Vinyl to digital
 

So quiet in here...

I am considering getting hold of a turntable so I can get my small
(looks like about 100 items) collection of vinyl into lossless format
and then to CD. Any tips/traps/advice please? I'm not after super
quality reproduction from what are going to be well-played records
stored (vertically) in my loft for 40+ years. 'Proper hi-fi' quality
will probably be better than my old ears these days, subjective I know.

I'm pretty sure I have a Shure M75 cartridge and almost new stylus from
the 1970s...somewhere in that loft.

I've been looking on Ebay at things like Pioneer PL-518, Technics
SL-3200 and other direct drive tts. Would be reluctant to pay much more
than £50-£100 for what may turn out to be an aborted project if the
disks aren't playable. Am I wasting my time or what?

For PC line input via sound card know I need RIAA eq + preamp. I have
enough construction skills to build this, given circuit details. Or
perhaps CPC or RS do a ready made module?

Alternatively, I do have an external 24 bit res. audio capture unit
(Edirol UA-25) that has dynamic microphone inputs. I wonder if this
would work together with RIAA eq in software? MC cartridges and dynamic
mics have roughly similar output levels....don't they?

A bit rusty in this stuff...been a long time.

Comments appreciated.

Vinyl to digital
 

On 13/02/2015 14:24, Sumatriptan wrote:
So quiet in here...

I am considering getting hold of a turntable so I can get my small
(looks like about 100 items) collection of vinyl into lossless format
and then to CD. Any tips/traps/advice please? I'm not after super

Lie down in a dark room until the feeling goes away.
Then make a list of the LPs you want to copy and buy the CDs on ebay.

--
Eiron.

Vinyl to digital
 

In article , Eiron
wrote:
On 13/02/2015 14:24, Sumatriptan wrote:
So quiet in here...

I am considering getting hold of a turntable so I can get my small
(looks like about 100 items) collection of vinyl into lossless format
and then to CD. Any tips/traps/advice please? I'm not after super

Lie down in a dark room until the feeling goes away. Then make a list of
the LPs you want to copy and buy the CDs on ebay.

I'd disagree. I've been happily making digitial file copies of LPs for some
time now.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

Vinyl to digital
 

In article , Sumatriptan
wrote:

I've been looking on Ebay at things like Pioneer PL-518, Technics
SL-3200 and other direct drive tts. Would be reluctant to pay much more
than £50-£100 for what may turn out to be an aborted project if the
disks aren't playable. Am I wasting my time or what?

Afraid only you can decide that. But as I say elsewhere I've been making
digital file copies of old LPs (and some new ones) for some time now and am
generally quite pleased with results.

For PC line input via sound card know I need RIAA eq + preamp. I have
enough construction skills to build this, given circuit details. Or
perhaps CPC or RS do a ready made module?

I've not checked CPC for this, but they may do. The main problems though
are to build one that has a low enough background noise and matches your
cartridge. The 'mains' noise/hum problem can be dodged if you use
batteries. There are probably loads of designs on the web. I just use the
design I settled on decades ago. But I'm sure there's lots of choice.
Alternatively, just buy a suitable second-hand amp that you fancy.



Alternatively, I do have an external 24 bit res. audio capture unit
(Edirol UA-25) that has dynamic microphone inputs. I wonder if this
would work together with RIAA eq in software? MC cartridges and dynamic
mics have roughly similar output levels....don't they?

Not really unless you are very lucky. Moving magnet cartridges want fairly
specific loading quite unlike a microphone's, for example. So either get or
build a decent RIAA amp designed for the job.

When recording, make sure the recorded peaks stay clearly below max (0dB).
Then have a look and listen with Audacity or similar and deal with clicks.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

Vinyl to digital
 

In message , Eiron
writes
On 13/02/2015 14:24, Sumatriptan wrote:
So quiet in here...

I am considering getting hold of a turntable so I can get my small
(looks like about 100 items) collection of vinyl into lossless format
and then to CD. Any tips/traps/advice please? I'm not after super

Lie down in a dark room until the feeling goes away.
Then make a list of the LPs you want to copy and buy the CDs on ebay.

Maybe, but one does get attached to the familiar ambience (?) of old,
treasured vinyl recordings, with the all the old familiar pops and
clicks in all the old familiar places. Somehow, perfect new and
remastered versions don't evoke quite the memories of days long passed,
sitting on the floor and listening to the Rexine-covered Dansette.
--
Ian

Vinyl to digital
 

On 13/02/2015 15:04, Eiron wrote:

Lie down in a dark room until the feeling goes away.
Then make a list of the LPs you want to copy and buy the CDs on ebay.


