"Graham." wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


wrote:

If all (properly designed) amps sound the same, how do I decide which
amp to buy?

PLEASE DO NOT MULTI-POST ! NEVER DO IT AGAIN !

YOU SHOULD CROSS-POST SUCH QUESTIONS TO RELATED GROUPS SO *EVERYONE* CAN
SEE THE THREAD AND THE ANSWERS AND YOU DON'T GET WILDLY CONTRARY ANSWERS.

You just waste everyone's time with multi-posting and it really ****es ME
off for one.

Graham

But SHOUTING and multiple posts which carry no contribution from
oneself are perfectly OK.

**** OFF.

wrote in message
...


Woody wrote:
It largely depends on the efficiency of your loudspeakers, the type
of
music to which you listen and (perhaps to a lesser extent) how loud
you
like to listen to it and the size of your listening room .


Focal JMLab Chorus 714V

Power handling 130W max
Sensitivity 91dB


Above all, if you listen to music that requires details - such as
classical or jazz,

I do

as against heavy metal or rock - then do try to at
least listen to the amp in the shop before you buy it. Although they
are
all designed to achieve the same sonic end they do sound different.

But do they?
And even if they do, the trouble with listening in shops is that the
listening room is very different from where I will be using the
amplifier.

Phileas


Put it like this, go listen to an ArCam amp followed by something like
an Marantz or Denon and you will quickly notice the difference. ArCam to
my eras are excessively bright with anything.


--
Woody

harrogate three at ntlworld dot com

Eeyore wrote:
wrote:

If all (properly designed) amps sound the same, how do I decide which
amp to buy?

PLEASE DO NOT MULTI-POST ! NEVER DO IT AGAIN !

YOU SHOULD CROSS-POST SUCH QUESTIONS TO RELATED GROUPS SO *EVERYONE*
CAN SEE THE THREAD AND THE ANSWERS AND YOU DON'T GET WILDLY CONTRARY
ANSWERS.

You just waste everyone's time with multi-posting and it really
****es ME off for one.

Graham

.... or he'll sue you.

geoff

wrote in message
...
If all (properly designed) amps sound the same, how do I decide which
amp to buy?

Is it just a case of choosing one with sufficient power output and how
do I determine this?


No, thats not true - the myth of long wire with gain.
Amplifiers can have very similar specs but have different
sonic characters and abilities.
Bandwidth and an amps ability to pump out the amperes
when fronted with an awkward load etc etc etc.
If I were you the first thing is to not pay too much attention
to the big girls blouses of this group.
Do yourself a favour, don't heed mag reviewers advice either.
Try the pre-owned market, plenty of stereo bargains to be had.
This is just one example, the Pioneer A400 was a huge success
because of it ultra wide stable bandwidth (5 - 100) and it's
impressive ability to drive any loudspeaker and remain stable -
thats the ability to churn out amperes!
It sold by the truck load and often crops up in the for sale ads,
and it is proven to be a rugged longstander, can be picked up
for less than £100. But then there are others, Nad, and even Sony
from the late 80's and early 90's.
First port of call believe it or not would be Cash Converters,
then the specialist pre-owned dealers, then the small ads.
Once you've found a model, look it up!
Don't bother with Naim or Arcam, over-priced and nothing
special.

geoff wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
wrote:

If all (properly designed) amps sound the same, how do I decide which
amp to buy?

PLEASE DO NOT MULTI-POST ! NEVER DO IT AGAIN !

YOU SHOULD CROSS-POST SUCH QUESTIONS TO RELATED GROUPS SO *EVERYONE*
CAN SEE THE THREAD AND THE ANSWERS AND YOU DON'T GET WILDLY CONTRARY
ANSWERS.

You just waste everyone's time with multi-posting and it really
****es ME off for one.

Graham

... or he'll sue you.

geoff

For ****ing me off ? Pfft. Used to that.

Phildo may be going to jail if he doesn't sharpen up though.

Graham

In article , Once only
wrote:

wrote in message
...
If all (properly designed) amps sound the same, how do I decide which
amp to buy?

Is it just a case of choosing one with sufficient power output and how
do I determine this?


No, thats not true - the myth of long wire with gain. Amplifiers can
have very similar specs but have different sonic characters and
abilities.

