In article ,
Adrian Caspersz wrote:
On 20/11/17 00:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

It's actually quite rare to have a totally electronic recording. Most
have vocals. Many real drums, guitars, and so on. All of which picked
up by microphones in exactly the same way as a classical piece.


Actually, not that rare. EDM.

Of course purely electronic instrumentals exist. But only as a very small
proportion of all recordings.

--
*Hard work pays off in the future. Laziness pays off now *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 21/11/17 10:54, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Adrian Caspersz wrote:
On 20/11/17 00:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

It's actually quite rare to have a totally electronic recording. Most
have vocals. Many real drums, guitars, and so on. All of which picked
up by microphones in exactly the same way as a classical piece.


Actually, not that rare. EDM.

Of course purely electronic instrumentals exist. But only as a very small
proportion of all recordings.


Made since the year dot, yes

--
Adrian C

In article , Adrian Caspersz
wrote:
On 20/11/17 00:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

It's actually quite rare to have a totally electronic recording.
Most have vocals. Many real drums, guitars, and so on. All of which picked
up by microphones in exactly the same way as a classical piece.


Actually, not that rare. EDM.

Even more so when you add in aggressive 'autotune', etc, on what might
otherwise be human voices. 8-]

Jim

--
Please use the address on the audiomisc page if you wish to email me.
Electronics https://www.st-andrews.ac.uk/~www_pa...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes:

In article ,
Jim Lesurf wrote:
However for some other types of recording, there will be no acoustic
'original' beyond what someone sitting at a mixing desk created as they
operated the controls to get a result they think will 'sell', or have
impact or please their target audience. Using a setup you would never get
to hear and which is unlike home hi-fi systems. In those cases you can't
access such a reference so just have to decide if you like the result or
not.

It's actually quite rare to have a totally electronic recording.
Most have vocals. Many real drums, guitars, and so on. All of which picked
up by microphones in exactly the same way as a classical piece.

And then it would be very rare to have an unprocessed acoustic
'original'. The recording session I did on Saturday involved my bass
going direct to the desk (no acoustic original) and, while the drums
were acoustic and recorded acoustically, I would suggest that it is
unlikley that any member of an audience would actually choose to
listen with their ear inside the bass drum, or next to either the top
or bottom skin of the snare, etc. You won't necessarily have electric
guitars miced up nowadays, and any instrument could be recorded dry
with the intention of putting effects on in the later production
stages. After all, if you have an effect in the instrument-amp or
instrument-desk chain, you're stuck with it, whereas if you record
dry, you can put on whatever you like (and that might well include amp
and cab sims). Hence, though I use chorus live on the bass (well, the
fretless and fretted 5s, if I ever use the 10-string live it won't be
with a chorus), I recorded it dry with the tone controls set flat.

--
Mike Fleming

In article ,
Graeme wrote:
In message , Mike Fleming
writes

The producer of a studio creation will be trying to create the sound
he feels is ideal, so it's only polite to try to reproduce that sound
accurately.

Not sure how well I can express myself here. I think two different
experiences are being discussed. Listening to 'classical' musical, it
is the sound engineer is trying to capture that live sound, to be
reproduced at home via CD.

With 'popular' (including pop/rock/country/whatever) music is not the
opposite true? Whether we are discussing a recording made last week or
the Crystals in 1963, it is the live artist trying to reproduce the
sound record buyers hear on the LP/CD.

In other words, the 'real' sound with classical is what we hear live.
With pop, the 'real' sound is decided by the engineer.

It is in both cases.

If you were to do a rule of thumb for a classical recording with no chance
to experiment or rehearse in the venue, you'd simply sling a stereo pair
above the conductor. Since he is the one who 'engineers' the balance of
the orchestra. But that's not a place any member of the audience can hear
the work from.

--
*Consciousness: That annoying time between naps.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes:

If you were to do a rule of thumb for a classical recording with no chance
to experiment or rehearse in the venue, you'd simply sling a stereo pair
above the conductor. Since he is the one who 'engineers' the balance of
the orchestra. But that's not a place any member of the audience can hear
the work from.

"People make an awful lot of fuss, anyway, about the quality of the
sound they listen to. Have you noticed; they spend all that time
trying to get the exact effect of an orchestra actually playing in
their sitting room. Personally, I can't think of anything I should
hate more than an orchestra actually playing in my sitting room."

