Why Bose?
 

Dave Plowman (Nutcase & Moron) wrote:


---------------------------------------

** Bose did not sell an PA amplifier in the early 70s.

I've no idea of the number, but I can describe it.

In a vinyl covered case (similar to a guitar amp, etc). Rack width, and
with the equaliser mounted in the box too. About 4U high and roughly
square. Pretty heavy so likely had a decent size transformer. Cooling fan.
Odd thing was the speaker output connectors were 1/4" jacks - same as the
speakers. Whole lot clearly labelled Bose. Of course it could have been
something cobbled together by the UK importer.

Not the sort of thing you'd do for a domestic amp. Designed for being
moved around - it even had a lid and carrying handles.



** Bose sold a model 1801 amplifiers for *domestic use* with 901 speakers.

It had NO fan, weighed 37kgs and featured large inverted VUs on the front.

Jacks sockets for input and binding posts for output.

Possibly available in the UK from 1975.

Front view:

https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NzY4WDEwMjQ=/z/AdwAAOSwax5Yp1v-/$_86.JPG

Back view:

http://product-images.highwire.com/5475850/bose1801.jpg

Domestic hi-fi, not PA gear.

The model 1800 was the later PA version with no VUs.

Both models suffered from serious design flaws, they would go DC full rail at any time, cease to work if you operated the power switch during loud use and had the poorest reactive load driving ability of any power amp ever sold.

A perfect match for Bose's overstuffed little boxes.

Bose are for Bozos.


..... Phil

Why Bose?
 

On 20/07/2017 11:58 AM, Phil Allison wrote:

Bose are for Bozos.

**Emphatically agreed. Back when I had my retail store, a client walked
in, looking for a system. He said that he had been listening to some
'high end' speakers in a flat-mate's system, but he was prepared to
compromise. Turns out they were Bose 901 speakers (around $2.5k back
then). I said "No problems". I connected a nice pair of Mordaunt Short
speakers (around $600.00), a Sansui AUD33X amp, a Dual 505-3 and a
Nagaoka cartridge. Total value, less than $2.5k. The guys was,
predictably, stunned that the system sounded much nicer than his mate's,
much more expensive, system.

The Bose 901 has not been a viable product for a long time. Hardly any
are sold in Australia (I know at least one Bose dealer that has not sold
a pair in several years) and very few anywhere else. Bose keeps them in
production, because not to do so would be an admission that the product
always was a seriously flawed design.

I, too, have worked on some 1801 amps. Burned PCBs, smoked outputs, etc.
Horrible design. That said, I have found a couple of Nice Bose products:

https://www.bose.com.au/en_au/produc...ver_anz_in_uae

A really nice $50.00 computer speaker.

https://www.bose.com.au/en_au/produc...lo_5_black_anz

Reasonable sound and easy to use,

Of course, both products are nonsensically over-priced.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Why Bose?
 

Trevor Wilson wrote:

--------------------

Phil Allison wrote:

Bose are for Bozos.

**Emphatically agreed.

I, too, have worked on some 1801 amps. Burned PCBs, smoked outputs, etc.
Horrible design.



** Did you see failures of the soft start resistor ??

If the amp is ever switched on with strong audio signal present at the input, the combination of a huge transformer & filter capacitor inrush plus audio power to the speakers at that moment smoked the 8 ohm, 10W resistor.

Happened to *every* Bose 1800 owned by the hire business I did repairs for.

Main cause was the LACK of input mating at switch on.

As the amps built up more hours, the hot running 3k/2W carbon comp resistors on the power boards fell in value to under 1kohms casing their associated 15V zener to fail short. This meant the op-amp at the input lost one rail and sent the output stage to full DC !!!!

The VI limiting circuit for the output transistors was super fast and overcooked. With even a mildly reactive 8 ohm load, +/- full rail spikes appeared on the output at less than rated power.

Oh, and if the AC supply went even a little high, the amp hummed.

My schem is marked with simple fixes for all the above.



...... Phil

Why Bose?
 

On 20/07/2017 1:58 PM, Phil Allison wrote:
Trevor Wilson wrote:

--------------------

Phil Allison wrote:

Bose are for Bozos.

**Emphatically agreed.

I, too, have worked on some 1801 amps. Burned PCBs, smoked outputs,
etc. Horrible design.



** Did you see failures of the soft start resistor ??

**Possibly, but I don't recall. I've only worked on a couple of the
damned things and it has been awhile.


If the amp is ever switched on with strong audio signal present at
the input, the combination of a huge transformer & filter capacitor
inrush plus audio power to the speakers at that moment smoked the 8
ohm, 10W resistor.

**Now that fault I have seen, but in other amplifiers. The big ME power
amps (5.5kVA transformer + 310,000uF) were susceptible to such a fault,
except the resistor was a 4.7 Ohm 50 Watt ceramic type. Replacing with a
100 Watt aluminium clad or an NTC resistor (an array, actually) solved
the problem.


Happened to *every* Bose 1800 owned by the hire business I did
repairs for.

Main cause was the LACK of input mating at switch on.

As the amps built up more hours, the hot running 3k/2W carbon comp
resistors on the power boards fell in value to under 1kohms casing
their associated 15V zener to fail short. This meant the op-amp at
the input lost one rail and sent the output stage to full DC !!!!

**Ouch!


The VI limiting circuit for the output transistors was super fast and
overcooked. With even a mildly reactive 8 ohm load, +/- full rail
spikes appeared on the output at less than rated power.

**That much I noted under test. Disgusting.


Oh, and if the AC supply went even a little high, the amp hummed.

My schem is marked with simple fixes for all the above.

**How did you fix the hum?


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

Why Bose?
 

Trevor Wilson wrote:

------------------------

Phil Allison wrote:

Bose are for Bozos.

**Emphatically agreed.

I, too, have worked on some 1801 amps. Burned PCBs, smoked outputs,
etc. Horrible design.



** Did you see failures of the soft start resistor ??

**Possibly, but I don't recall. I've only worked on a couple of the
damned things and it has been awhile.


If the amp is ever switched on with strong audio signal present at
the input, the combination of a huge transformer & filter capacitor
inrush plus audio power to the speakers at that moment smoked the 8
ohm, 10W resistor.

**Now that fault I have seen, but in other amplifiers. The big ME power
amps (5.5kVA transformer + 310,000uF) were susceptible to such a fault,
except the resistor was a 4.7 Ohm 50 Watt ceramic type. Replacing with a
100 Watt aluminium clad or an NTC resistor (an array, actually) solved
the problem.


Happened to *every* Bose 1800 owned by the hire business I did
repairs for.

Main cause was the LACK of input mating at switch on.

As the amps built up more hours, the hot running 3k/2W carbon comp
resistors on the power boards fell in value to under 1kohms casing
their associated 15V zener to fail short. This meant the op-amp at
the input lost one rail and sent the output stage to full DC !!!!

