled vibration. If you have carpet and underlay then the neoprene probably isn't necessary. I think you are missing the point entirely - the purpose of the spikes on speakers it to enable them to be pushed through a carpet or any other squidgy floorcovering (like you are recommending) to enable the speaker to be coupled directly to the floor underneath and remove/reduce the ability of the speaker to move in reaction (recoil) to the cone movements which some claim 'blurs/renders less accurate' the created sound. As the mass of the cone is so much less than the mass of the speaker cabinet as a whole, this is surely idiotic. Besides, any such reaction will also occur during manufacturer's testing and will therefore be taken into account at the design stage. You snipped the best bit: "The usual comment is 'tighten up the bass' (treble not affected) and I wouldn't argue with it, but I think the speaker's mass has a lot to do with it irrespective of the floorcovering and is why I posted my comment about WW Greener's formula...." Note the 'I wouldn't argue with it' bit! Try it yourself is all I can say - and post the results here. FWIW, I have 6 pairs of speakers on the go here and only one of them is spiked - and that pair is on stands which are filled with lead shot and which have spikes through to the concrete floor (three of them each - triangular). Here's a quick snap: http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/showntell/Triangular.jpg (I have still not yet got round to sticking the speakers down with Blu Tack after some six months!! :-) |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Laurence Payne wrote:
Point proved, I think! One person thinks spikes couple. Another thinks they decouple. Someone else wants to consider the box containing the drivers (the "speaker") separately from the room it's heard in. Some would put a record deck on an absorbent mat. Some on wooden cones then on a glass shelf then on more cones, or maybe spikes. But I think they'd all leave the deck's suspended sub-chassis alone? Audiophle logic. In the context of the thread, in which the speaker was the thing being put on spikes or a neoprene mat, clearly "speaker" referred to the box. Clearly room acoustics and interaction between the room and the speaker are important, but that doesn't justify conflating the terminology so that "speaker" is defined as including the room. -- Richard Lamont http://www.lamont.me.uk/ OpenPGP Key ID: 0xBD89BE41 Fingerprint: CE78 C285 1F97 0BDA 886D BA78 26D8 6C34 BD89 BE41 |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 13:05:13 +0100, Adrian C
wrote: I think the reason for four was health and safety actually, harder to wobble them over. By audiophile reasoning, would just ONE spike, perfectly balanced, be the ideal? :-) O yes, it has to be gold plated, have directionality marks for gravity, cosmic and magnetic influence, machined to 1 thou of nothing, made in a total vacuum - and have an impressive price. Probably needs degaussing regulary ... So this drawing pin won't do? |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Keith G wrote:
You snipped the best bit: "The usual comment is 'tighten up the bass' (treble not affected) and I wouldn't argue with it, but I think the speaker's mass has a lot to do with it irrespective of the floorcovering and is why I posted my comment about WW Greener's formula...." Note the 'I wouldn't argue with it' bit! Try it yourself is all I can say - and post the results here. Right. I'll add it to my 'to try' list: 1. Astrology 2. Magic healing crystals 3. Green CD marker 4. Homeopathy 5. Speaker spikes (It might be a while.) http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/showntell/Triangular.jpg Is that grey amp a Gerry Wells special? -- Richard Lamont http://www.lamont.me.uk/ OpenPGP Key ID: 0xBD89BE41 Fingerprint: CE78 C285 1F97 0BDA 886D BA78 26D8 6C34 BD89 BE41 |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
In article , Laurence Payne wrote:
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 01:34:32 -0700 (PDT), James Harris wrote: My speakers have four spikes beneath them which makes it a pain to move the speakers even slightly as the length of at least one spike has to be adjusted to make all four rest on/in the floor. (The floor is solid - maybe concrete - and not wood.) Anyone heard of a kit to convert four spikes to three? It would have to fit beneath the existing arrangement as I don't want to modify the speakers (which are Dynaudio Audience 62 floorstanders). I don't understand spikes. Audiophiles talk about coupling and arrange heavy lumps of stone to couple to. But then they minimise that coupling by restricting it to three or four points! I first heard of spikes and it had solid reasoning as used on rugs on wood floors. For cement, you need another medium to convert, like using a piece of soft pine under each spike on top of the cement. The spike will auto level, and provide a better impedance match of the mechanical system That would not work either for some speakers at loud volume, and the speaker will start to walk. Some rubber would healp that scenereo. greg Perhaps the spikes are merely so you CAN adjust the speaker to stand level on a concrete floor? My practical experience of large speakers - some much larger than anything found in a domestic setup - is that they generally sound MUCH better mounted at least a small distance away from any flat surface, wall or floor. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
