Andy, one other point I failed to cover is that if the high frequency
electrons do go down the wrong wire by mistake they then have to fight their
way back up the wire to get to the correct wire. This can cause serious
harshness in the sound from the speakers and can also muddy the sound
considerably. There can also be significant delays in electrons getting to
where they are supposed to go. I understand this sort of thing is the cause
of many phase problems that can arise with improperly implemented speaker
bi-wiring..

On Mon, 18 Sep 2006 00:42:09 +0100,
(Andy Hewitt) wrote:

Now who do I listen to? A few prominent UK publications, or some geezers
off the newsgroup that just insult me for regurgitating the information.

Unfortunately, you listen to the geezers. They may lack social
graces, but they're right. I don't know why the audiophile community
has such an appetite for pseudo-science and snake oil, but it is so.

And if the illiteracies were tidied up, that would pass unchallenged
in many hi-fi comics :-)

Andy Hewitt wrote:

I'm just finding it hard to comprehend the nature of the responses in
this newsgroup now. Obviously Phil is an Aussie, so I can understand
that, but otherwise I'm the only person to have written anything
without insult (until now), and in fact have at least provided a
source of my comments.

I resent the implication that I've been giving you ****! (I'm the good cop.



Now who do I listen to? A few prominent UK publications, or some
geezers off the newsgroup that just insult me for regurgitating the
information.

Your argument is predicated on an appeal to authority, and your terminology
('prominent', 'geezers') substantiates this. The fact that a few prominent
UK publications have something to say about something doesn't make it true.

If you can't tell the difference between some geezers on a newsgroup
insulting you, and a few prominent UK publications telling you stuff is good
(the same stuff that companies advertise in their mags), then you need to
establish your knowledge of the subject independently, and decide for
yourself who you think is full of crap.

The basic tenet of all this bi-wiring stuff, fancy cables and all the rest
is that it's all based on physics somewhere along the line. The problem is,
the physics it's based on is often plain false, misapplied, or of such
minimal effect as to be completely disregradable.


You may or may not be right, but right now I don't care if you are.
Just about every single reference to biwiring I could find on a
Google search suggests you're not.

Do you have any knowledge of physics or electricity?


--
Wally
www.wally.myby.co.uk
I eat my peas with honey, I've done it all my life.
It makes the peas taste funny, but it keeps them on the knife.
(Spike Milligan)

Andy Hewitt wrote:

Eeyore wrote:

Andy Hewitt wrote:

it to do with the fact that each
speaker can be moving at different speeds and directions. From this
there is a chance that the woofer can send distortion up the cable and
interfere with the tweeter frequencies

Utter drivel.

Instead of spouting what you've read from dodgy sources show some real
science to back up your claim.

Graham

http://www.whathifi.com/newsMainTemp...ewssectionID=3

" bass signals can tend to swamp the more delicate treble stuff, especially in
the return (or negative) connection back to the amp "

Utter DRIVEL !!!


http://www.home-cinema-guide.co.uk/biwire4.htm

" The advantage gained by bi-wiring is that a cleaner, less distorted signal
arrives at the speaker driver and at the amplifier when the circuit is completed
"

Yet more DRIVEL !!!

It's all 'made-up' nonsense.

Graham

Wally wrote:

Andy Hewitt wrote:

Are you talking about back EMF from one driver affecting the signal
going to the other driver? (Presumably, that from the bass driver is
of greater concern due to it being rather higher power.)

Yes, that's exactly it.

So, how does a low frequency back EMF affect a high frequency driver that
has the low frequencies filtered out?

Now you're talking dirty - lol !

Graham

Andy Hewitt wrote:

Now who do I listen to? A few prominent UK publications,

There's nothing *prominent* about any of those publications. Nor is there
anything technical about their reviewers skills afaik.


or some geezers
off the newsgroup that just insult me for regurgitating the information.

Both Phil and I are professional audio practicioners btw with considerable
education in the 'science of audio'.


Graham

APR wrote:

Andy, there has been much research

I don't think there's been any *reseach* whatever actually.


into the effects of bi-wiring of speakers
on sound reproduction, and you must understand the movement of electrons in
a conductor to fully comprehend what is going on and why these effects
influence the sound.

When you bi-wire you MUST use a thicker wire for the low frequency driver
then is used for the high frequency. The low frequency electrons are the
bigger, beefier (more muscled) electrons, that is why they are the low
frequency electrons, and they give you the more solid bass we are all
chasing.

I trust that this is some elaborate joke ?

Graham

Wally wrote:

The question is, however, can the treble be overpowered by the bass in a
wire?

Well....... It got all the way from the microphone, throught the mixing desk and
the reording / reproduction chain in one piece ok but the audiophools who
believe in in bi-wiring are concerned exclusively about the last few metres !

It's utter idiocy.

Graham

Andy, Ignore my two posts below, my attempt at humor.

What all the reply posters are suggesting is that there is no benefit from
bi-wiring. Several of these posters have undertaken extensive measurement
and also listening tests re bi-wired compared to a single run of two core
wire to speakers.

The only benefit to be seen from bi-wiring is to reduce the resistance of
the wire between amp and speakers. Two sets of wire will have lower
resistance then one set of wire. As several posters here will state, you can
do just as well by strapping two cores of wire together (parallel) to give
twice the cross section of wire and thus lower resistance. This is only
relevant if the core of the wire you are using is not of adequate cross
section for the power being fed to the speakers.

My suggewstion would be don't pay big dollars for exotic speaker cables and
prove to yourself if bi-wiring works or not.

If your amp has two sets of switchable speaker connections then connect one
speaker with one pair of cables to Speaker A connection, connect the other
speaker to Speaker B connection using bi-wiring. Use your standard length of
cable as you normally would. Put your speakers side by side and put your amp
on Mono and play some music. Switch between bi-wired and standard wiring
with your speaker selection switch. Get a mate to do the switching, you sit
10 foot back and don't look and have him switch between speakers in a manner
thar results in you not knowing which wiring is active and see if you can
tell the difference.

Get back to us here and let us know the results.