**Ouch!


The VI limiting circuit for the output transistors was super fast and
overcooked. With even a mildly reactive 8 ohm load, +/- full rail
spikes appeared on the output at less than rated power.

**That much I noted under test. Disgusting.


Oh, and if the AC supply went even a little high, the amp hummed.

My schem is marked with simple fixes for all the above.

**How did you fix the hum?



** Change 20kohm to a 30kohm ( add a 10kohm in series) that biased the base of the current source transistor for the class A stage.

Having too much current ( over 20mA) put the preceding diff pair and cascode class A pair out of balance.

The +/-DC rails on 1800s I saw was 96V instead of the schematic's 84V.

The other fixes all involved resistor changes or additions.


..... Phil

Why Bose?
 

Trevor Wilson wrote:

------------------------

Phil Allison wrote:

Bose are for Bozos.

**Emphatically agreed.

I, too, have worked on some 1801 amps. Burned PCBs, smoked outputs,
etc. Horrible design.



** Did you see failures of the soft start resistor ??

**Possibly, but I don't recall. I've only worked on a couple of the
damned things and it has been awhile.


If the amp is ever switched on with strong audio signal present at
the input, the combination of a huge transformer & filter capacitor
inrush plus audio power to the speakers at that moment smoked the 8
ohm, 10W resistor.

**Now that fault I have seen, but in other amplifiers. The big ME power
amps (5.5kVA transformer + 310,000uF) were susceptible to such a fault,
except the resistor was a 4.7 Ohm 50 Watt ceramic type. Replacing with a
100 Watt aluminium clad or an NTC resistor (an array, actually) solved
the problem.


Happened to *every* Bose 1800 owned by the hire business I did
repairs for.

Main cause was the LACK of input mating at switch on.

As the amps built up more hours, the hot running 3k/2W carbon comp
resistors on the power boards fell in value to under 1kohms casing
their associated 15V zener to fail short. This meant the op-amp at
the input lost one rail and sent the output stage to full DC !!!!

**Ouch!


The VI limiting circuit for the output transistors was super fast and
overcooked. With even a mildly reactive 8 ohm load, +/- full rail
spikes appeared on the output at less than rated power.

**That much I noted under test. Disgusting.


Oh, and if the AC supply went even a little high, the amp hummed.

My schem is marked with simple fixes for all the above.

**How did you fix the hum?



** Change 20kohm to a 30kohm ( add a 10kohm in series) that biased the base of the current source transistor for the class A stage.

Having too much current ( over 20mA) put the preceding diff pair and cascode class A pair out of balance.

The +/-DC rails on 1800s I saw was 96V instead of the schematic's 84V.

The other fixes all involved resistor changes or additions.


..... Phil

Why Bose?
 

In article ,
Phil Allison wrote:
In a vinyl covered case (similar to a guitar amp, etc). Rack width,
and with the equaliser mounted in the box too. About 4U high and
roughly square. Pretty heavy so likely had a decent size transformer.
Cooling fan. Odd thing was the speaker output connectors were 1/4"
jacks - same as the speakers. Whole lot clearly labelled Bose. Of
course it could have been something cobbled together by the UK
importer.

Not the sort of thing you'd do for a domestic amp. Designed for being
moved around - it even had a lid and carrying handles.



** Bose sold a model 1801 amplifiers for *domestic use* with 901
speakers.

It had NO fan, weighed 37kgs and featured large inverted VUs on the
front.

Jacks sockets for input and binding posts for output.

Possibly available in the UK from 1975.

Then that's not the one I described. Perhaps you could get your nurse to
read things out to you?

--
*Why do overlook and oversee mean opposite things?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Why Bose?
 

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:



Not the sort of thing you'd do for a domestic amp. Designed for being
moved around - it even had a lid and carrying handles.



** Bose sold a model 1801 amplifiers for *domestic use* with 901
speakers.

It had NO fan, weighed 37kgs and featured large inverted VUs on the
front.

Jacks sockets for input and binding posts for output.

Possibly available in the UK from 1975.

Then that's not the one I described.




** What you described was no Bose amp ever made..

I posted pics of the Bose 1801 to prove that point

You did not describe the speakers at all.

So probably not Bose either.

FFS look up the Bose 800 model.

Then go **** yourself.




..... Phil



..... Phil

Why Bose?
 

In article ,
Phil Allison wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:



Not the sort of thing you'd do for a domestic amp. Designed for
being moved around - it even had a lid and carrying handles.



** Bose sold a model 1801 amplifiers for *domestic use* with 901
speakers.

It had NO fan, weighed 37kgs and featured large inverted VUs on the
front.

Jacks sockets for input and binding posts for output.

Possibly available in the UK from 1975.

Then that's not the one I described.




** What you described was no Bose amp ever made..

ITYM one you've never seen. A very different matter.

But carry on enjoying your own little world.


Perhaps you might ponder on why Bose would make speakers specifically for
PA etc use - vinyl covered with lids - but not a matching amp? Especially
since those speakers need an active equaliser to give their best?

It's quite possible the one I'm referring to is an amp sourced from
elsewhere, but built into the case and simply badged Bose. I neither know
nor care.

--
*If you can't see my mirrors, I'm doing my hair*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Why Bose?
 

Dave Plowman (Nutcase and DAMN LIAR ) wrote:



Not the sort of thing you'd do for a domestic amp. Designed for
being moved around - it even had a lid and carrying handles.



** Bose sold a model 1801 amplifiers for *domestic use* with 901
speakers.

It had NO fan, weighed 37kgs and featured large inverted VUs on the
front.

Jacks sockets for input and binding posts for output.

Possibly available in the UK from 1975.

Then that's not the one I described.




** What you described was no Bose amp ever made.

ITYM one you've never seen.


** Nor anybody else.

The ONUS is 1000% on you to prove otherwise.

Plenty on the net about Bose amps.



Perhaps you might ponder on why Bose would make speakers specifically for
PA etc use



** In fact just a simple modification to the existing 901 model.

8 x 16ohm cheap 4inch woofers instead of 9 x 8ohm ones *rammed* in a tiny wooden box that sound like pox.

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTE5NVgxNjAw/z/37YAAOSwwNVTsw2n/$_3.JPG


It's quite possible the one I'm referring to is an amp sourced from
elsewhere, but built into the case and simply badged Bose. I neither know
nor care.


** It ****s up your entire bull**** story.

Cos the PA system was not made by Bose.




...... Phil

Why Bose?
 

In article ,
Phil Allison wrote:
Perhaps you might ponder on why Bose would make speakers specifically
for PA etc use



** In fact just a simple modification to the existing 901 model.

Right. So we can add the Bose speakers I'm talking about to the amp you
haven't seen either.

And if you haven't seen something in your tiny country it doesn't exist.

--
*If one synchronized swimmer drowns, do the rest have to drown too?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Why Bose?
 