--
Mike Fleming

On Mon, 20 Nov 2017 19:15:11 +0000, Mike Fleming
wrote:

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes:

If you were to do a rule of thumb for a classical recording with no chance
to experiment or rehearse in the venue, you'd simply sling a stereo pair
above the conductor. Since he is the one who 'engineers' the balance of
the orchestra. But that's not a place any member of the audience can hear
the work from.

"People make an awful lot of fuss, anyway, about the quality of the
sound they listen to. Have you noticed; they spend all that time
trying to get the exact effect of an orchestra actually playing in
their sitting room. Personally, I can't think of anything I should
hate more than an orchestra actually playing in my sitting room."

You have this backwards. The only way to have the orchestra playing in
your sitting room is with an anechoic recording - nasty sounding
things. What they are trying to do is expand the walls of the sitting
room to match the concert hall by reproducing the acoustics of the
hall. Some of the Dolby D coverage from the RHA was not half bad at
that.

d

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On 20/11/2017 20:52, Don Pearce wrote:
On Mon, 20 Nov 2017 19:15:11 +0000, Mike Fleming
wrote:

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes:

If you were to do a rule of thumb for a classical recording with no chance
to experiment or rehearse in the venue, you'd simply sling a stereo pair
above the conductor. Since he is the one who 'engineers' the balance of
the orchestra. But that's not a place any member of the audience can hear
the work from.

"People make an awful lot of fuss, anyway, about the quality of the
sound they listen to. Have you noticed; they spend all that time
trying to get the exact effect of an orchestra actually playing in
their sitting room. Personally, I can't think of anything I should
hate more than an orchestra actually playing in my sitting room."

You have this backwards. The only way to have the orchestra playing in
your sitting room is with an anechoic recording - nasty sounding
things. What they are trying to do is expand the walls of the sitting
room to match the concert hall by reproducing the acoustics of the
hall. Some of the Dolby D coverage from the RHA was not half bad at
that.


Woosh!


--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

In article ,
(Don Pearce) writes:

On Mon, 20 Nov 2017 19:15:11 +0000, Mike Fleming
wrote:

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes:

If you were to do a rule of thumb for a classical recording with no chance
to experiment or rehearse in the venue, you'd simply sling a stereo pair
above the conductor. Since he is the one who 'engineers' the balance of
the orchestra. But that's not a place any member of the audience can hear
the work from.

"People make an awful lot of fuss, anyway, about the quality of the
sound they listen to. Have you noticed; they spend all that time
trying to get the exact effect of an orchestra actually playing in
their sitting room. Personally, I can't think of anything I should
hate more than an orchestra actually playing in my sitting room."

You have this backwards. The only way to have the orchestra playing in
your sitting room is with an anechoic recording - nasty sounding
things. What they are trying to do is expand the walls of the sitting
room to match the concert hall by reproducing the acoustics of the
hall. Some of the Dolby D coverage from the RHA was not half bad at
that.

Perhaps I should include this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_DptPvj7ts

And I don't think my sitting room is big enough for an orchestra to
play in it. Expanding the walls to match the concert hall would run
into issues with planning permission, and next door's side wall.

--
Mike Fleming

On Mon, 20 Nov 2017 22:36:57 +0000, Mike Fleming
wrote:

In article ,
(Don Pearce) writes:

On Mon, 20 Nov 2017 19:15:11 +0000, Mike Fleming
wrote:

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes:

If you were to do a rule of thumb for a classical recording with no chance
to experiment or rehearse in the venue, you'd simply sling a stereo pair
above the conductor. Since he is the one who 'engineers' the balance of
the orchestra. But that's not a place any member of the audience can hear
the work from.

"People make an awful lot of fuss, anyway, about the quality of the
sound they listen to. Have you noticed; they spend all that time
trying to get the exact effect of an orchestra actually playing in
their sitting room. Personally, I can't think of anything I should
hate more than an orchestra actually playing in my sitting room."

You have this backwards. The only way to have the orchestra playing in
your sitting room is with an anechoic recording - nasty sounding
things. What they are trying to do is expand the walls of the sitting
room to match the concert hall by reproducing the acoustics of the
hall. Some of the Dolby D coverage from the RHA was not half bad at
that.

Perhaps I should include this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_DptPvj7ts

And I don't think my sitting room is big enough for an orchestra to
play in it. Expanding the walls to match the concert hall would run
into issues with planning permission, and next door's side wall.

Inflatable houses are the answer.

d

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