Keith G wrote:

"tony sayer" wrote



Or are you or would you be happy with the same standard of living as a
typical Chinese family?, and it isn't that good, according to a Chinese
person I know....



Back in the fifties everybody was broke and living standards were poor by
today's and this country was a damn sight better place than it is now or
will *ever* be again. For example, the best music, the best audio kit, the
best artists, musicians and performers have all been and gone.

well, Quad's ESL57s are still highly regarded today.

Radiohead are still alive and kicking ...


Don't believe me? Have a little think about it and come back and shoot me
down. Name one area where things are really *better* today!

SS amps? Digital sources?

In article , Keith G
writes

"tony sayer" wrote

You
may be concerned at a loss of jobs in the UK.


Nope.

Well Keith, perhaps you should be?. Are you retired?,


Yep.


and if you are and
you rely on a pension, or perhaps you made squillions and have salted
that away,


Jeez, you bin here - do I look like I've got 'squillions' salted away???

Well there are a lot of poor old hard up grain barons out in east Anglia
who could be mistaken for pikeys, but are absolutely loaded!...


your pension is going to be funded by the present British
workforce, so perhaps you should be a shade more concerned.


Nah, my pension is a pittance - I *earn* the 'pocket money' I get. I'm not
relying on the IT pussies/call centre creeps for my existence - I've paid
MILLIONS out in salaries, I've had a grand a week 'spending money' coming
in, in the past, and spent it all and I couldn't give a **** about money.
The less I've had, the more fun I have. Life's a **** sight too short to
worry about money, believe you me!!

If you so reckon....


Or are you or would you be happy with the same standard of living as a
typical Chinese family?, and it isn't that good, according to a Chinese
person I know....


Back in the fifties everybody was broke and living standards were poor by
today's and this country was a damn sight better place than it is now or
will *ever* be again. For example, the best music, the best audio kit, the
best artists, musicians and performers have all been and gone.

Ah!, there speaks a man over a certain age;(

Don't believe me? Have a little think about it and come back and shoot me
down. Name one area where things are really *better* today!

(Start with 'broadcasting' if you like..... ;-)




Have a larff.......

A college student challenged a senior citizen, saying it was impossible
for the younger generation to understand the older. "You grew up in a
different world," the student said.

"Today we have television, jet planes, space travel, nuclear energy,
mobile phones, computers..."

Taking advantage of a pause in the student's litany, the old geezer
replied, "You're right. We didn't have those things when we were young,
so we invented them! What are you doing for the next generation??"

--
Tony Sayer

In message , Keith G
writes


Jeez, you bin here - do I look like I've got 'squillions' salted away???


You were MD of a multi-million pound company and you don't have lots of
money. Why, were you incompetent or something?

:-) of course........
--
Chris Morriss

In article ,
JustMe writes
I believe the following speaker 'names' are now *owned* by the Chinese:

Wharfedale
Quad
Rogers
KEF
Celestion

Is this correct?

Also, I know they certainly manufacture various or all of the models in
the
various ranges, but does anybody know if they are actually designed in
China
now?

Also, does anyone know of any other 'names' (speakers or other equipment)
now in the hands of the Chinese? (Not just manufactured there - that's
almost everybody now, from what I can see....)

I believe that IAG (International Audio Group) own Wharfedale & Quad
together. They also now own Tag and all that comes with that. The owners are
Chinese, the products are manufactured in China (excluding the Quads
Electrostatics which, I believe, are still built in the UK) but all the
design is carried out in the UK.

Kef and Celestion are under one roof (and have been for a few years) but I
don't know in whose hands they lie.

Don't know about Rogers.

Is this a crisis?

Politically you may despair for the oppressed people of China and may
consider that they are being used as a cheap labour force by the West. You
may be concerned at a loss of jobs in the UK.

But, in absolute hifi terms, I believe that the latest speakers from
Wharfedale and Quad (looking at the Quad "L" and the Wharfedale "Evolution"
ranges) are outstanding value for money, are beautifully built and finished
with incredible attention to detail, sound superb and outstrip the
competition at the price.

Of course that's just my subjective opinion, but they would cost a lot more
to buy if manufactured in the UK and I don't believe that the QC would be
any better.


Which begs the question when the Chinese take over the design too, what
are we going to be doing?.....


--
Tony Sayer

tony sayer wrote:

Which begs the question when the Chinese take over the design too, what
are we going to be doing?.....

It does indeed.

I happen to be involved in designing pro-audio gear that's manufactured in China.
No choice now about the economics of having to do so.

To date at least, Chinese 'designs' tend to be poor rip-offs / 'copies' of
existing products. This can't be assumed to continue for ever though.

What with outsourcing this and that, does indeed make you wonder what we'll all
be doing one day !


Graham

"Pooh Bear" wrote in message
...


tony sayer wrote:

Which begs the question when the Chinese take over the design too, what
are we going to be doing?.....

It does indeed.

I happen to be involved in designing pro-audio gear that's manufactured in
China.
No choice now about the economics of having to do so.

To date at least, Chinese 'designs' tend to be poor rip-offs / 'copies' of
existing products. This can't be assumed to continue for ever though.


Hmm, I'm not sure I agree with that. If you go to http://www.cattylink.com/
and find the Products page (and wait for it to load) you will find a huge
number of products that resemble *nothing* like anything we know over here
and that's only one of many such sites....

Keith G wrote:

"Pooh Bear" wrote in message
...


tony sayer wrote:

Which begs the question when the Chinese take over the design too, what
are we going to be doing?.....

It does indeed.

I happen to be involved in designing pro-audio gear that's manufactured in
China.
No choice now about the economics of having to do so.

To date at least, Chinese 'designs' tend to be poor rip-offs / 'copies' of
existing products. This can't be assumed to continue for ever though.

Hmm, I'm not sure I agree with that. If you go to http://www.cattylink.com/
and find the Products page (and wait for it to load) you will find a huge
number of products that resemble *nothing* like anything we know over here
and that's only one of many such sites....

I'm sure that there are some good examples of Chinese design

I've seen plenty of poor ones too.

Remember, I work with these guys. One company was recently perfectly honest and
admitted they just don't have the design experience that exists in the West.

They tend to be good at manufacturing though.

Graham

JustMe wrote:


I believe that IAG (International Audio Group) own Wharfedale & Quad
together. They also now own Tag and all that comes with that.

and Tag McLaren audio was previously Audiolab, based in Huntingdon.

The owners are
Chinese, the products are manufactured in China (excluding the Quads
Electrostatics which, I believe, are still built in the UK) but all the
design is carried out in the UK.


I believe the new L range of speakers was designed in China.

Kef and Celestion are under one roof (and have been for a few years) but I
don't know in whose hands they lie.

Don't know about Rogers.


Rogers is owned by the Wo Kee Hong group which is based in Hong Kong. I
believe they bought the Rogers brand around 1997.

Keith G wrote:

: I believe the following speaker 'names' are now *owned* by the Chinese:

What's the big deal? Many businesses businesses, names and all, in many
countries are owed by foreigners.

"RPS" wrote in message
...
Keith G wrote:

: I believe the following speaker 'names' are now *owned* by the Chinese:

What's the big deal? Many businesses businesses, names and all, in many
countries are owed by foreigners.


No big deal, I've just got a Chinese valve amp and I'm delighted with it (as
I am with a pair of Wharfedale Diamond 8.2s) and I'm waiting patiently (very
patiently - more anon) for another one.

I'm interested to find out if they are still being designed by 'British'
designers. I suspect not.....