In article ,
Phil Allison wrote:
** In the early 70s, the only PA product Bose sold was the model 800
speaker.

Very wrong. Again. The units mentioned are 802.

--
*Remember: First you pillage, then you burn.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Why Bose?
 

Dave Plowman Criminal Psychopath & Pommy **** wrote:

-----------------------------------------------------



** In the early 70s, the only PA product Bose sold was the model 800
speaker.


Very wrong. Again. The units mentioned are 802.



** The Bose 802 speaker came much later, a totally plastic box with plastic frame woofers with twin,front ports - absolutely no wood or vinyl as YOU described - which *were* features of the 800 model

So Plowman is a LYING **** and continues to make **** up cos he has no facts.


FYI:


David Plowman ( typical pommy, geriatric scumbag ) is a festering, vile, autistic and schizophrenic pile human garbage that really should have been aborted at the earliest possible age.

And his remains fed to pigs.

And the pigs would have puked.


---------------------------------


Think I am way over the top exaggerating ??

Not one tiny, little bit.





..... Phil

Why Bose?
 

On Fri, 21 Jul 2017 05:12:19 -0700 (PDT), Phil Allison
wrote:

Dave Plowman Criminal Psychopath & Pommy **** wrote:

-----------------------------------------------------



** In the early 70s, the only PA product Bose sold was the model 800
speaker.


Very wrong. Again. The units mentioned are 802.



** The Bose 802 speaker came much later, a totally plastic box with plastic frame woofers with twin,front ports - absolutely no wood or vinyl as YOU described - which *were* features of the 800 model

So Plowman is a LYING **** and continues to make **** up cos he has no facts.


Wood. You can buy some if you want

https://www.gumtree.com/p/home-cinem...ers/1247132054

d

---
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Why Bose?
 

Don Pearce wrote:

-------------------------


Wood. You can buy some if you want



** The 802W ( wood & plastic ) is a rare, later version of the plastic 802.

As you damn well know.

You stinking pommy ****.




...... Phil

Why Bose?
 

In article ,
Phil Allison wrote:
Dave Plowman Criminal Psychopath & Pommy **** wrote:

-----------------------------------------------------



** In the early 70s, the only PA product Bose sold was the model 800
speaker.


Very wrong. Again. The units mentioned are 802.



** The Bose 802 speaker came much later, a totally plastic box with
plastic frame woofers with twin,front ports - absolutely no wood or
vinyl as YOU described - which *were* features of the 800 model

Who mentioned wood - apart from you?

They were around in the mid 70s in the UK.

I don't give a stuff when you first saw them.

--
*If only you'd use your powers for good instead of evil.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Why Bose?
 

In article ,
Phil Allison wrote:
Don Pearce wrote:

-------------------------


Wood. You can buy some if you want



** The 802W ( wood & plastic ) is a rare, later version of the plastic 802.

As you damn well know.

You stinking pommy ****.


And Brexiteers say the way forward is a trade agreement with Oz. Only if
we can supply them with some decent meds.

--
*The problem with the world is that everyone is a few drinks behind *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Why Bose?
 

In article , Phil
Allison scribeth thus
Trevor Wilson wrote:

--------------------

Phil Allison wrote:

Bose are for Bozos.

**Emphatically agreed.

I, too, have worked on some 1801 amps. Burned PCBs, smoked outputs, etc.
Horrible design.



** Did you see failures of the soft start resistor ??

If the amp is ever switched on with strong audio signal present at the input,
the combination of a huge transformer & filter capacitor inrush plus audio power
to the speakers at that moment smoked the 8 ohm, 10W resistor.

Happened to *every* Bose 1800 owned by the hire business I did repairs for.

Main cause was the LACK of input mating at switch on.

As the amps built up more hours, the hot running 3k/2W carbon comp resistors on
the power boards fell in value to under 1kohms casing their associated 15V zener
to fail short. This meant the op-amp at the input lost one rail and sent the
output stage to full DC !!!!

The VI limiting circuit for the output transistors was super fast and
overcooked. With even a mildly reactive 8 ohm load, +/- full rail spikes
appeared on the output at less than rated power.

Oh, and if the AC supply went even a little high, the amp hummed.



My schem is marked with simple fixes for all the above.



Who designed it originally, anyone we might have heard of?...



..... Phil

--
Tony Sayer

Why Bose?
 

Dave Plowman Lying Pile of Pommy **** wrote:

---------------------------------------------




** In the early 70s, the only PA product Bose sold was the model 800
speaker.


Very wrong. Again. The units mentioned are 802.



** The Bose 802 speaker came much later, a totally plastic box with
plastic frame woofers with twin,front ports - absolutely no wood or
vinyl as YOU described - which *were* features of the 800 model

Who mentioned wood - apart from you?


** You ****ing did.

Your " vinyl covered with lids " remark describes the 800 exactly.

No 802s in the early 70s.


...... Phil

Why Bose?
 

tony sayer wrote:

-------------------


Phil Allison wrote:

Bose are for Bozos.

**Emphatically agreed.

I, too, have worked on some 1801 amps. Burned PCBs, smoked outputs, etc.
Horrible design.



** Did you see failures of the soft start resistor ??

If the amp is ever switched on with strong audio signal present at the input,
the combination of a huge transformer & filter capacitor inrush plus audio power
to the speakers at that moment smoked the 8 ohm, 10W resistor.

Happened to *every* Bose 1800 owned by the hire business I did repairs for.

Main cause was the LACK of input mating at switch on.

As the amps built up more hours, the hot running 3k/2W carbon comp resistors on
the power boards fell in value to under 1kohms casing their associated 15V zener
to fail short. This meant the op-amp at the input lost one rail and sent the
output stage to full DC !!!!

The VI limiting circuit for the output transistors was super fast and
overcooked. With even a mildly reactive 8 ohm load, +/- full rail spikes
appeared on the output at less than rated power.

Oh, and if the AC supply went even a little high, the amp hummed.



My schem is marked with simple fixes for all the above.



Who designed it originally, anyone we might have heard of?...



** Seems to be a well kept secret.

Other Bose 1800 marks ( up to VI) were rebadged amps made by BGW and later Carver.


..... Phil



Tony Sayer

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:
keskiviikko 19. heinäkuuta 2017 3.13.11 UTC+3 ~misfit~ kirjoitti:
Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:


Don't kid yourself:-)

If you had gone to the back of the stage you would probably have
found small Soundcraft mixer, fader positions marked with sticky
tape and red marker pen, set up by whoever installed the system.
At the sound check of such gigs, it is usually the bouncer or the
barman who stands in front of the stage for 30 seconds and says,
"Yes. I can hear everyone"

... which is why I was hired by a band back in the late 70s / early
80s to initially set up the mixer (and tweak as the room filled or
otherwise) before / during operating what started as rudimentary
stage lighting (progressing on to a full off-stage mix a few months
later and more lights every so often).