LOL!

I did say 'considering'.

I may do that instead.

Vinyl to digital
 

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...
In article , Sumatriptan
wrote:

I've been looking on Ebay at things like Pioneer PL-518, Technics
SL-3200 and other direct drive tts. Would be reluctant to pay much
more
than £50-£100 for what may turn out to be an aborted project if the
disks aren't playable. Am I wasting my time or what?

Afraid only you can decide that. But as I say elsewhere I've been
making
digital file copies of old LPs (and some new ones) for some time now
and am
generally quite pleased with results.

For PC line input via sound card know I need RIAA eq + preamp. I
have
enough construction skills to build this, given circuit details. Or
perhaps CPC or RS do a ready made module?

I've not checked CPC for this, but they may do. The main problems
though
are to build one that has a low enough background noise and matches
your
cartridge. The 'mains' noise/hum problem can be dodged if you use
batteries. There are probably loads of designs on the web. I just
use the
design I settled on decades ago. But I'm sure there's lots of
choice.
Alternatively, just buy a suitable second-hand amp that you fancy.



Alternatively, I do have an external 24 bit res. audio capture unit
(Edirol UA-25) that has dynamic microphone inputs. I wonder if this
would work together with RIAA eq in software? MC cartridges and
dynamic
mics have roughly similar output levels....don't they?

Not really unless you are very lucky. Moving magnet cartridges want
fairly
specific loading quite unlike a microphone's, for example. So either
get or
build a decent RIAA amp designed for the job.

When recording, make sure the recorded peaks stay clearly below max
(0dB).
Then have a look and listen with Audacity or similar and deal with
clicks.


I would agree - any reasonable secondhand amp with a MM input will
more than meet the need. You should also be able to get a stylus for a
M75EDII reasonably easily, but if you do a bit of advice. Get a couple
of phono line plugs and sockets and make two short plug-socket link
cables. Put a 220pF capacitor across the cable in each plug. Most amps
have an input capacitance of around 180-220pF but for best results a
Shure cartridge needs something approaching 470pF. You would think it
would kill the top end but far from it - it actually balances the
response making the result much more pleasurable.

Take the tape output of the amp and feed it into your laptop and use
Audacity to record the result. I've been doing it for ages and am very
satisfied with the results.

Having said that, before you go spending lots of folding stuff see if
you can find a way of listening to your LPs first. You may find that
they have deteriorated to such an extent that the sound is too
distorted to use. If they have been in the loft, vertical and pressed
together or not, the temperature cycling could have done irreparable
damage. Even the discs I had treated with Soundguard didn't escape.


--
Woody

harrogate3 at ntlworld dot com

Vinyl to digital
 

On Fri, 13 Feb 2015 14:24:27 +0000, Sumatriptan
wrote:

So quiet in here...

I am considering getting hold of a turntable so I can get my small
(looks like about 100 items) collection of vinyl into lossless format
and then to CD. Any tips/traps/advice please? I'm not after super
quality reproduction from what are going to be well-played records
stored (vertically) in my loft for 40+ years. 'Proper hi-fi' quality
will probably be better than my old ears these days, subjective I know.

You may want to read the notes I made on my experiences doing this a
couple of years ago, which I've summarised in the following link, but
there were also long threads in uk.tech.digital-tv, which may or may
not have been cross-posted here, I can't remember:
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/Audi...storation.html
I'm pretty sure I have a Shure M75 cartridge and almost new stylus
from
the 1970s...somewhere in that loft.

Sounds good, but when I considered mounting my old Shure on a new
deck, I realised that the new deck and the cartridge didn't have the
same mountings. Therefore it was ...
:-( Use the old deck, which had a hum
:-( Use the new deck which had an inferior ceramic cartridge
:-( Hack either the cartridge or the new deck to fit
.... from which I chose the first option, but completely rewired the
deck to remove the hum, as described in the link above.

So the moral is, make sure that the mountings in any new deck that you
wish to purchase are completely standard and compatible with your
existing cartridge.

Also try and get some sort of idea, preferably by actually listening
to it before you purchase, whether the kit you are thinking of buying
is free from mains hum.

