On Fri, 4 Jul 2003 14:19:53 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote:

"Julian Fowler" wrote
snip

Can't comment ... whilst not being a vinylphile (I do listen to vinyl,
albeit only where the music concerned is not readily available in
digital form, or I've not yet got round to purchasing it on CD) I'm
not a vinylphobe either. The "irritation" (which, to be honest, is
only minor as far as I'm concerned) is when over-zealous vinylphiles
jump from statements of preference to statements of technical
superiority.


Again, I can only state I'm not aware of many (if any) such statements.

Sometimes I wonder whether we're reading different newsgroups :-)

I noticed that you snipped my comment about vinyl enthusiasts' denial
of the degradation involved in the mastering-for-vinyl process -- are
these also statements that you're unaware of?

I
think what it is the 'vinylphobes/digiphiles' take enthusiastic remarks
about 'lifelike' 'engaging' and 'presence' (or whatever) and translate them
into 'accuracy' 'dynamic range' etc.

Maybe you could explain to the unlightened how a recording can be
"lifelike" without being accurate.

Fine, except that have you really ever seen/heard a Moggie owner

yes (usually in form claims that Moggies are "environmentally
friendly")


Which, if caring ownership of a well-tuned Moggie for, say, 30 years, means
that a square mile (or two) of rainforest hasn't been chopped down to
provide the 15 or so '2 year replacements' in that time, is a perfectly
reasonable claim, IME.

Somehow, I'm not surprised that you'd say that ;-) How about
considerations like the % of recycleable parts in the Moggie, its
exhaust emissions, the long-term environmental damage caused by the
factory it was built in, ... Its no coincidence that countries that
have well-founded environmental policies give people substantial
subsidies to dispose of Moggies and their equivalents ...

snip

... um, since when did white bread have anything to do with accuracy
of audio reproduction?


At about the same time as the mention of the Morris Minor.......

The comparison between dominant technologies of the mid-20th century
(Morris Minor, vinyl records) and those of the early 21st century
(BMW, CD) seems valid to me.


Maybe the key difference *is* that vinylphiles
have a preference for a certain sound (and the common claims in favour
of valve amplifiers in conjunction with vinyl suggest that "certain
sound" to be an inaccurate, coloured one), whereas those with a
preference for CD are seeking the best possible reproduction of music
as intended by the artists, engineers, and producers responsible for
it. If your interest is with accuracy then specifications are
important - if your interest is in a sound you like (without much
attention to the relationship between what you are hearing and what
was recorded) then I agree that specs and measurements are irrelevant
to you.


Your mention of valves raises a very good point. It is my contention that
'valves & vinyl' go together like cheese and pickle and combine to create an
utterly sublime sound. ('Accurate', 'distorted', 'coloured' or not - I
really couldn't give a sh*t, I simply never tire of it!) I often wonder if
vinyl would have quite so many detractors here if they had had the chance to
hear the 'full monty'.....

I have ... and I'll admit that a high-end vinyl/valve system can sound
very good. On the other hand, any competent CD based system sounds at
least as good, if not better (to me).

Julian


--
Julian Fowler
julian (at) bellevue-barn (dot) org (dot) uk