Uncopyrightable wrote:

Any recommendations on the wire? site links for reputable suppliers.

Chord Company Rumour 4 - a 4-core bi-wire cable at £20/metre. I use this
stuff myself for all 3 front speakers, Arcam AVR-250 and Mordaunt-Short
Avant 908/905C speakers. It's bloody brilliant.

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation

Andy Hewitt wrote:

I'm just finding it hard to comprehend the nature of the responses in
this newsgroup now. Obviously Phil is an Aussie, so I can understand
that, but otherwise I'm the only person to have written anything
without insult (until now), and in fact have at least provided a
source of my comments.

You asked a question about speaker cables. In this group it's like a red
rag to a bull.

Now who do I listen to? A few prominent UK publications, or some
geezers off the newsgroup that just insult me for regurgitating the
information.

My money would be on the prominent UK publications. What Hi-Fi is
reasonably unbiased - obviously reviewers have their particular
favourites but they do try to be objective. Hell, they even reckoned (if
I recall correctly) in the latest issue that Arcam's DV-79 does a better
job at playing CDs than the more expensive DV-137.

Which was actually quite a relief as I have a DV-79...

This used to be a group that you could ask for advice, or have a
*discussion* about the merits of some of the controversial stuff.
Unless I've been naive and missed the fact that it's just occupied by
trolls!

It used to be, a few years back. Sadly since I've come back in here it's
been taken over by a clique of high and mighty types that look down and
deride anyone who wants to discuss whether to have the 305-strand OFC
cable or the thinner but better sounding pure silver cable etc etc.

For the record: Arcam DV-79/AVR-250, Chord Cobra III interconnects,
Rumour 4 speaker cable. This should give a hint as to where I stand on
the subject.

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation

Glenn Richards wrote:

Andy Hewitt wrote:

I'm just finding it hard to comprehend the nature of the responses in
this newsgroup now. Obviously Phil is an Aussie, so I can understand
that, but otherwise I'm the only person to have written anything
without insult (until now), and in fact have at least provided a
source of my comments.

You asked a question about speaker cables. In this group it's like a red
rag to a bull.

Actually, I didn't ask any questions!

Now who do I listen to? A few prominent UK publications, or some
geezers off the newsgroup that just insult me for regurgitating the
information.

My money would be on the prominent UK publications. What Hi-Fi is
reasonably unbiased - obviously reviewers have their particular
favourites but they do try to be objective. Hell, they even reckoned (if
I recall correctly) in the latest issue that Arcam's DV-79 does a better
job at playing CDs than the more expensive DV-137.

If you read on, I think you're on a loser there ;-)

Which was actually quite a relief as I have a DV-79...

This used to be a group that you could ask for advice, or have a
*discussion* about the merits of some of the controversial stuff.
Unless I've been naive and missed the fact that it's just occupied by
trolls!

It used to be, a few years back. Sadly since I've come back in here it's
been taken over by a clique of high and mighty types that look down and
deride anyone who wants to discuss whether to have the 305-strand OFC
cable or the thinner but better sounding pure silver cable etc etc.

Yes, it appears that way to me too.

For the record: Arcam DV-79/AVR-250, Chord Cobra III interconnects,
Rumour 4 speaker cable. This should give a hint as to where I stand on
the subject.

Fairy enough. Personally I use ProPower speaker cable from CPC, and some
nice thick interconnects I got off eBay.

--
Andy Hewitt
http://www.thehewitts.eclipse.co.uk/
http://web.mac.com/andrewhewitt1/

Glenn Richards wrote:

Uncopyrightable wrote:

Any recommendations on the wire? site links for reputable suppliers.

Chord Company Rumour 4 - a 4-core bi-wire cable at £20/metre. I use this
stuff myself for all 3 front speakers, Arcam AVR-250 and Mordaunt-Short
Avant 908/905C speakers. It's bloody brilliant.

Do tell what's *brilliant* about it.


Graham

Glenn Richards wrote:

It used to be, a few years back. Sadly since I've come back in here it's
been taken over by a clique of high and mighty types that look down and
deride anyone who wants to discuss whether to have the 305-strand OFC
cable or the thinner but better sounding pure silver cable etc etc.

Another gullible fool.

I really ought to find a way to make money out of this.