In article ,
Laurence Payne wrote: Some would put a record deck on an absorbent mat. Some on wooden cones then on a glass shelf then on more cones, or maybe spikes. But I think they'd all leave the deck's suspended sub-chassis alone? Garrard 301, etc, had no suspension and some mounted them in concrete. ;-) -- *Arkansas State Motto: Don't Ask, Don't Tell, Don't Laugh. Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Richard Lamont" wrote in message ... Keith G wrote: You snipped the best bit: "The usual comment is 'tighten up the bass' (treble not affected) and I wouldn't argue with it, but I think the speaker's mass has a lot to do with it irrespective of the floorcovering and is why I posted my comment about WW Greener's formula...." Note the 'I wouldn't argue with it' bit! Try it yourself is all I can say - and post the results here. Right. I'll add it to my 'to try' list: Good fellow - too many *theorists* here.... 1. Astrology 2. Magic healing crystals 3. Green CD marker 4. Homeopathy 5. Speaker spikes (It might be a while.) So move it up the list..... http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/showntell/Triangular.jpg Is that grey amp a Gerry Wells special? No, it's a 'Keith Garratt probably not too special' - but I like it!! ;-) Better pic he http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/shown...Fandothers.JPG (Different pix taken of different kit at different times - when I wuz *trying stuff out* for myself!! ;-) |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
Laurence Payne wrote:
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 12:57:11 +0100, "Keith G" wrote: By audiophile reasoning, would just ONE spike, perfectly balanced, be the ideal? :-) What do you mean by 'audiophile'...??? The sort of reasoning that puts spikes on speakers but doesn't really know why. Some say it's to "couple". Others to "decouple". What do you think they're for? You can do either... you can couple the speaker to a huge mass, or you can decouple it from all (possibly resonant) masses. Either method works, and you can measure whether it's working or not (or you can just put your hand on the floor and feel if it's vibrating). --scott -- "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis." |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Keith G" wrote Better pic he http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/shown...Fandothers.JPG (Different pix taken of different kit at different times - when I wuz *trying stuff out* for myself!! ;-) Actually that pic has much to tell: Note the record deck sits (without suspension) in a massive plinth made from kitchen worktop offcuts and sits on a two inch thick 'grano' paving slab (painted black) on firm, rubber 'doorstop' feet. The 'hifi stand' with the extra weight in it (valve amp and large SS power amp) is pretty firmly stuck to the ground (concrete floor under weedy/cheapskate bedroom carpet) and I can quite definitely say the sound from that deck has *by far* the best bass and pin sharp clarity I have ever heard from any turntable! (That said, the other tt I use atm is a simple Technics deck with 'squidgy suspension' built-in and I like that one just as much!) Note also the weight on top of the speaker cabinets - have a friend who stacks books on top of his speakers to eradicate cabinet resonances and will try to find a pic (I know I've got one somewhere), but whether or not that really wotks isn't important: my reason for heaping things on top of speakers is simply lack of space and the speaker tops are* somewhere handy to put stuff!! *were - I've thinned down a lot now! |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
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Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
In article , Laurence Payne wrote:
On 24 Aug 2009 10:52:05 -0400, (Scott Dorsey) wrote: The sort of reasoning that puts spikes on speakers but doesn't really know why. Some say it's to "couple". Others to "decouple". What do you think they're for? You can do either... you can couple the speaker to a huge mass, or you can decouple it from all (possibly resonant) masses. Either method works, and you can measure whether it's working or not (or you can just put your hand on the floor and feel if it's vibrating). Reading at face value, that reply states that spikes either couple or decouple the speaker from what it's standing on. Depending on which you WANTED them to do. This can't be right. What DID you mean? Another thing, if the floor is vibrating from the air vibrations, and the speaker is still, the floor will make the speaker shake. greg |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Keith G" wrote Note also the weight on top of the speaker cabinets - have a friend who stacks books on top of his speakers to eradicate cabinet resonances and will try to find a pic (I know I've got one somewhere), OK, that wasn't actually too hard: http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/showntell/0002.JPG Incidentally, those speakers are a pair of Cyburg's Needles I built and sent to him over in Brussels. He loves them, but they ain't ever gonna sound any good out in the room like in the pic - contrary to what someone said here recently, they need to be flat back against a wall or other large, flat surface for bass reinforcement.... .....when they will sound incredibly good with a crystal clear yet rich 'full sound' which totally belies the little 2 inch, cheapo 'car speaker' Viston drive units!! (I got a pair here in constant use on this computer and the radio and they are superb - people look for the subwoofer!! :-) But enough of that - that's history now... |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
In article ,
Keith G wrote: Note also the weight on top of the speaker cabinets - have a friend who stacks books on top of his speakers to eradicate cabinet resonances and will try to find a pic (I know I've got one somewhere), but whether or not that really wotks isn't important: my reason for heaping things on top of speakers is simply lack of space and the speaker tops are* somewhere handy to put stuff!! Since it's impossible to make a totally rigid speaker cabinet some makers take into account any 'output' from the cabinet itself. Think the first to do this was the Spendor BC1. Which was designed to be mounted on an open stand about 9" high. Adding mass to the cabinet - like putting books on top - would negate the design theory. -- *If you try to fail, and succeed, which have you done? Dave Plowman London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 15:59:17 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote: Note the record deck sits (without suspension) in a massive plinth made from kitchen worktop offcuts and sits on a two inch thick 'grano' paving slab (painted black) on firm, rubber 'doorstop' feet. The 'hifi stand' with the extra weight in it (valve amp and large SS power amp) is pretty firmly stuck to the ground (concrete floor under weedy/cheapskate bedroom carpet) and I can quite definitely say the sound from that deck has *by far* the best bass and pin sharp clarity I have ever heard from any turntable! (That said, the other tt I use atm is a simple Technics deck with 'squidgy suspension' built-in and I like that one just as much!) So what characteristics does the Technics have to compensate for its *by far* inferior bass and clarity? One deck is close to a speaker, another is actually on top of one! Of course THOSE decks never feed THAT speaker? Are the speakers you actually listen to cramped against walls and other equipment in that way? Do they sound different/better given a bit more space to work in? |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
In article , (GregS) wrote:
In article , Laurence Payne wrote: On 24 Aug 2009 10:52:05 -0400, (Scott Dorsey) wrote: The sort of reasoning that puts spikes on speakers but doesn't really know why. Some say it's to "couple". Others to "decouple". What do you think they're for? You can do either... you can couple the speaker to a huge mass, or you can decouple it from all (possibly resonant) masses. Either method works, and you can measure whether it's working or not (or you can just put your hand on the floor and feel if it's vibrating). Reading at face value, that reply states that spikes either couple or decouple the speaker from what it's standing on. Depending on which you WANTED them to do. This can't be right. What DID you mean? Another thing, if the floor is vibrating from the air vibrations, and the speaker is still, the floor will make the speaker shake. Another thought, when the floor is vibrating, its likely not to be in phase with the speaker output, and it will be frequency dependant. At least this tend to stabilize the frequency slewing. What am I talking about?? !! greg |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
