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In article , Iain Churches
wrote:

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...

FWIW I've recently been transferring and de-clicking some Ellington
'Radio Transcriptions' discs released on Decca London in the late
1970s. These are remarkably good compared with what you'd expect from
commercial 78s from the time (1946-7). Sadly, the shop only had
volumes 1-4 so I didn't get volume 5. But not bad for 3 quid a pop. :-)

You seem to have found an excellent source for interesting music at a
very reasonable price.

Alas, now gone. The shop only existed here on a month-by-month rental
whilst the property owner looked for a tenant willing to pay more for a
longer term. So the shop appeared, then vanished again at short notice less
than a year later. It was, I think, and offshoot from a Glasgow shop. But
it isn't practical for me to travel somewhere like that.

Do you clean the LP's before transfer?

In general I just use something like a parastat or preener. Then use a dust
bug. May use a zerostat if the weather is allowing static problems to
arise.

On occasion I have experimented with wet cleaning, but have tended to
conclude that if discs are that dirty from second-hand they'll have lots of
physical damage anyway.

Many shops that sell vinyl have a recording cleaning machine. My
favourite shop charges 1e (which includes a cup of coffee whiole you
wait)

No such shops in town. We are now back in the situation where the only
places to buy LPs is the charity shops that sell them second-hand in 'take
it or leave it' condition. They do advertise some in the window which they
think will be trendy and put a higher price on them. But I suspect this is
purely on the basis of what they see on the cover and have no idea about
condition, etc.

Some public libraries also offer the same service (but no coffee:-)

I might have to travel abroad for that! So far as I know, no local library
these days even offers Audio CDs, let alone any service for LP use! The
town library sold off their CDs a few years ago, and that was that.

The LPs I bought 'new' back in the day are all in good condition. The ones
I bought recently second-hand vary. But I decided that at 3 quid a go it
was simplest to accept some would be 'duds' and prove not worth the effort.
I looked in the shop for any obvious scratches, etc. Then took a punt on
ones that looked OK.

In practice I found that the results, statistically, varied with genre.

1) Pop LPs. Almost all very badly worn and scratched. Often ground-in dirt.
I stopped bothering after trying a few as the pattern was clear enough.
Death by Dansette. 8-]

2) Classical LPs. Much more varied. Some were 'as new' - i.e. as good as I
used to encounter when buying new. Others have lots of ticks and clicks
which are low-level but audible during quieter passages of music. They'd
have been masked on louder popular LPs, but showed up on during long quiet
passages. Experiments showed these were essentially marks in the vinyl. The
results can sound good. But may take a long time to fix most of the many,
many small audible clicks.

3) Jazz LPs. Again variable. But my impression is that either their owners
were more often more careful than 'pop' buyers, and/or the smaller ticks
and clicks weren't audible because the level of the music was higher than
on the classical LPs. (When using Audacity with such discs I can often see
ticks in the hf which I can't hear because the music is loud enough to
render them un-noticable. I may still remove some of them, but can decide
not to bother as I prefer.)

So after some initial expriments I focussed on buying 3 quid Jazz LPs.
Served the excellent purpose of letting me get a lot of Jazz I'd otherwise
never have decided to obtain. And made transcribing easier as the extent of
the noticable problems was lower than the other catagories.

How true any of that may be in general, I don't know. But it was what I
found from the LPs that were on offer here. Alas, no longer.

Given that now the big companies keep offerring box sets of old classical
recordings at about 2 quid a CD, I'm happy enough to buy Classical music
that way - depending on the choice on offer.

Maybe there are similar Jazz boxes. I have found out about a few - e.g. a
large Sidney Bichet box set I got a couple of years ago. The problem there
is finding out about them.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

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In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:
It is essential to have access to as many copies
of the original as you can lay your hands on.
Quite often metal matrices (mothers) were still
available. These were an excellent source of
cleanish audio and helped to speed up the
process. But, you could not mix shellac and
metals as a source for the same title.

You could actually read my post before replying.