Graham

"Glenn Richards" wrote in message
...
Andy Hewitt wrote:


My money would be on the prominent UK publications. What Hi-Fi is
reasonably unbiased - obviously reviewers have their particular favourites
but they do try to be objective.
it's been taken over by a clique of high and mighty types that look down
and deride anyone who wants to discuss whether to have the 305-strand OFC
cable or the thinner but better sounding pure silver cable etc etc.

Hi Glen,
would you be prepared to undergo blind testing on your own
equipment, with the speaker cables being switched around and you
trying to identify whether the cable being used is your own or a
replacement of unknown origin?

Do we have anyone in Glen's area prepared to take the time to
get involved?

I have been through the issues of speaker wire in years gone past
and these days I don't waste my time. I have tried bi-wiring and
wouldn't waste my time again. Friends went throught the same
stage, with, initially some of them claiming sonic benefits, however,
simply connecting one speaker using the "better" wire and the other
using "cheap but adequate" wire, placing the speakers side by
side and putting your amp on mono and switching from one
speaker to the other displays no discernable difference. If there
is a discernable difference then swap the wires around and redo
the test to confirm that you don't have variance in the speakers
or amp.

I think if this simple comparison were undertaken the wire sellers
would suddenly be not selling very high dollar wire. The same
applies to interconnects, however, it can be a little more difficult
to undertake the same type of testing but certainly not impossible.

Adequate quality and fit for application is what is required, not dollars.

"Eeyore" wrote in
message ...

Do tell what's *brilliant* about it.

The profit margin ;-)

You were correct in you previous post, a person should be in on the sales of
this stuff.

Glen, do you have shares in Chord Company by any chance?

APR wrote:

Hi Glen,
would you be prepared to undergo blind testing on your own
equipment, with the speaker cables being switched around and you
trying to identify whether the cable being used is your own or a
replacement of unknown origin?

Do we have anyone in Glen's area prepared to take the time to
get involved?

You must be new. Glen can only hear a difference when he can see the price tag
and isn't prepared to do the most basic testing, let alone take Pinkerton's grand.

--
Eiron

No good deed ever goes unpunished.

Andy Hewitt wrote:

You asked a question about speaker cables. In this group it's like
a red rag to a bull.
Actually, I didn't ask any questions!

My apologies - someone asked a question about speaker cables. The end
result is the same!

It used to be, a few years back. Sadly since I've come back in here
it's been taken over by a clique of high and mighty types that look
down and deride anyone who wants to discuss whether to have the
305-strand OFC cable or the thinner but better sounding pure silver
cable etc etc.
Yes, it appears that way to me too.

Sadly so.

The bottom line with audio is if you think the difference is worth the
money then rape your credit card at will. If you can't hear a difference
(or don't think the difference is worth the extra) then don't spend the
money.

For the record: Arcam DV-79/AVR-250, Chord Cobra III interconnects,
Rumour 4 speaker cable. This should give a hint as to where I stand on
the subject.
Fairy enough. Personally I use ProPower speaker cable from CPC, and some
nice thick interconnects I got off eBay.

If it sounds good enough to you then that's the main thing.

I use CPC's ProPower cable myself, the 105-strand stuff for about £23
for a 100m roll. It's actually identical to Gale XL-105 (69p/metre at
Richer Sounds) but because it's in bulk it's considerably cheaper.

Got this stuff buried in walls and running through floor space to
connect up the surround speakers, and to feed the speakers in the
ceiling in the kitchen and bathroom.

Now, here's an interesting little snippet. When I was setting up the
multiroom system I had the kitchen speakers running off a Kenwood
KA-3020SE amp fed from a Technics SL-PG590 CD player.

Just for a laugh I tried sticking an Arcam Black Box 50 between the CD
player and amp, and changing the cables from Cambridge Atlantic to Chord
Rumour III.

When I did this, on the kitchen speakers I heard...

....no difference whatsoever.

Yet when I do the same test on the bedroom system (Yamaha DSP-AX620,
Eltax Symphony 6/Centre/Millennium Mini) I can hear a clear difference
when using the Arcam DAC.

Similarly a couple of years ago before I upgraded the system, just after
I'd got the BB50 I did some tests with interconnects.

Firstly using the analogue out from the Technics player. Tested using a
freebie cable, Cambridge Atlantic, Cambridge Pearl, Cambridge Pacific
and Chord Cobra II.

