"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 29 Jan 2010 22:10:29 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote:

I know which one sounds
best because I know what they cost

Shouldn't there be a smilie after that? :-)


No need, there was a '(see Subject Line!)' instead.

On Fri, 29 Jan 2010 22:10:29 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote:

OK, OK - one of the mics is a dinky little Neumann TLM102 which arrived
today:

http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/shown...mannTLM102.jpg


The other is my trusty Oktava MK-319.

http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/shown...ktavaMK319.jpg

Both aimed primarily to flatter vocals, I think? I'd be interested to
hear them doing that job. Got anything?

Now, rather than putting them (and the clarinet) under the microscope,
how about trying for the BEST sound you can get from each? I'd also
be fascinated to hear a two-channel recording (if I said "stereo" I'd
quite rightly be shouted down :-) using the pair of them, spaced a few
inches apart, at least a foot in front of the clarinet.

The trombone will have to wait until I retire. I'd get no pleasure
from playing it badly, and I know how much regular commitment it takes
to play it well.

Speaking of which, last summer I sat in with this lot
http://www.oompahband.com/home.html
when they were short of an accordion player for a few gigs (I did it
on keyboard. And yes, I did get to wear the blonde wig. Search for
me on Facebook if you want proof.)
The point being, their trombone player was EXCELLENT. Not, mind you,
that he was doing anything a flute couldn't ... :-)

"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 29 Jan 2010 22:10:29 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote:

OK, OK - one of the mics is a dinky little Neumann TLM102 which arrived
today:

http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/shown...mannTLM102.jpg


The other is my trusty Oktava MK-319.

http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/shown...ktavaMK319.jpg

Both aimed primarily to flatter vocals, I think?



What the 'sounds like ****' 6 kHz lift?

:-)


I'd be interested to
hear them doing that job. Got anything?


No.



Now, rather than putting them (and the clarinet) under the microscope,
how about trying for the BEST sound you can get from each? I'd also
be fascinated to hear a two-channel recording (if I said "stereo" I'd
quite rightly be shouted down :-) using the pair of them, spaced a few
inches apart, at least a foot in front of the clarinet.


All those recording were done as two channel recordings, I split them to
make it easier for people to compare - it don't work too well hearing one
mic in only one channel and then the other mic in the other channel. As they
are/were wavs, I also did them as mono instead of the more-convincing
(bigger) 'dual mono' which of course uses more webspace.



The trombone will have to wait until I retire. I'd get no pleasure
from playing it badly, and I know how much regular commitment it takes
to play it well.


Hmm...

We're talking about the UKRAinian All Stars here - sinners, beginners,
learners and sundry other low-wage earners, not the bloody Philharmonic!!



Speaking of which, last summer I sat in with this lot
http://www.oompahband.com/home.html
when they were short of an accordion player for a few gigs (I did it
on keyboard.


OK, keyboard then?


And yes, I did get to wear the blonde wig. Search for
me on Facebook if you want proof.)


Facebook?


The point being, their trombone player was EXCELLENT. Not, mind you,
that he was doing anything a flute couldn't ... :-)


:-)

"Keith G" wrote


We're talking about the UKRAinian All Stars here - sinners, beginners,
learners and sundry other low-wage earners, not the bloody Philharmonic!!


Also push a 'returners' in there where it looks best....

;-)

On Fri, 29 Jan 2010 23:22:26 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote:

We're talking about the UKRAinian All Stars here - sinners, beginners,
learners and sundry other low-wage earners, not the bloody Philharmonic!!

I play like crap often enough by mistake, without SETTING OUT to play
like crap :-)

Well, B is brighter. Maybe a bit too bright. But that's why mixing
desks and DAWs have eq. Bright can be useful, as long as the mic
responds graciously to eq when you don't want that instrument to cut
through.

It might be interesting to eq each sample until it sounded "best",
THEN compare. If anyone else wants to try, I suggest they access
them through the root web page:
http://www.moirac.adsl24.co.uk/showntell/show.html

That way it's easier to intercept and save the files before they open
in your default player! Otherwise you have to go digging around in
Temporary Internet Files, which is tedious.

You really need to do something about that key noise on the
instruments!

"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
Well, B is brighter. Maybe a bit too bright. But that's why mixing
desks and DAWs have eq. Bright can be useful, as long as the mic
responds graciously to eq when you don't want that instrument to cut
through.

It might be interesting to eq each sample until it sounded "best",
THEN compare.


Hmmm, I didn't want to get into all that just yet (if ever) - right now, I
just record the stuff! If it needs to do more than simply provide 'instant
replay/playback' for Swim Bo at this stage, then the *producer* concerned
can sort it out!! (And he knows who he is!! ;-)

(I actually tried a little reverb on the sax the other night and we both
thought it sounded worse!! :-)


You really need to do something about that key noise on the
instruments!


Next step, having made my mic selection, is to concentrate on placement and
I hope that will help with key noise (I don't like it either) - after that
it's down to the 'artiste'....!!

Now, enough about me - let's talk about *you* for a while - how's it going
with the old Trom Bone?

Had a bit of a wheeze through it yet?

:-)

Look at this:
http://www.auym23.dsl.pipex.com/show/show.html

Same bit of music on mics A and B. The only way I can explain such a
discrepancy in the volume envelopes is if the mics were MUCH too close
to the clarinet. That would explain the excessive key noise too.

Want to try again with the mics at least a couple of feet back? That
might give something more meaningful.

"Laurence Payne" wrote in message
...
Look at this:
http://www.auym23.dsl.pipex.com/show/show.html

Same bit of music on mics A and B. The only way I can explain such a
discrepancy in the volume envelopes is if the mics were MUCH too close
to the clarinet. That would explain the excessive key noise too.


I don't think they were, but ideal pacement isn't possible when you have two
mic stands trying to occupy the the same spot. I've made my choice of mics
for now and will be experimenting (in a slapdash, careless, slack-arsed,
*hobbyist* kind of way) to find the 'sweet spot' for both the clarinet and
the sax - in those recordings, one morphed into the other while I was having
a bit of a nap, earlier on!

I'm going to have to go again for the piano when we get the buzz sorted out.



Want to try again with the mics at least a couple of feet back? That
might give something more meaningful.


No, that's done and dusted now - counting an offlist 'vote' (Iain, right on
the money, as you might expect) and you as an A, I take it I've got 3 As and
1 B so far!

??

;-)

On Fri, 29 Jan 2010 23:09:33 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote:

I don't think they were, but ideal pacement isn't possible when you have two
mic stands trying to occupy the the same spot.

I found one of these
http://www.thomann.de/gb/k+m_235-50.htm
very useful. Just cheap enough to dissuade me from going down to the
shed and making something.
Then, if you have any lingering suspicion that expensive=better, work
out why this
http://www.thomann.de/gb/schoeps_ums_20.htm
costs so much more :-)

Treat yourself to a pair of these too
http://www.thomann.de/gb/the_tbone_em700_stereoset.htm

You like experimenting I think? At that price, why not? They might
suit the clarinet better than a large-diaphragm vocal mic. And even
non-purist "stereo" gives the sound such a lift.