My reply was to illustrate why you should not simply
declick (shorten) an analogue tape in the way you did.
and answered your question:

And I had already told you why the razor blade option was the only
practical one in this instance.

As I said you have absolutely no experience of broadcast and the time
scales involved, let alone budget constraints.

--
*Middle age is when work is a lot less fun - and fun a lot more work.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

CHLO-E
 

In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,

In the "real world of broadcast", your plexi
screens around drummers, and lapel mics stuck
to the bridges of violins with BluTack, were
clearly not optimum solutions:-)

You never attend live music events, then?

Frequently. Often too as a player.

I play in both a classical ensemble and a big band.

I alaso mix FOH for a theatre musical group. So
probably altogether some thirty plus events a year,
and not a plexi screen or lump of BluTack in sight:-)

Odd. The very first time I saw personal mics clipped to violins was not on
TV, but the James Last band in a live performance. In the 1970s.

Do you have a string section in your big band? In your 'theatre group'?

--
*I don't feel old. I don't feel anything until noon. Then it's time for my nap.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

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"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...

Given that now the big companies keep offerring box sets of old classical
recordings at about 2 quid a CD, I'm happy enough to buy Classical music
that way - depending on the choice on offer.

Maybe there are similar Jazz boxes. I have found out about a few - e.g. a
large Sidney Bichet box set I got a couple of years ago. The problem there
is finding out about them.

You mentioned Count Basie earlier. Do you have his 1957 album
"Atomic Mr Basie", which has some twelve excellent tracks, "Kid From
Red Bank", "After Supper", "Teddy The Toad", "Splanky" etc etc.

Just a couple of days ago, I came across a CD
entitled "The Complete Atomic Basie" which has twenty titles,
(all recorded for the original LP) eight of which were
not included on the original LP or CD. Highly recommended!

Iain

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In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:
I alaso mix FOH for a theatre musical group. So
probably altogether some thirty plus events a year,
and not a plexi screen or lump of BluTack in sight:-)

I have this vision of you enclosing the lead singer in a series of studio
acoustic screens on stage. All in the pursuit of 'perfect' sound.

Do you ban the set designer from the theatre? ;-)

--
*Sticks and stones may break my bones but whips and chains excite me*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

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Jim Lesurf said:

No such shops in town. We are now back in the situation where the only
places to buy LPs is the charity shops that sell them second-hand in 'take
it or leave it' condition. They do advertise some in the window which they
think will be trendy and put a higher price on them. But I suspect this is
purely on the basis of what they see on the cover and have no idea about
condition, etc.

I think so. Maybe they vary ... I finally got rid of some of my old vinyl
last year. The first batch, I gave to the local Oxfam. One LP in particular
was so badly knackered I didn't even bother trying to rip it, just paid a
fiver for a cd reissue. The day after I gave it to Oxfam it was in the
window for a tenner. I really hope no-one bought it for the music, they'd
have felt really ripped off.


--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem

My email address is at http://www.qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

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In article ,
Richard Robinson wrote:
I think so. Maybe they vary ... I finally got rid of some of my old vinyl
last year.

Bad timing with the latest vinyl 'revival' ;-)

Although I'm told many new buyers never actually play them. Purely for
display.

I've got one pal who 'got rid' of vinyl not long after CD came out. Then
went back to it after reading of a revival some years ago. Then got rid of
it again, with everything on his computer. And is now going to revive it
once more.

Perhaps I'm lucky in being too mean to discard something that still works
here. Still got working 1/4" tape, as well as LP.

--
*No I haven't stolen it , I'm just a **** driver*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

CHLO-E
 

In article , Iain Churches
wrote:

You mentioned Count Basie earlier. Do you have his 1957 album "Atomic
Mr Basie", which has some twelve excellent tracks, "Kid From Red Bank",
"After Supper", "Teddy The Toad", "Splanky" etc etc.

Just a couple of days ago, I came across a CD entitled "The Complete
Atomic Basie" which has twenty titles, (all recorded for the original
LP) eight of which were not included on the original LP or CD. Highly
recommended!