Whilst there was quite a significant difference between freebie and
Atlantic, I heard no difference whatsoever between the Atlantic and any
of the supposedly better cables.

I then hooked the Technics player to the Arcam DAC using a Toslink cable
and repeated the tests using the analogue out from the DAC. This time I
could quite clearly hear an improvement.

Similarly with speaker cables, on my old Technics amp anything more than
Audio Innovations Silver wouldn't have had any audible effect. With the
Arcam amp it's worth going to something better.

When the high and mighty brigade on this group start proclaiming that
they've never heard a difference it does make one wonder as to exactly
what kit they were using to test it with.

--
Glenn Richards Tel: (01453) 845735
Squirrel Solutions http://www.squirrelsolutions.co.uk/

IT consultancy, hardware and software support, broadband installation

Glenn Richards wrote:

Andy Hewitt wrote:

You asked a question about speaker cables. In this group it's like
a red rag to a bull.
Actually, I didn't ask any questions!

My apologies - someone asked a question about speaker cables. The end
result is the same!

It's certainly difficult to unwrap this one for sure :-)

[Snipped Text]

Sadly so.

The bottom line with audio is if you think the difference is worth the
money then rape your credit card at will. If you can't hear a difference
(or don't think the difference is worth the extra) then don't spend the
money.

I think that's a very fair philosophy.

For the record: Arcam DV-79/AVR-250, Chord Cobra III interconnects,
Rumour 4 speaker cable. This should give a hint as to where I stand on
the subject.
Fairy enough. Personally I use ProPower speaker cable from CPC, and some
nice thick interconnects I got off eBay.

If it sounds good enough to you then that's the main thing.

As it that too.

[Snipped Text]

Just for a laugh I tried sticking an Arcam Black Box 50 between the CD
player and amp, and changing the cables from Cambridge Atlantic to Chord
Rumour III.

When I did this, on the kitchen speakers I heard...

...no difference whatsoever.

FWIW, I think the speakers are the biggest part of a system as far as
the sound you get goes.

Yet when I do the same test on the bedroom system (Yamaha DSP-AX620,
Eltax Symphony 6/Centre/Millennium Mini) I can hear a clear difference
when using the Arcam DAC.

Similarly a couple of years ago before I upgraded the system, just after
I'd got the BB50 I did some tests with interconnects.

Firstly using the analogue out from the Technics player. Tested using a
freebie cable, Cambridge Atlantic, Cambridge Pearl, Cambridge Pacific
and Chord Cobra II.

Whilst there was quite a significant difference between freebie and
Atlantic, I heard no difference whatsoever between the Atlantic and any
of the supposedly better cables.

I've never heard a difference at all myself. Although I do buy better
cables just for durability.

I then hooked the Technics player to the Arcam DAC using a Toslink cable
and repeated the tests using the analogue out from the DAC. This time I
could quite clearly hear an improvement.

Yes, you should there, although you might find (here we go again!) that
a standard digital co-ax might be better. As far as digital goes, it'll
either work, or not.

Similarly with speaker cables, on my old Technics amp anything more than
Audio Innovations Silver wouldn't have had any audible effect. With the
Arcam amp it's worth going to something better.

Just using something the right size will do it. However, and I'm not
being awkward here, but how much of it is 'better', or just 'different'?

I've even tried mains cable myself, and still been happy with the sound,
although there was a slight difference.

When the high and mighty brigade on this group start proclaiming that
they've never heard a difference it does make one wonder as to exactly
what kit they were using to test it with.

I've recently upgraded my kit a little. I've kept my Yamaha surround
amp, as that has plenty of oomph to drive anything, and it has a very
neutral sound. First thing was to upgrade the speakers, and I got a pair
of Castle Severns for a good price. These are fantastic sounding boxes,
and made a significant difference to my system over the old JPWs. I then
changed my turntable from an old Sony midi deck to a Technics SL1800
with Ortofon cartridge, again a massive improvement. I finally got a NAD
DVD player, and a separate NAD CD player (the DVD player doesn't do
CDR). There is also a noticeable difference between those two as well,
although they sound 'different', rather than 'better'.

There is no doubt that improving the sound of a system is better having
the money spent on the right equipment. Buy good cables by all means,
but keep it in context with your system.

--
Andy Hewitt
http://www.thehewitts.eclipse.co.uk/
http://web.mac.com/andrewhewitt1/