I've been looking on Ebay at things like Pioneer PL-518, Technics
SL-3200 and other direct drive tts. Would be reluctant to pay much more
than £50-£100 for what may turn out to be an aborted project if the
disks aren't playable. Am I wasting my time or what?

I don't think so, I have absolutely no regrets about spending the
amount of time that I did to try and do the job as well as I could
given the equipment that I had available at the time.

However, you have to decide from vinyl to vinyl. It depends very much
on factors like ...

* Can you get CD copies of any of your collection? If you're
setting a budget of £100 for a potential deck purchase, you could get
anything between 8 to 15 CDs for that, depending on whether you can
pick up any good offers.

* If yes, are the CD copies reasonably faithful to the original
sound, or are they re-mixed to hell? Many CD copies of legendary
vinyls from the analogue days have been re-mixed either to remove
noise such as tape hiss, or to give a modern sound which has high
initial impact, but is unbalanced and tires the ears more quickly than
the well-balanced sound of the original vinyl. Towards the end of the
following link I quote a couple of Fleetwood Mac CDs as an example
where on one CD excessive digital processing seemingly aimed at
removing all trace of tape hiss from the original master has lost much
of the ambience of the original sound, whereas another CD containing
some of the same original vinyl tracks is absolutely fine ...
http://www.macfh.co.uk/JavaJive/Audi...VinylVsCD.html

* How much of each LP you really want to save - just a track
or two, or the entire LP? Obviously it's easier to justify buying a
CD, effectively buying the album twice, if you really, really like all
or nearly all of it.

For PC line input via sound card know I need RIAA eq + preamp. I have
enough construction skills to build this, given circuit details. Or
perhaps CPC or RS do a ready made module?

You can get ready-made ones, but they may introduce hum. Jim has
suggested using batteries to counter this, but I've not tried this, as
I had a hifi amp with a phono input, which was a reasonably
satisfactory solution. However, you can also get decks with a
built-in pre-amp, though in any one particular case it may be matched
to the characteristics of the cartridge supplied with the deck, which
may only be ceramic and not have the dynamic range and, particularly,
the frequency response of your Shure. Even so this may still be a
better solution than fussing about to build one for yourself, and then
having to remember to check the battery levels regularly.

Alternatively, I do have an external 24 bit res. audio capture unit
(Edirol UA-25) that has dynamic microphone inputs. I wonder if this
would work together with RIAA eq in software? MC cartridges and dynamic
mics have roughly similar output levels....don't they?

Can't advise myself, but anyway I see Jim already has.

Generally, follow my advice in the first link given ...

!!! Rate your collection as to how important to you each album really
is. If you can then get the most important ones on CD, maybe taking
advantage of sales, etc, and, at the other end of the spectrum
throwing out those you no longer like, then you may be left with a
much smaller number of digitisations to do, and you can justify
spending greater time on doing those well.

!!! This is for all time, so, given the constraints of your equipment
and circumstances, try to do the best job that you reasonably can of
the actual physical recording process ...

* Though it can be very difficult to achieve, it's still easier,
and the results are better, to remove hum from the equipment used
before you make the recording rather than trying to subtract it
afterwards from every resulting digital file.

* Until you've tried it, you probably won't quite realise the
difference that washing a vinyl can make to the result. If you can
find a method of doing it safely, it's easier to wash grit out of the
grooves before digitising than trying to remove the resulting jumps
from the digital file. However, because washing itself may of course
be hazardous, I advise digitising before washing as well as after, so
if disaster strikes, you've at least got the unwashed version.

.... etc, etc.
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Vinyl to digital
 

Sumatriptan wrote:

Alternatively, I do have an external 24 bit res. audio capture unit
(Edirol UA-25) that has dynamic microphone inputs. I wonder if this
would work together with RIAA eq in software? MC cartridges and dynamic
mics have roughly similar output levels....don't they?


** MC cartridges are typically much lower.

A high output MC might be OK - just.


.... Phil

Vinyl to digital
 

In article , Woody
wrote:

Having said that, before you go spending lots of folding stuff see if
you can find a way of listening to your LPs first. You may find that
they have deteriorated to such an extent that the sound is too
distorted to use. If they have been in the loft, vertical and pressed
together or not, the temperature cycling could have done irreparable
damage. Even the discs I had treated with Soundguard didn't escape.

Interesting. I've not encountered that. (Almost all the LPs I have are 30+
years old.) However mine have been kept in a house room thoughout. So only
subject to the same temperature cycles as the rest of our things.

What's the effect of the damage?

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html