I spent three years working with that band, living in hotels and
'band accomodation' eight nights out of ten and touring the country,
most often driving the bands bus between towns on Sun/Mon or
Tuesday. I have many many fond memories of that time (and more than
a few gaps...). ;) --

Halcyon days!

Indeed.

Working at a recording studio, I didn't have much spare time,afer
work, overtime and study. But when I did, I played vibraphone in a
MJQ-style band called "Sophisticated Jazz" at hotel and night club
gig, whenever time permitted. I was a huge John Lewis/Milt Jackson
fan at the time.

The band I worked with started with a mix of their own music and covers.
Their were five members, most multi-instrumentalists with their own
preference of music so their original material was some jazz-rock 'fusion'
with some blues thrown in. However over the years, due to the (pub and club)
crowds they mostly played to, the original material was first relegated
mostly to the opening set then dispensed with all together in favour of
covers. I've never since heard any band play Skynrd's Freebird (the live
version) complete with twin leads playing note for note, tone for tone
virtually identical to the original - or Steely Dan's 'The Royal Scam'
complete with note-perfect muted trumpet parts.

Most places where we played had a handful of Reslo mics, and a small
mixer on which the levels and fixed-band EQs had been set up when the
system was initially installed. On the top of the mixer was usually a
paper "Don't touch!" Our guitarist and bass player both had small
combo amps, and so an an acoustic band we controlled our own internal
balance and were not dependent on PA.

The band I worked with originally had four of the five guys take turns as
lead vocals for various songs as well as mics for alto and tennor sax,
trombone and trumpet going through an 8 channel on-stage mixer. Guitars,
bass and keyboards had their own amps and set their volumes per my
instructions. We started small with a couple Perreaux 'Blockbuster'
amplifiers (each with one each 180 & 70 watt channels - I still have one),
one per side powering a 'W bin' with an 18" driver, a 12" midrange and a
horn topped by an array of six piezo 'sizzlers'. 250w per side.

Latterly I ended up micing first the drums then the bass, guitars and
keyboard / synths (Fender Rhodes / Korg) amps through a (hired) 5kw a side
PA with a 24 channel off-stage mixing desk. The lighting system underwent a
similar upgrade over that time. We owned a bus that I had converted to 70:30
freight / passenger with double-doors on the back to fit the rather large
speaker systems (mostly JBL) and amplification (mostly Perreaux) in. No Bose
in sight, though there were a couple of large clubs that had secondary PA
systems for the back of the club and bar area that were Bose.

I also fully reconditioned the engine of the bus during a rare week off (A
Bedford 300 diesel) and did some singing during practices! It was a
wonderful, crazy time. :)
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet ~misfit~ wrote:
Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:
keskiviikko 19. heinäkuuta 2017 3.13.11 UTC+3 ~misfit~ kirjoitti:
Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:


Don't kid yourself:-)

If you had gone to the back of the stage you would probably have
found small Soundcraft mixer, fader positions marked with sticky
tape and red marker pen, set up by whoever installed the system.
At the sound check of such gigs, it is usually the bouncer or the
barman who stands in front of the stage for 30 seconds and says,
"Yes. I can hear everyone"

... which is why I was hired by a band back in the late 70s / early
80s to initially set up the mixer (and tweak as the room filled or
otherwise) before / during operating what started as rudimentary
stage lighting (progressing on to a full off-stage mix a few months
later and more lights every so often).

I spent three years working with that band, living in hotels and
'band accomodation' eight nights out of ten and touring the country,
most often driving the bands bus between towns on Sun/Mon or
Tuesday. I have many many fond memories of that time (and more than
a few gaps...). ;) --

Halcyon days!

Indeed.

Working at a recording studio, I didn't have much spare time,afer
work, overtime and study. But when I did, I played vibraphone in a
MJQ-style band called "Sophisticated Jazz" at hotel and night club
gig, whenever time permitted. I was a huge John Lewis/Milt Jackson
fan at the time.

The band I worked with started with a mix of their own music and
covers. Their were five members, most multi-instrumentalists with
their own preference of music so their original material was some
jazz-rock 'fusion' with some blues thrown in. However over the years,
due to the (pub and club) crowds they mostly played to, the original
material was first relegated mostly to the opening set then dispensed
with all together in favour of covers. I've never since heard any
band play Skynrd's Freebird (the live version) complete with twin
leads playing note for note, tone for tone virtually identical to the
original - or Steely Dan's 'The Royal Scam' complete with
note-perfect muted trumpet parts.
Most places where we played had a handful of Reslo mics, and a small
mixer on which the levels and fixed-band EQs had been set up when the
system was initially installed. On the top of the mixer was usually a
paper "Don't touch!" Our guitarist and bass player both had small
combo amps, and so an an acoustic band we controlled our own internal
balance and were not dependent on PA.

The band I worked with originally had four of the five guys take
turns as lead vocals for various songs as well as mics for alto and
tennor sax, trombone and trumpet going through an 8 channel on-stage
mixer. Guitars, bass and keyboards had their own amps and set their
volumes per my instructions. We started small with a couple Perreaux
'Blockbuster' amplifiers (each with one each 180 & 70 watt channels -
I still have one), one per side powering a 'W bin' with an 18"
driver, a 12" midrange and a horn topped by an array of six piezo
'sizzlers'. 250w per side.
Latterly I ended up micing first the drums then the bass, guitars and
keyboard / synths (Fender Rhodes / Korg) amps through a (hired) 5kw a
side PA with a 24 channel off-stage mixing desk. The lighting system
underwent a similar upgrade over that time. We owned a bus that I had
converted to 70:30 freight / passenger with double-doors on the back
to fit the rather large speaker systems (mostly JBL) and
amplification (mostly Perreaux) in. No Bose in sight, though there
were a couple of large clubs that had secondary PA systems for the
back of the club and bar area that were Bose.
I also fully reconditioned the engine of the bus during a rare week
off (A Bedford 300 diesel) and did some singing during practices! It
was a wonderful, crazy time. :)

In case anyone's wondering about the Perreaux amplification I'm in New
Zealand. :) They got their start in the early 1970s making PA amps using
BPJ transitor output devices and only 'discovered' MOSFETs in the mid / late
80s - at about which time they decided to go into the home audio market and
by the 1990s had, TTBOMK, stopped making PA amps.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Why Bose?
 

~misfit~ wrote:

-----------------



In case anyone's wondering about the Perreaux amplification I'm in New
Zealand. :) They got their start in the early 1970s making PA amps using
BPJ transitor output devices and only 'discovered' MOSFETs in the mid / late
80s



** The first Perreaux MOSFET amps were released in 1979, two internally fan cooled models the PMF2000 and PMF2000B were very successful using Hitachi lateral TO3 devices to full advantage. Later followed improved models with higher power, the PMF5000B, PMF6000B and PMF8000B plus the PMF9000C which supplied 500, 600, 800 900 wpc respectively.

