"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...

A friend of mine bought a record cleaning machine and was very
dissapointed
by the results.

Well I did wonder if these machines are really the "miracle cure" a lot
of audiophile reviews claim they are...


The problem is that any grit that has been 'stuck' in the groove and
played
may well have damaged the vinyl when the stylus hammered the grit. Hence
removing it simply exposes the damage which still produces a click.

Indeed - and I can accept that some of my LPs may be beyond practicable
salvation. But even for records that have a relatively low level of
clicks/pops (and, of course, general surface noise), I fully expect to
further "restore" the digital transcription via "WAV repair" software - and
that's perfectly fine.


I think it is the case that some shops have cleaning machines. If so, try
and find one and use it to clean one or two discs and see if this makes
much difference.

I'm not having any luck finding such shops here, unfortunately. Indeed
Loricraft have just contacted me to say they have no dealers at all in the
north :-(

--

Cheers,


Dave

I've 10,000+ LPs - but no RCM. Maybe I should have - but..~5mins to
clean each LP....??
For just 50 LPs there's An Alternative.
Ignoring the prospect that your Iso-Alcohol formulations haven't led
to permanent crackles - and assuming that the 70/80s material is 'Pop'
then you could play them WET - the LP side could be re-wetted when
transcribing tracks if the surface dried out.
Although I'd not do the above, it's a safe bet that you'll potentially
get a silent backgound - even more so if you cleaned the LP beforehand
with a water/detergent solution -"Morning Fresh" 'Wildflower
Melody' (Mauve..) is pretty OK - no citric acid, I suspect..rinse
under running lukewarm water (if you're adept you can get an
immediately dry surface using that method..).
Wet-playing is well known to have some advantages - and, for your
application, might well be the answer.

"frankwm" wrote in message
ups.com...
I've 10,000+ LPs - but no RCM. Maybe I should have - but..~5mins to
clean each LP....??
For just 50 LPs there's An Alternative.
Ignoring the prospect that your Iso-Alcohol formulations haven't led
to permanent crackles - and assuming that the 70/80s material is 'Pop'
then you could play them WET - the LP side could be re-wetted when
transcribing tracks if the surface dried out.
Although I'd not do the above, it's a safe bet that you'll potentially
get a silent backgound - even more so if you cleaned the LP beforehand
with a water/detergent solution -"Morning Fresh" 'Wildflower
Melody' (Mauve..) is pretty OK - no citric acid, I suspect..rinse
under running lukewarm water (if you're adept you can get an
immediately dry surface using that method..).
Wet-playing is well known to have some advantages - and, for your
application, might well be the answer.

Thanks for the suggestion! I've just tried that on one of the really
poor LPs (one that I'm not bothered about, I hasten to add) and it made an
amazing difference - other than the occasional crackle, the background noise
was near-absent, compared to previous attempts on it with cleaning but
allowing it to dry. I assume that I should ideally use distilled water for
wet-playing?

--

Cheers,


Dave

Dave Matthews wrote:
"frankwm" wrote in message
ups.com...
I've 10,000+ LPs - but no RCM. Maybe I should have - but..~5mins to
clean each LP....??
For just 50 LPs there's An Alternative.
Ignoring the prospect that your Iso-Alcohol formulations haven't led
to permanent crackles - and assuming that the 70/80s material is
'Pop' then you could play them WET - the LP side could be re-wetted
when transcribing tracks if the surface dried out.
Although I'd not do the above, it's a safe bet that you'll
potentially get a silent backgound - even more so if you cleaned the
LP beforehand with a water/detergent solution -"Morning Fresh"
'Wildflower Melody' (Mauve..) is pretty OK - no citric acid, I
suspect..rinse
under running lukewarm water (if you're adept you can get an
immediately dry surface using that method..).
Wet-playing is well known to have some advantages - and, for your
application, might well be the answer.

Thanks for the suggestion! I've just tried that on one of the
really poor LPs (one that I'm not bothered about, I hasten to add)
and it made an amazing difference - other than the occasional
crackle, the background noise was near-absent, compared to previous
attempts on it with cleaning but allowing it to dry. I assume that I
should ideally use distilled water for wet-playing?

Doesn't the sound alter, I would have thought it would have 'dampened' the
higher frequencies?
Perhaps if you did it with a touch of detergent and distilled (not dionised)
watee then thoughly rinsed them you'd clean them quite effectively?

jasee wrote:

Perhaps if you did it with a touch of detergent and distilled (not dionised)
watee then thoughly rinsed them you'd clean them quite effectively?

