A half-hour BBC radio show about compression:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06tvgp1

--
Eiron.

Well, there is sensible compression and there is ridiculously high
compression, and badly set up compression, Is talk sport listening?]

Radio 1 and many other pop orientated stations use a form of compression
that almost seems to end up with a straight line of level.
R2 do this sometimes and at others seem to use a kind of gain riding system
that gradually winds the level up akin to a cheap recorder.
Brian

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"Eiron" wrote in message
...
A half-hour BBC radio show about compression:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b06tvgp1

--
Eiron.

In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
Well, there is sensible compression and there is ridiculously high
compression, and badly set up compression, Is talk sport listening?]

Radio 1 and many other pop orientated stations use a form of
compression that almost seems to end up with a straight line of level.
R2 do this sometimes and at others seem to use a kind of gain riding
system that gradually winds the level up akin to a cheap recorder.
Brian

The argument for this heavy compression tends to be car listening. Yet I
seem to manage hearing what I want to in the cars on R4 which doesn't do
this. And the heavy compression that LBC etc use simply puts me off ever
listening to them.

As I get older and my hearing deteriorates, it's even more obvious to me
that only R4 (speech wise) come close to getting things right on most
occasions. Much of TV seems to have lost the plot totally. And that's
listing on the same audio chain for both.

--
*If I throw a stick, will you leave?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 09 Jan 2016 11:31:37 +0000 (GMT), "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
Well, there is sensible compression and there is ridiculously high
compression, and badly set up compression, Is talk sport listening?]

Radio 1 and many other pop orientated stations use a form of
compression that almost seems to end up with a straight line of level.
R2 do this sometimes and at others seem to use a kind of gain riding
system that gradually winds the level up akin to a cheap recorder.
Brian

The argument for this heavy compression tends to be car listening. Yet I
seem to manage hearing what I want to in the cars on R4 which doesn't do
this. And the heavy compression that LBC etc use simply puts me off ever
listening to them.


The DAB standard had this built in at the receiving end, so you could
listen in a car with heavy compression but still enjoy full dynamic
range at home. This seems to have disappeared.

d

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In article , Don Pearce
wrote:

The DAB standard had this built in at the receiving end, so you could
listen in a car with heavy compression but still enjoy full dynamic
range at home. This seems to have disappeared.

If I recall correctly, the flag for this *and* the compression gain values
have to be provided with the broadcast stream. I'm not sure if broadcasters
bother, but then I don't use DAB much!

FWIW though, the BBC are trying to move towards having no added level
compressions on their internet radio streams. This point emerged recently
when I was talking to someone about recent/current developments which are
moving towards *all* their radio streams being available as 320k for AOD as
well as live. (At least in the UK!)


Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article ,
Don Pearce wrote:
The argument for this heavy compression tends to be car listening. Yet I
seem to manage hearing what I want to in the cars on R4 which doesn't do
this. And the heavy compression that LBC etc use simply puts me off ever
listening to them.


The DAB standard had this built in at the receiving end, so you could
listen in a car with heavy compression but still enjoy full dynamic
range at home. This seems to have disappeared.

Yes - it's in the spec, but don't know if it has ever been used by a
broadcaster. It certainly makes sense.

--
*A cubicle is just a padded cell without a door.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

A few years ago, Radio two had a series of old in concerts from the 70s and
80s. I had these recorded at the time on a fairly early dbx equipped
cassette deck on 120 tapes by tdk.
The repeats directly from the radio sounded far worse than my recordings.
One particularly by Kiki dee had one track with some hum on it and it was
the same level throughout on the old recording, on the rebroadcast it was
all over the place slowly rising while the acoustic guitars played and
ducking when the vocals came in.
All I can say is that if somebody made a good job of the original, what is
the need for passing it through a mangler compressor again.

As for the talk stations. It seems to vary on different outputs of the
station, and I notice that fm and dab are often better than freeview and
certainly better than the internet feed.
again, why process them differently?

My guess is that there are these badly set up devices in most transmitter
sites and all the feed does is wind the level up and let the last ditch
compressor handle it with dire consequences.

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
Remember, if you don't like where I post
or what I say, you don't have to
read my posts! :-)
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
Well, there is sensible compression and there is ridiculously high
compression, and badly set up compression, Is talk sport listening?]

Radio 1 and many other pop orientated stations use a form of
compression that almost seems to end up with a straight line of level.
R2 do this sometimes and at others seem to use a kind of gain riding
system that gradually winds the level up akin to a cheap recorder.
Brian

The argument for this heavy compression tends to be car listening. Yet I
seem to manage hearing what I want to in the cars on R4 which doesn't do
this. And the heavy compression that LBC etc use simply puts me off ever
listening to them.

As I get older and my hearing deteriorates, it's even more obvious to me
that only R4 (speech wise) come close to getting things right on most
occasions. Much of TV seems to have lost the plot totally. And that's
listing on the same audio chain for both.

--
*If I throw a stick, will you leave?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Hmm, have you listened to the local bbc stations on the internet? the levels
are all over the place and most I think are still in mono.

I remember reading about the idea of local compression indeed Philips before
they lost interest in domestic kit had a demo which a friend of mine went to
and was quite impressed. At that time nobody had heard the boiling mud issue
it has to be said.

Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
Remember, if you don't like where I post
or what I say, you don't have to
read my posts! :-)
"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...
In article , Don Pearce
wrote:

The DAB standard had this built in at the receiving end, so you could
listen in a car with heavy compression but still enjoy full dynamic
range at home. This seems to have disappeared.

If I recall correctly, the flag for this *and* the compression gain values
have to be provided with the broadcast stream. I'm not sure if
broadcasters
bother, but then I don't use DAB much!

FWIW though, the BBC are trying to move towards having no added level
compressions on their internet radio streams. This point emerged recently
when I was talking to someone about recent/current developments which are
moving towards *all* their radio streams being available as 320k for AOD
as
well as live. (At least in the UK!)


Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics
http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
My guess is that there are these badly set up devices in most
transmitter sites and all the feed does is wind the level up and let
the last ditch compressor handle it with dire consequences.

What you have to remember is the people who are in charge of radio and TV
never ever watch or listen to it at home. They far prefer going to the
opera. They may just watch or listen to a pre-view of a prog in their
office during working hours.

So to actually check the program is transmitted properly would be a waste
of money to them. And profits are the only truely important thing.

--
*When you get a bladder infection urine trouble.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

I notice in the settings on my pure sonus 1 there is a setting which is
supposed to make the stations sound the same level, at least that is what I
imagine its for, personally, I cannot hear any difference.
Brian

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
My guess is that there are these badly set up devices in most
transmitter sites and all the feed does is wind the level up and let
the last ditch compressor handle it with dire consequences.

What you have to remember is the people who are in charge of radio and TV
never ever watch or listen to it at home. They far prefer going to the
opera. They may just watch or listen to a pre-view of a prog in their
office during working hours.

So to actually check the program is transmitted properly would be a waste
of money to them. And profits are the only truely important thing.

--
*When you get a bladder infection urine trouble.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

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