There were also hi-fi models without noisy fans, the PMF2150, PMF3150 and PMF5150 - which was an absolute beast. I know cos I had to service a number of them, just lifting them on and off the bench was an event.

Manufacture came to a sudden halt in the late 1980s when Perreaux suffered a financial crisis and Hitachi announced they were discontinuing lateral TO3 MOSFETs. Since then, Perreaux has continued under new management making hi-fi amps only.

See internal pic of a PMF6000B.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...d=11796937 34


...... Phil

Why Bose?
 

lauantai 22. heinäkuuta 2017 4.49.22 UTC+3 ~misfit~ kirjoitti:


The band I worked with started with a mix of their own music and covers.
Their were five members, most multi-instrumentalists with their own
preference of music so their original material was some jazz-rock 'fusion'
with some blues thrown in. However over the years, due to the (pub and club)
crowds they mostly played to, the original material was first relegated
mostly to the opening set then dispensed with all together in favour of
covers. I've never since heard any band play Skynrd's Freebird (the live
version) complete with twin leads playing note for note, tone for tone
virtually identical to the original - or Steely Dan's 'The Royal Scam'
complete with note-perfect muted trumpet parts.



The band I worked with originally had four of the five guys take turns as
lead vocals for various songs as well as mics for alto and tennor sax,
trombone and trumpet going through an 8 channel on-stage mixer. Guitars,
bass and keyboards had their own amps and set their volumes per my
instructions. We started small with a couple Perreaux 'Blockbuster'
amplifiers (each with one each 180 & 70 watt channels - I still have one),
one per side powering a 'W bin' with an 18" driver, a 12" midrange and a
horn topped by an array of six piezo 'sizzlers'. 250w per side.

Latterly I ended up micing first the drums then the bass, guitars and
keyboard / synths (Fender Rhodes / Korg) amps through a (hired) 5kw a side
PA with a 24 channel off-stage mixing desk. The lighting system underwent a
similar upgrade over that time. We owned a bus that I had converted to 70:30
freight / passenger with double-doors on the back to fit the rather large
speaker systems (mostly JBL) and amplification (mostly Perreaux) in. No Bose
in sight, though there were a couple of large clubs that had secondary PA
systems for the back of the club and bar area that were Bose.

I also fully reconditioned the engine of the bus during a rare week off (A
Bedford 300 diesel) and did some singing during practices! It was a
wonderful, crazy time. :)
--

You have some good memories, and hopefully a few photos too:-)



I never had the chance to tour. Gigs were close to home and even though we played often till 3am, we drove home in the early hours.

Much later, in the 1980s after I had left the UK, I was recording a band called "The Tigers". It had been a three week project, and, as was customary, I was due two weeks paid leave after it. I mentioned this to one of the band who said "We are off to Gotenburg tomorrow for a ten day tour. Come with us. I did. It was brilliant.

They were well-organised, and had two roadies, one of whom mixed the gig. He was happy to hand this chore over to me. Some gigs were at dance halls, some in hotels, and others in village community centres. We were well fed, and there was no shortage of Absolut either.

Iain

Why Bose?
 

perjantai 21. heinäkuuta 2017 18.00.13 UTC+3 Dave Plowman (News) kirjoitti:
In article ,
Phil Allison wrote:
Don Pearce wrote:

-------------------------


Wood. You can buy some if you want



** The 802W ( wood & plastic ) is a rare, later version of the plastic 802.

As you damn well know.

You stinking pommy ****.


And Brexiteers say the way forward is a trade agreement with Oz. Only if
we can supply them with some decent meds.

Dave. Now is the time to stop digging, or you will soon be able to discuss this topic with both Trevor and Phil, face to face.

You didn't answer my question about the vocalist and quartet, which suggests that you are unaware that at such a gig, bass and guitar use their own combo amps. The drums often need no amplification at all, so what you heard was probably just a vocal via Bose. It is quite possible that an amp/EQ/speaker with a response curve like a dog's leg made the vocal sound quite good :-)

The other possibility is that you are simply trolling:-)

Best regards
Iain

Why Bose?
 

keskiviikko 19. heinäkuuta 2017 16.49.36 UTC+3 Jim Lesurf kirjoitti:
In article , Iain
Churches wrote:

Halcyon days!

Working at a recording studio, I didn't have much spare time,afer work,
overtime and study. But when I did, I played vibraphone in a MJQ-style
band called "Sophisticated Jazz" at hotel and night club gig, whenever
time permitted. I was a huge John Lewis/Milt Jackson fan at the time.


Alas my performing experiences weren't quite in that class..

http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history...PantoPlus.html :-)

Quite the opposite Jim. Pics at the link above show you to be in a class of your own. You would have been a hit in any Gilbert and SuLlivan production:-)

Iain

Why Bose?
 

keskiviikko 19. heinäkuuta 2017 19.03.25 UTC+3 James Perrett kirjoitti:
On Wed, 19 Jul 2017 11:49:37 +0100, Iain Churches wrote:

keskiviikko 19. heinäkuuta 2017 13.01.30 UTC+3 Dave Plowman (News)
kirjoitti:


(Dave enthuses about Bose)

At that point in time, unusually good for a PA system. And likely a
million times better than anything you ever heard then. As most were
pretty poor then.

Sorry Dave, but that simply is not true! The best places in the 70's,
Marquee, 100 Club, Mandrake, Raffles, Ronnie Scott's (the old address)
all had Crown driving JBL. A vastly superior combination, and still the
choice of many venues and concerts today.


While there may have been expensive JBL systems that sounded better than
Bose, the average JBL system that I heard was pretty disappointing.
However, I remember they had a booth at one of the hifi shows where they
demoed some of their PA gear at high volume which sounded impressive - too
bad none of their customers seemed to be able to make them sound that good.

At that time, JBL and Altec were used for both serious PA rigs and also studio monitoring. I have see plenty of Bose in home theatre applications
but never in a studio control room.

I would have to add that, of the venues you mention, I've only ever been
to the 100 Club and I don't remember being particularly impressed with the
sound (although I don't remember it being bad either).

Most clubs redecorated regularly, so sound systems were updated too.
The 100 Club was a difficult location for SR. But the jazz nights were particularly good. I played there a few times and was a member of the audience much more frequently. I always tried to sit centre, fairly close to the band.

One cannot expect the SR in such a location to match what one might expect to hear in a concert hall. But a club gig has a magic of its own:-)

Iain

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet Phil Allison wrote:
~misfit~ wrote:

-----------------



In case anyone's wondering about the Perreaux amplification I'm in
New Zealand. :) They got their start in the early 1970s making PA
amps using BPJ transitor output devices and only 'discovered'
MOSFETs in the mid / late 80s



** The first Perreaux MOSFET amps were released in 1979, two
internally fan cooled models the PMF2000 and PMF2000B were very
successful using Hitachi lateral TO3 devices to full advantage. Later
followed improved models with higher power, the PMF5000B, PMF6000B
and PMF8000B plus the PMF9000C which supplied 500, 600, 800 900 wpc
respectively.