I've got the Roulette-branded 'Atomic' CD with five 'extra' tracks. And a
'Four classic albums' 2CD from Avid which I suspect is taken from LPs and
includes the 'Atomic' set. Plus various other Basie CDs and LPs. I've not
really tried to be 'completist' as I just get things as they might crop up.
Still just exploring, and finding that things I've never heard of can be as
interesting as names I've come to like!

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

CHLO-E
 

Dave Plowman (News) said:
In article ,
Richard Robinson wrote:
I think so. Maybe they vary ... I finally got rid of some of my old vinyl
last year.

Bad timing with the latest vinyl 'revival' ;-)

I don't think so, I'm happy. Insofar as it's an issue of quality, I find
44.1k 16bit stereo is good enough for my 60+yearold ears (or if it isn't, I
don't miss what I never had before. I'll settle for it), and a lot of the
rest seems to be a Fashion Thing, which never bothered me much.

(There is a remainder - I have a friend who likes little-known rock bands,
who use their gigs to sell very expensive vinyl, which she likes to buy by
way of keeping her favourite bands viable. Kind of like crowd-funding but
with a souvenir. That bit seems like a resaonable idea and I approve of it,
but it's not what happens in my musical world; nor could I afford it).

Although I'm told many new buyers never actually play them. Purely for
display.

I was brought up in the world of 'classical', and still reckon music is for
the ears, not the eyes. Stamp-collecting of sleeves is Someone Else's
Problem.

I've got one pal who 'got rid' of vinyl not long after CD came out. Then
went back to it after reading of a revival some years ago. Then got rid of
it again, with everything on his computer. And is now going to revive it
once more.

Weird.

Perhaps I'm lucky in being too mean to discard something that still works
here. Still got working 1/4" tape, as well as LP.

I was orginally driven into digitising by getting upset at the way my 20yo
cassettes were becoming unplayable. And I've ended up with everything on a
hard disk and all visible in one big list (played via a raspberry pi running
MPD, thanks to help here last year. I still haven't found the perfect
client, but gmpc works well enough). As I said, I'm happy.

I didn't get rid of all the vinyl, I kept the ones with sleevenotes
containing info I might possibly want but couldn't face typing up. They're
under a bed upstairs, because that's the only reason for keeping them (plus
sentiment, in a few cases). I certainly don't intend to keep a deck running.

--
Richard Robinson
"The whole plan hinged upon the natural curiosity of potatoes" - S. Lem

My email address is at http://www.qualmograph.org.uk/contact.html

CHLO-E
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,

In the "real world of broadcast", your plexi
screens around drummers, and lapel mics stuck
to the bridges of violins with BluTack, were
clearly not optimum solutions:-)

You never attend live music events, then?

Frequently. Often too as a player.

I play in both a classical ensemble and a big band.

I alaso mix FOH for a theatre musical group. So
probably altogether some thirty plus events a year,
and not a plexi screen or lump of BluTack in sight:-)

Odd. The very first time I saw personal mics clipped to violins was not on
TV, but the James Last band in a live performance. In the 1970s.

Both plexi and BluTack (or equivalent) were in
use in British TV well before that. I can remember
Phil Seaman (the finest British jazz drummer of
that era and a larger than life character with a
penchant for outrageous japes) commenting on
the poor sound from "sticky violins" in TV light
music broadcasts.
He gave a hilarious impression of an unsuspecting
player bowing frantically as the putty melted under
the set lights, and the mic slid into his/her lap.
He once took a rope ladder to a TV show with the
intent to scale the perspex wall around his drums while
the end credits were rolling :-) This would have
been about 1966.

Do you have a string section in your big band?

No, But saxophones double on woodwinds, and
flutes in particular, are just as vulnerable to leakage
as strings are. So the set up still needs great care.

In your 'theatre group'?

It's a theatre musical group.
Yes, we have strings quite often.


Iain