... My practical experience of large speakers - some much larger than anything found in a domestic setup - is that they generally sound MUCH better mounted at least a small distance away from any flat surface, wall or floor. At one time there was a fad for mounting speakers as far into room corners as possible. My granddad, who was something of a "HiFi" enthusiast in the 1950s built a speaker cabinet which used the walls and floor as part of the cabinet. I seem to remember that a barrow-load of sand was part of it as well. David. |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message ... In article , Keith G wrote: Note also the weight on top of the speaker cabinets - have a friend who stacks books on top of his speakers to eradicate cabinet resonances and will try to find a pic (I know I've got one somewhere), but whether or not that really wotks isn't important: my reason for heaping things on top of speakers is simply lack of space and the speaker tops are* somewhere handy to put stuff!! Since it's impossible to make a totally rigid speaker cabinet some makers take into account any 'output' from the cabinet itself. Think the first to do this was the Spendor BC1. Which was designed to be mounted on an open stand about 9" high. Adding mass to the cabinet - like putting books on top - would negate the design theory. The Rogers 'BBC Studio Monitors' I had here a while back were 'thinwall/resonating' types and sounded very good indeed, apart from the rasping bass unit I couldn't cure - without spending a lot of money and maybe changing the speakers characteristics too much, in any case.... |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
"Laurence Payne" wrote in message ... On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 15:59:17 +0100, "Keith G" wrote: Note the record deck sits (without suspension) in a massive plinth made from kitchen worktop offcuts and sits on a two inch thick 'grano' paving slab (painted black) on firm, rubber 'doorstop' feet. The 'hifi stand' with the extra weight in it (valve amp and large SS power amp) is pretty firmly stuck to the ground (concrete floor under weedy/cheapskate bedroom carpet) and I can quite definitely say the sound from that deck has *by far* the best bass and pin sharp clarity I have ever heard from any turntable! (That said, the other tt I use atm is a simple Technics deck with 'squidgy suspension' built-in and I like that one just as much!) So what characteristics does the Technics have to compensate for its *by far* inferior bass and clarity? Here's a little 'furry' pic of it (I'm into handheld/low-light MF atm): http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/showntell/Technics.JPG Anyway, no idea - the AT moving coil cart probably helps...?? One deck is close to a speaker, another is actually on top of one! Of course THOSE decks never feed THAT speaker? Calm down, dear! I have used decks parked on speakers before now but the deck in that pic was just parked up. Trust me, I do like (very much) the sound I get from my kit - or it'd be a damn sight different to wot it is, but I think you need to free your mind off from a load of 'audiophile/anti-audiophile' prejudice and misconceptions... Are the speakers you actually listen to cramped against walls and other equipment in that way? Do they sound different/better given a bit more space to work in? So many questions! I bet you drove your parents mad when you were a kid! I've lost track, if the speakers you refer to are the ones with the IMF in, they're history - the speakers I've got and use atm are crammed in but not against the wall and sound absolutely fine to me; whether you or anyone else would agree is another thing, but that's not really germane.... Tell me summat, have you ever been in a secondhand record shop and asked the owner to 'put a record on' to try it? They invariably have utterly mediocre kit - 'mid-fi' Technics decks and amps; speakers with no name on - and the sound is usually quite *exquisite*!! Similarly, the more junk and clutter in my room, the better the sound, I find!! (I remember once I got someone to listen with his eyes shut while I slowly rotated one speaker until it was facing the wall - he had no idea what was going on and said the sound was unaffected throughout!! ;-) |
Convert speaker spikes from quadrupod to tripod
On Mon, 24 Aug 2009 16:49:28 +0100, "David Looser"
wrote: At one time there was a fad for mounting speakers as far into room corners as possible. My granddad, who was something of a "HiFi" enthusiast in the 1950s built a speaker cabinet which used the walls and floor as part of the cabinet. I seem to remember that a barrow-load of sand was part of it as well. Yup. And it probably got very loud with only a few watts input. If we were prepared to let our speakers take up rather more space, speaker design (and amp. power) could be very different :-) |
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