Yep, my bad, it was a typo, I meant to say mid / late 70s. I'm pretty sure
that they made a few MOSFET PA amps for the domestic market before branching
into those domestic amps.

There were also hi-fi models without noisy fans, the PMF2150, PMF3150
and PMF5150 - which was an absolute beast. I know cos I had to
service a number of them, just lifting them on and off the bench was
an event.

I have an engineer mate who has a few of the Perreaux TO3 amps and he runs
then through JBLs. (something) 100 something (?) speakers, 3-way with 12"
woofer, about mid-thigh high, apparently classics. Must chase him up
actually, been out of touch a while (in person at least). He lives an hours
drive away and I have no other reason to go that way, hence long time no
see.

Manufacture came to a sudden halt in the late 1980s when Perreaux
suffered a financial crisis and Hitachi announced they were
discontinuing lateral TO3 MOSFETs. Since then, Perreaux has continued
under new management making hi-fi amps only.

They've also moved around NZ quite a lot. They started in Napier, went to
Christchurch and are now based in Auckland I think. I know Martin van Rooyen
is still with them as he emailed me from Perreaux last year. He's been with
them for a very long time.

See internal pic of a PMF6000B.

http://www.audioheritage.org/vbullet...d=11796937 34

I've got a bunch of internal pics of quite a few of those Hitachi TO3
lateral MOSFET Perreaux amps somewhere...

I see that they've sanitised their history section on their website so that
it doesn't cover much about their PA amps.
http://www.perreaux.com/about/perreaux-history
They used to have a page where they had pics from 1975, throwing one of
their Blockbuster PA amps off the roof of a single-story commercial unit in
Napier onto the concrete driveway, pics of the dented heatsinks then pics of
it powering up. It was a stunt to get bands and hire outfits to buy their
amplifiers, showing they couild take the knocks on the road. I guess as
they're chasing the big bucks audiophool market they don't want potential
buyers seeing that sort of thing these days. I wish I'd saved that page now,
I still have one of those Blockbusters (though not in working condition.)

Apparently throwing amps was something they stuck with for a while. I seem
to remember them putting stunts in NYC (IIRC) delivering hifi amplifiers by
throwing them (in their packaging) onto the sidewalk in front of the shops.
This was sometime in the late 80s I think. Their used to be an article about
it somewhere on the web, Perreaux 'demonstrating how tough their products
were' but I didn't bookmark it.

LOL, just searched and found mention of it in the January 1983 issue of
'Audio' magazine;
http://www.americanradiohistory.com/...io-1983-01.pdf
Page 69. It's an advert but a NZ magazine carried an article about it.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:
lauantai 22. heinäkuuta 2017 4.49.22 UTC+3 ~misfit~ kirjoitti:

The band I worked with started with a mix of their own music and
covers. Their were five members, most multi-instrumentalists with
their own preference of music so their original material was some
jazz-rock 'fusion' with some blues thrown in. However over the
years, due to the (pub and club) crowds they mostly played to, the
original material was first relegated mostly to the opening set then
dispensed with all together in favour of covers. I've never since
heard any band play Skynrd's Freebird (the live version) complete
with twin leads playing note for note, tone for tone virtually
identical to the original - or Steely Dan's 'The Royal Scam'
complete with note-perfect muted trumpet parts.

The band I worked with originally had four of the five guys take
turns as lead vocals for various songs as well as mics for alto and
tennor sax, trombone and trumpet going through an 8 channel on-stage
mixer. Guitars, bass and keyboards had their own amps and set their
volumes per my instructions. We started small with a couple Perreaux
'Blockbuster' amplifiers (each with one each 180 & 70 watt channels
- I still have one), one per side powering a 'W bin' with an 18"
driver, a 12" midrange and a horn topped by an array of six piezo
'sizzlers'. 250w per side.

Latterly I ended up micing first the drums then the bass, guitars and
keyboard / synths (Fender Rhodes / Korg) amps through a (hired) 5kw
a side PA with a 24 channel off-stage mixing desk. The lighting
system underwent a similar upgrade over that time. We owned a bus
that I had converted to 70:30 freight / passenger with double-doors
on the back to fit the rather large speaker systems (mostly JBL) and
amplification (mostly Perreaux) in. No Bose in sight, though there
were a couple of large clubs that had secondary PA systems for the
back of the club and bar area that were Bose.

I also fully reconditioned the engine of the bus during a rare week
off (A Bedford 300 diesel) and did some singing during practices! It
was a wonderful, crazy time. :)
--

You have some good memories, and hopefully a few photos too:-)

Alas photograpy was quite an expensive hobby back then (at least for people
in my socio-econimic group). Also one of the band members had a brother who
was an artist and photographer who would tour with us sometimes and take a
lot of pics. He always said any of us could get copies so I didn't bother -
then never did get copies. When the band split up it wasn't a pleasant vibe.
Too much time on the road when four of the five performers were married. By
the time they split up one was divorced and two were seperated. A shame as
they were going from strength to strength holding the record for numbers
through the door at just about every venue on the circuit.

Funny you should mention photos though. I've got a pet peeve, with most
people having a camera and video recording device on them at all times they
seem to spend most of their lives recording the moment instead of living in
it. Why go to a concert then spend the evening watching a tiny shaky screen
as you record it? And it seems 8 out or 10 people are doing this! I bet they
don't even watch half of what they record (unless they want to see what they
missed...).

I never had the chance to tour. Gigs were close to home and even
though we played often till 3am, we drove home in the early hours.

Depending on your relationship status you may have been better off. That
said us single guys (and a couple of the married ones) had some very
memorable experiences.

Much later, in the 1980s after I had left the UK, I was recording a
band called "The Tigers". It had been a three week project, and, as
was customary, I was due two weeks paid leave after it. I mentioned
this to one of the band who said "We are off to Gotenburg tomorrow
for a ten day tour. Come with us. I did. It was brilliant.

Awesome! That's a problem in New Zealand - the tyrrany of distance. You can
only get so big here and then most bands go to Australia as it's closest
(and cheapest). I often wonder how we would have gone if we'd had access to
a larger audience.

They were well-organised, and had two roadies, one of whom mixed the
gig. He was happy to hand this chore over to me. Some gigs were at
dance halls, some in hotels, and others in village community centres.
We were well fed, and there was no shortage of Absolut either.

Heh! Sounds great fun. We didn't have roadies as such, we all chipped in
which was great, I'd have hated to have been considered 'the roadie' (as I
was basically support staff). That said I always got equal pay to the other
guys as they said my job was just as important as theirs and they'd only
really started going places after I joined in - free at first, at local
gigs. I was originally friends with the drummer (who was married to Split
Enz keyboardists Eddie Rayner's sister). Back then NZ was so small.

