This is getting silly
 

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...95496 37&rd=1

--
Nick

"Life has surface noise" - John Peel 1939-2004

This is getting silly
 

Looks very nice. I don't see how two EL84 in triode will give you 10w per
channel, but the basic elements are there, including a choke which must be
about 3H by the look of it. A bit of space inside for upgrading componants.
Very tempting, in fact. Anybody heard one?

=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

This is getting silly
 

"Andy Evans" wrote in message
...
Looks very nice. I don't see how two EL84 in triode will give you 10w per
channel, but the basic elements are there, including a choke which must be
about 3H by the look of it. A bit of space inside for upgrading
componants.
Very tempting, in fact. Anybody heard one?

=== Andy Evans ===

This kind of product is a two-edged sword.
* It attracts people to valve audio - which is a good thing.
* The budget to which it is built, means that it cannot show
what a good valve amp can really do - which is not such
a good thing.

And 4mV of hum?

That's pretty poor.
By shirtcuff calculation, I make that only -67dB ref 10W

Iain

This is getting silly
 

In article ,
Iain M Churches wrote:
This kind of product is a two-edged sword.
* It attracts people to valve audio - which is a good thing.

Why? Surely the performance of an amp is the important thing, not how it
achieves it?

* The budget to which it is built, means that it cannot show
what a good valve amp can really do - which is not such
a good thing.

By the same brush it is. Might put some off looking for 'magic' that
doesn't exist.

--
*A journey of a thousand sites begins with a single click *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

This is getting silly
 

* The budget to which it is built, means that it cannot show what a good valve
amp can really do - which is not such a good thing.

Of course valve amps can be built which are universes better than this, but we
may be jumping the gun here - it has decent valves and even a choke (unusual)
so it looks as if the designer put a modicum of thought into it. It may not
sound too different from something like a Leak Stereo 20 - probably clearer but
with less warmth and depth. I imagine the OPTs are a good deal smaller, but
that should give clear midrange if they are well designed. I'd like to hear
one. I don't think price is so much of an issue these days - the Chinese
clearly can design well, viz. the new raft of valves they're producing like the
845B, and it looks as if they can both design well and price cheap. They are
also tayloring their products more to the USA boutique market - 6SN7 preamps
where previously it would have been ECC83s or the like. I think this amp uses
5670 in the input which is a Chinese 6N3 - not a great valve, but easy to sub a
nice NOS 5670, which isn't shabby. The GE 5670 is reputedle pretty good, and
currently dirt cheap. WE396A is reputedly nice, Raytheon Black plate 2C51,
early 1950s, incredibly smooth, and some 1960s JAN 5670s not bad


=== Andy Evans ===
Visit our Website:- http://www.artsandmedia.com
Audio, music and health pages and interesting links.

This is getting silly
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Iain M Churches wrote:
This kind of product is a two-edged sword.
* It attracts people to valve audio - which is a good thing.

Why? Surely the performance of an amp is the important thing, not how it
achieves it?

True. But there are many people who do not even know there is
an alternative to SS. Perhaps hearing even an entry-level
budget valve amp might kindle interest enought to pursue
the matter further.

By the same brush it is. Might put some off looking for 'magic' that
doesn't exist.

I have yet to meet anyone who is not favourably impressed with
they hear a good 'un:-)) A local dealer gives me -35% off my own
purchases, as the result of referrring so many valve amp and turntable
customers to him. He sets them up a system at home, to suit the room
and the budget, on 30 days approval. They usually want to trade in
the SS amp at the end of that time.

Iain

This is getting silly
 

"Nick Gorham" wrote in message
...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...95496 37&rd=1


**"Obviously, the amp can be pushed beyond it's limits but it overloads so
smoothly that the effect is more like compression than clipping and yet it
doesn't lose dynamics."

Who was the copy editor for this ad?

4mV (RMS) hum?! Yikes! With 11 Watts output, you need efficient speakers.
With efficient speakers (Hell, with low efficiency speakers, you can hear
the hum), you can hear the hum. Catch 22 anyone?


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

This is getting silly
 

In article ,
Iain M Churches wrote:
I have yet to meet anyone who is not favourably impressed with
they hear a good 'un:-)) A local dealer gives me -35% off my own
purchases,

So you're still looking for the holy grail despite having apparently found
it with your amp?

as the result of referrring so many valve amp and turntable
customers to him. He sets them up a system at home, to suit the room
and the budget, on 30 days approval. They usually want to trade in
the SS amp at the end of that time.

Well, yes. Some people just want change for the sake of it - or to be in
'fashion'.

Wish I had a quid for everyone I know who replaced a decent sounding older
components system for the latest micro or whatever one, and either can't
hear or don't care just how much worse it sounds...

--
*You can't teach an old mouse new clicks *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

This is getting silly
 

In article ,
Trevor Wilson wrote:
4mV (RMS) hum?! Yikes! With 11 Watts output, you need efficient
speakers. With efficient speakers (Hell, with low efficiency speakers,
you can hear the hum), you can hear the hum. Catch 22 anyone?

The hum probably gives it the impressive bass response...

--
*Monday is an awful way to spend 1/7th of your life *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

This is getting silly
 

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
...

"Nick Gorham" wrote in message
...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...95496 37&rd=1


**"Obviously, the amp can be pushed beyond it's limits but it overloads so
smoothly that the effect is more like compression than clipping and yet it
doesn't lose dynamics."

Who was the copy editor for this ad?

Just sales hype. Caveat emptor!
If it really is triode connected then it must be clipping long
before 10W.

Triode connected, a pair of EL84's with zero NFB give
5.2W at 2.5THD

4mV (RMS) hum?! Yikes! With 11 Watts output, you need efficient speakers.
With efficient speakers (Hell, with low efficiency speakers, you can hear
the hum), you can hear the hum. Catch 22 anyone?

Yes. That would certainly put me off!
There is absolutely no reason why a valve amp should not be silent
when idling. One should reallly check this from the listening position.
I cannot resist the temptation to put an ear to the speaker grille.

And have you noticed how the Chinese always go for potted
transformers, or sometimes, as in this case one full width pot:-)
I suspect this is to conceal Oxo cube sized transformers
which they use:-)

Just two nights ago, I tried out a 10W EL84 PP amp, a home-brew
built for a magazine competition. It could drive my Tannoy Lancasters
to a very satisfactory level, in a listening area of some 50 square metres.
The noise floor was, in contrast to the Chinky,
only 300µV wideband, an improvement of 22dB

But then the cost of the parts alone were four times the retail price
of the Chinky. You pays yer money.......


Iain