What's the difference between distilled and de-ionized water?
I thought both methods just left H2O. Anyway, it's the rinse
water that should be pure, not necessarily the cleaning solution.

--
Eiron.

"Eiron" wrote in message
...
jasee wrote:

Perhaps if you did it with a touch of detergent and distilled (not
dionised) watee then thoughly rinsed them you'd clean them quite
effectively?

What's the difference between distilled and de-ionized water?
I thought both methods just left H2O. Anyway, it's the rinse
water that should be pure, not necessarily the cleaning solution.

Distilled water doesn't contain anything else but H20 so is a better solvent
and shouldn't leave any residues at all. It's theoretically possible that
there could be non ionic impurities in deionised water: I always use
distilled for cleaning camera lenses for example..

"jasee" wrote in message
...
Doesn't the sound alter, I would have thought it would have 'dampened' the
higher frequencies?

Yes, that was certainly my perception on playing the wetted LP.

Perhaps if you did it with a touch of detergent and distilled (not
dionised) watee then thoughly rinsed them you'd clean them quite
effectively?

It's definitely worth a go!

--

Cheers,


Dave

You don't mention whether you've simply 'wet-played' - or combined
that with a detergent clean.
The fact you reduced the 'battleground effects' indicates that your
Iso-Alcohol method was leaving behind residues.
The 'crackle' may well be 'permanent' as Alcohol will damage the vinyl
- even with just one 'clean'...this is my experience (shudder)

The method following is 'mine' - & on an initially 'totally noise-free
disc' will create no deterioration whatsoever.
It relies on through-cleaning - and no 'cross-contamination' (as on
commercial RCM's) from disc-to-disc using shared 'brushes' for
solution application - or 'pads' leaving residue/contamination behind
in the non-vacuum types.

1x Plush Velvet cleaning pad (ie type seen in those feeble Carbon-
Fibre cleaners with the centre pad) - I once used the old 'Emitex'
cloth...the Milty DuoPad will also do the job - although the material
eventually comes adrift from the foam base.
Detergent - as above.
1: Damp pad and clean-off both LP sides. Rinsing pad.
2: Apply detergent to pad - small amount.
3: Holding LP with one hand against body (it's not really a good idea
to use the TT..) clean in 4-5 'sectors' half-dozen times - then, when
the foam has built up - in just 3 sectors. Rinse off pad - do other
side. You can apply quite a degree of pressure without damage.
4: Prior to detergent removal 'even up' the solution by one 'swish'
round the LP side.
5: You (preferably) need a fine stream of lukewarm water from the tap.
Hold the LP under the stream - which should 'land' on the dead-wax
area - to the RH side and you'll see the detergent being washed away -
with 1970s vinyl it quickly forms an 'edge' and rotating the LP anti-
clockwise (ensuring water/detergent is not passed onto the LP from
your Pinkies - it can be done..) carry that edge all the way back to
your start-point...then lift the LP up - moving the water stream the
LP edge - then remove.
The LP should be bone-dry You can continue the above method to
complete a second revolution - as, depending on water velocity/
detergent/rotation speed you could leave behind a slight detergent
trace - though the LP would appear dry.

Using this method there should be no need to wet-play the LP's - so
the question of 'distilled water' doesn't arise.
What wet-playing does is to put existing contaminants 'into
suspension' - hence reduced background noise.

"frankwm" wrote in message
oups.com...
You don't mention whether you've simply 'wet-played' - or combined
that with a detergent clean.
The fact you reduced the 'battleground effects' indicates that your
Iso-Alcohol method was leaving behind residues.

Well I detergent-cleaned (with a mild solution of "Flash"), rinsed and
dried it which, as I said, didn't seem to make any difference at all. So I
then wet-played it and that's when I noticed the difference. Having now left
it to dry out again for a couple of days, I can see exactly what you mean by
residues being left over. So I've wetted it again now, and it plays fine
again.

Thanks for the details of your method - I'll give it a try later this
week...


with 1970s vinyl it quickly forms an 'edge' and rotating the LP anti-

Yes, after applying Flash and rinsing I got a glue-like white substance
forming around the circumference.

Will report back soon!

--

Cheers,


Dave

In article ,
Dave Matthews wrote:

Well I detergent-cleaned (with a mild solution of "Flash"),

I'm pretty certain Flash contains a scouring powder and would be not a
good idea. Cheap washing up liquid should be a better bet.

--
*If love is blind, why is lingerie so popular?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.