It was a memorable few years that's for sure. :)

Cheers,
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:
keskiviikko 19. heinäkuuta 2017 16.49.36 UTC+3 Jim Lesurf kirjoitti:
In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:

Halcyon days!

Working at a recording studio, I didn't have much spare time,afer
work, overtime and study. But when I did, I played vibraphone in a
MJQ-style band called "Sophisticated Jazz" at hotel and night club
gig, whenever time permitted. I was a huge John Lewis/Milt Jackson
fan at the time.


Alas my performing experiences weren't quite in that class..

http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history...PantoPlus.html :-)

Quite the opposite Jim. Pics at the link above show you to be in a
class of your own. You would have been a hit in any Gilbert and
SuLlivan production:-)

Heh!

(Did I spy a Triumph Spitfire? "Pram"? I had one of those for a few years,
was lots of fun!)
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Why Bose?
 

lauantai 22. heinäkuuta 2017 16.06.24 UTC+3 ~misfit~ kirjoitti:
Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:

|| You have some good memories, and hopefully a few photos too:-)

Funny you should mention photos though. I've got a pet peeve, with most
people having a camera and video recording device on them at all times they
seem to spend most of their lives recording the moment instead of living in
it. Why go to a concert then spend the evening watching a tiny shaky screen
as you record it? And it seems 8 out or 10 people are doing this! I bet they
don't even watch half of what they record (unless they want to see what they
missed...).


Agreed. And times have changed. When I no longer needed the security of a staff job, I was able to pick and choose, and had a lot more spare time, so I was able to return to music as a player after many years on the other side of the control room window.

I took up the saxophone, and soon after that joined a big band:
http://www.mosabackabigband.com/data...29f0d98d24.jpg

We play 12 concerts a year, usually to capacity audiences. I enjoy it immensely:-) We have a pro photographer "on the staff". Most concert halls these days have a HD video camera system, so raw material on a DVD is a part of the deal. In addition, we have plenty of record industry know-how, within the band, production, recording, editing, mixing, graphic design, sleeve note writing, translation, copyright/law, sales etc, and so we can produce our own CDs, for internal use, for PR use (project samplers for promoters) and commercial CD's for sale at our concerts.


Depending on your relationship status you may have been better off. That
said us single guys (and a couple of the married ones) had some very
memorable experiences.

I was married to a record company:-)



Much later, in the 1980s after I had left the UK, I was recording a
band called "The Tigers". It had been a three week project, and, as
was customary, I was due two weeks paid leave after it. I mentioned
this to one of the band who said "We are off to Gotenburg tomorrow
for a ten day tour. Come with us. I did. It was brilliant.

Awesome! That's a problem in New Zealand - the tyrrany of distance. You can
only get so big here and then most bands go to Australia as it's closest
(and cheapest). I often wonder how we would have gone if we'd had access to
a larger audience.

Places like the UK have so many good bands, that I can see the advantage of
your band being a bigger fish in a smaller pond.

They were well-organised, and had two roadies, one of whom mixed the
gig. He was happy to hand this chore over to me. Some gigs were at
dance halls, some in hotels, and others in village community centres.
We were well fed, and there was no shortage of Absolut either.

Heh! Sounds great fun. We didn't have roadies as such, we all chipped in
which was great, I'd have hated to have been considered 'the roadie' (as I
was basically support staff). That said I always got equal pay to the other
guys as they said my job was just as important as theirs and they'd only
really started going places after I joined in - free at first, at local
gigs. I was originally friends with the drummer (who was married to Split
Enz keyboardists Eddie Rayner's sister). Back then NZ was so small.

I agree with you about the many roles within the band being of equal importance. But all too often, the lead singer (for example) might say to the others "without me the band would have no gigs, and you would not have a job. I have known many many roadies (including the Moody Blues, Marmalade, and Thin Lizzy, etc etc) I was amazed at the diverse of their skills, from instrument tuning/repairs, concert rigging, soundchecks, equipment/cable checks/repairs, truck and van maintenance, knowledge of the best/cheapest hotels, lodgings, pubs, restaurants, cafes etc. You name it, they did it. People generally think of roadies as long haired hangers-on with a bottle of beer in one had and a roll of gaffer tape in the other - this could not be farther from the truth!

Iain

Why Bose?
 

In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:
Alas my performing experiences weren't quite in that class..

http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history...PantoPlus.html :-)

Quite the opposite Jim. Pics at the link above show you to be in a class
of your own. You would have been a hit in any Gilbert and SuLlivan
production:-)

Ahem. "Class of your own" can have more than one meaning. :-)

However, undeterred, in the next day or so the photos of me in a grass
skirt and pair of coconut shells should be released. ;-

From a trip to Hawai'i in 1980. I couldn't work out which trip, so I've
assumed the first one. No doubt they'd heard of my success in QMC Pantos...

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

Why Bose?
 

In article , ~misfit~
wrote:
http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history...PantoPlus.html :-)


Heh!

(Did I spy a Triumph Spitfire? "Pram"? I had one of those for a few
years, was lots of fun!)

Yes. Damson was the name they gave the colour, but I only have the one
photo of it, in B&W.

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

Why Bose?
 

lauantai 22. heinäkuuta 2017 18.46.34 UTC+3 Jim Lesurf kirjoitti:
In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:
Alas my performing experiences weren't quite in that class..

http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history...PantoPlus.html :-)

Quite the opposite Jim. Pics at the link above show you to be in a class
of your own. You would have been a hit in any Gilbert and SuLlivan
production:-)

Ahem. "Class of your own" can have more than one meaning. :-)

A fact that had not escaped me:-)
"Beyond comparison" was an expression that Duke Ellington used.

Seeing your pictures brought Kenny Everett to mind (and "all in the best possible taste:-)

However, undeterred, in the next day or so the photos of me in a grass
skirt and pair of coconut shells should be released. ;-

Is the world ready for this? :-)

Iain

Why Bose?
 

lauantai 22. heinäkuuta 2017 16.06.24 UTC+3 ~misfit~ kirjoitti:
Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:
lauantai 22. heinäkuuta 2017 4.49.22 UTC+3 ~misfit~ kirjoitti:

We owned a bus
that I had converted to 70:30 freight / passenger with double-doors
on the back to fit the rather large speaker systems (mostly JBL) and
amplification (mostly Perreaux) in. No Bose in sight, though there
were a couple of large clubs that had secondary PA systems for the
back of the club and bar area that were Bose.

I also fully reconditioned the engine of the bus during a rare week
off (A Bedford 300 diesel) and did some singing during practices! It
was a wonderful, crazy time. :)
--

You were a useful fellow:-) Something about "....weight in gold" comes to mind.

Your post got me thinking again about my ten days "on the road" with The Tigers.

Their bus was a Scania, which in this part of the world was and still is highly regarded, even over Mercedes- They are incredibly reliable. Many Scanias have 1M km on the clock and are still going strong. The cargo area was centre, below the passenger seats, and accessible from either side.