They can also turn out to be indistingushable when compared in a situation
where the only basis the listener has to tell one from another would be the
sound. Oddly, this seems to have happened on a number of occasions when
those involved were convinced they *would* sound different. Yet when put to
the test, they failed to show the ability to tell one from another.

So the experimental evidence points to the 'myth' often being that amps
'sound different' which actually seem to be indistinguisable in appropriate
use. The evidence seems to point to the idea that being able to read the
name-label has an effect on the 'sound' for some people. :-)

Bandwidth and an amps ability to pump out the amperes when
fronted with an awkward load etc etc etc.

Yes, such things can affect the results. As others have explained, this
also depends on choice of speakers, etc, etc, etc. :-) So the amp design
needs to be appropriate for the conditions of use.

Slainte,

Jim

--
Change 'noise' to 'jcgl' if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

In article
,
wrote:


Woody wrote:
It largely depends on the efficiency of your loudspeakers, the type of
music to which you listen and (perhaps to a lesser extent) how loud
you like to listen to it and the size of your listening room .


Focal JMLab Chorus 714V

Power handling 130W max Sensitivity 91dB

OK


Above all, if you listen to music that requires details - such as
classical or jazz,

I do

OK

You haven't said anything about the size and acoustics of your room. This
matters as the room can have a large effect on how much power you may
need. Ditto for how loud you play the music.

What amp do you use at present? Does it give obvious signs of clipping peak
levels? Does it overheat? If neither, then the present power level is
likely to be adequate.

Also, if curious about the levels you use, buy a cheap sound pressure
meter from someone like CPC or Maplin (much cheaper than a fancy amp)
and do some measurements near your speakers and your normal listening
position. Tell us the results.


as against heavy metal or rock - then do try to at least listen to the
amp in the shop before you buy it. Although they are all designed to
achieve the same sonic end they do sound different.

But do they?

See elsewhere. As you will have discovered, some people are convinced that
amps can be 'wine tasted' and generally produce audibly different sounds.
However the experimental evidence - when gathered in ways designed to make
people judge by sound, not name-label - tends show this belief to be
unfounded in general, albeit with exceptions.


And even if they do, the trouble with listening in shops is
that the listening room is very different from where I will be using the
amplifier.

Indeed. However that is a vastly harder problem when choosing speakers than
amplifiers. And you seem to have chosen your speakers, so this can't be
impossibly difficult. :-)

Slainte,

Jim

--
Change 'noise' to 'jcgl' if you wish to email me.
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Armstrong Audio http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/Armstrong/armstrong.html
Audio Misc http://www.audiomisc.co.uk/index.html

Graham,
don't waste time reading quoting and bad words from Eeyore...

Gianluca

LAB wrote:

Graham,
don't waste time reading quoting and bad words from Eeyore...

At least the thread is in both groups now.

The OP was in breach of netiquette.

Graham

Once only wrote:

wrote in message

If all (properly designed) amps sound the same, how do I decide which
amp to buy?

Is it just a case of choosing one with sufficient power output and how
do I determine this?


No, thats not true - the myth of long wire with gain.
Amplifiers can have very similar specs but have different
sonic characters and abilities.
Bandwidth and an amps ability to pump out the amperes
when fronted with an awkward load etc etc etc.
If I were you the first thing is to not pay too much attention
to the big girls blouses of this group.
Do yourself a favour, don't heed mag reviewers advice either.
Try the pre-owned market, plenty of stereo bargains to be had.
This is just one example, the Pioneer A400 was a huge success
because of it ultra wide stable bandwidth (5 - 100) and it's
impressive ability to drive any loudspeaker and remain stable -
thats the ability to churn out amperes!
It sold by the truck load and often crops up in the for sale ads,
and it is proven to be a rugged longstander, can be picked up
for less than £100. But then there are others, Nad, and even Sony
from the late 80's and early 90's.
First port of call believe it or not would be Cash Converters,
then the specialist pre-owned dealers, then the small ads.
Once you've found a model, look it up!
Don't bother with Naim or Arcam, over-priced and nothing
special.

But don't buy antiques. No matter how well they were supposed to sound. All
the electrolytic caps will need replacing and standards weren't as high then.
Modern amplifiers are much better on the whole.

cross-posted intentionally to rec.audio tech

Graham