The roadies, both of whom had licences to drive anything from a moped to a Scammell prime-mover took total charge gig to gig, and everyone, but everyone was expected to take part in loading and unloading (but not strip down or set up - that was a precise job for roadies only - everything checked first and then placed in the correct box). There were often extra hands at the gig willing to give a hand. The flight cases were loaded in reverse order, and so came off in the right order - instruments, amps, monitor wedges, PA, mic stands, cables, mics. The first case on, (and last off) contained a crate of beer. No case even those with mic stands and cables was too heavy for two people to lift.

These are many of the things I have tried to remember, in my own location recording gigs. I prefer twenty light-weight cases to ten heavy ones.

During the drive from gig to gig, people sat on their own, reading or dozing. I didn't have my own seat, so I sat at the front, next to the driver. He was a great fan of Iain Matthews, and everytime we found ourselves following a small car, he would sing sub-voce "There's a diesel on my tail, doing ninety miles an hour, my expression in the mirror's mighty pale........."

Iain

Why Bose?
 

~misfit~ wrote:

--------------------------


I have an engineer mate who has a few of the Perreaux TO3 amps and he runs
then through JBLs. (something) 100 something (?) speakers, 3-way with 12"
woofer, about mid-thigh high, apparently classics.


** That would be the L100 "Century" - based on the similar 4310 and 4311 studio monitors.





They've also moved around NZ quite a lot. They started in Napier, went to
Christchurch and are now based in Auckland I think. I know Martin van Rooyen
is still with them as he emailed me from Perreaux last year. He's been with
them for a very long time.



** AFAIK, Peter Perreaux was the founder and chief designer - no?

I'm pretty sure most of his factory's output went across the Tasman to Sydney for distribution round Australia.

I know Jands in Sydney were very ****ed off at the time because THEY could not return the favour with any of their models because of import restrictions in NZ. A 100% import duty, IIRC.


..... Phil

Why Bose?
 

Iain Churches wrote:

--------------------------


Dave. Now is the time to stop digging, or you will soon be able
to discuss this topic with both Trevor and Phil, face to face.

You didn't answer my question about the vocalist and quartet, which suggests that you are unaware that at such a gig, bass and guitar use their own combo amps. The drums often need no amplification at all, so what you heard was probably just a vocal via Bose. It is quite possible that an amp/EQ/speaker with a response curve like a dog's leg made the vocal sound quite good :-)

The other possibility is that you are simply trolling:-)


** When called on any of his mad opinions, Plowman instantly resorts to derision, fatuous comments, context shifting and plain trolling.

His absurd method of arriving at conclusions is just like the blind man who, on taking hold of an elephant's tail exclaimed:

" Ahhh, an elephant is just like a snake ! "



...... Phil

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , ~misfit~
wrote:
http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history...PantoPlus.html :-)


Heh!

(Did I spy a Triumph Spitfire? "Pram"? I had one of those for a few
years, was lots of fun!)

Yes. Damson was the name they gave the colour, but I only have the one
photo of it, in B&W.

Mine was red, a sort of ochre-red. don't know what Triumph called it. I
don't have a single photo unfortunately. Mine also had a removable hard-top
which was great for winter or when I knew I'd have to park in less secure
areas.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet Iain Churches wrote:
lauantai 22. heinäkuuta 2017 18.46.34 UTC+3 Jim Lesurf kirjoitti:
In article ,
Iain Churches wrote:
Alas my performing experiences weren't quite in that class..

http://jcgl.orpheusweb.co.uk/history...PantoPlus.html :-)

Quite the opposite Jim. Pics at the link above show you to be in a
class of your own. You would have been a hit in any Gilbert and
SuLlivan production:-)

Ahem. "Class of your own" can have more than one meaning. :-)

A fact that had not escaped me:-)
"Beyond comparison" was an expression that Duke Ellington used.

Seeing your pictures brought Kenny Everett to mind (and "all in the
best possible taste:-)


LOL, I thought Python and the two old ladies skits.

However, undeterred, in the next day or so the photos of me in a
grass skirt and pair of coconut shells should be released. ;-

Is the world ready for this? :-)

Publish and be damned! ;)
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)

Why Bose?
 

Once upon a time on usenet Phil Allison wrote:
~misfit~ wrote:

--------------------------


I have an engineer mate who has a few of the Perreaux TO3 amps and
he runs then through JBLs. (something) 100 something (?) speakers,
3-way with 12" woofer, about mid-thigh high, apparently classics.


** That would be the L100 "Century" - based on the similar 4310 and
4311 studio monitors.


That's the one. He has a couple of pairs of those. Actually three IIRC, one
in need of new tweeters.

They've also moved around NZ quite a lot. They started in Napier,
went to Christchurch and are now based in Auckland I think. I know
Martin van Rooyen is still with them as he emailed me from Perreaux
last year. He's been with them for a very long time.

** AFAIK, Peter Perreaux was the founder and chief designer - no?

Yes. However I think it was Martin van Rooyen who had the business /
marketing nous. I'm not sure if he's been there from day one but he's
certainly been with the company for a while.

I just did a quick Google and found a few cryptic references like this one
"Peter Perreaux was a genius but followed Cat Stevens and lost the plot - or
found himself." but can't seem to find definitive info on the period when
the company hit a lull, before Martin took over.

Martin van Rooyen bought the company in 1999. There's not a lot of info I
can find but I have the feeling he had been with the company for quite a
while before that. Also I was wrong with my previous statement that I
thought the company went Napier - Christchurch - Auckland. Seems it went
Napier - Auckland - then to Dunedin in 2005.

I knew the early stuff was made in Napier as not only is it printed on my
old amp (and the gear I used with the band) but Napier was a favourite stop
for the band and we also called in at the Perreaux 'factory' a couple times
while we were there. When I say 'factory' it was just a small leased
commercial building with, IIRC, a panelbeater next door.

Also while searching I found the original video about the amp throwing that
I saw back in 1983 on a news / 'magazine' type show on TV;
https://youtu.be/e5Xb89BGOl4
They'd expanded a bit by then from when I visited a few years earlier. I'm
not even sure it's the same premises.

I'm pretty sure most of his factory's output went across the Tasman
to Sydney for distribution round Australia.

It could well have - though some found its way to the US, Europe and the UK
too. Also there's quite a bit of it surfacing second-hand in NZ these days.

I know Jands in Sydney were very ****ed off at the time because THEY
could not return the favour with any of their models because of
import restrictions in NZ. A 100% import duty, IIRC.

It was very high. I remember buying a Nakamichi casette deck duty free and
the savings over buying local almost paid for the ticket price. Watches were
the same, I'm still wearing a watch that I bought duty free back in the
1980s after a trip to Melbourne.
--
Shaun.

"Humans will have advanced a long, long way when religious belief has a cozy
little classification in the DSM*."
David Melville (in r.a.s.f1)
(*Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders)