Arny Krueger wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with the
sound of the CD format since it is sonically transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different for the sake of being
different, and gettting attention is behind most of the adamant LP
preference we see expressed around here.

One thing for sure ... I used to do a lot of headphone listening. Still do in
fact.

Headphones reveal the failings of LPs very cruelly. Listening on speakers seems
to be less unkind to them.

Graham

Serge Auckland wrote:

"Arny Krueger" wrote
"Eeyore" wrote
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with the
sound of the CD format since it is sonically transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different for the sake of
being different, and gettting attention is behind most of the adamant LP
preference we see expressed around here.

Add to that a liking for horn loudspeakers, and we have the triumvirate -
vinyl-valves-horns. Coloration rules OK?

Since you mention it, yes they do often go together.

Graham

Keith G wrote:

In the case of my son, his kit (Technics/B&W) masks any differences between
CD and LP but he prefers *playing* the LPs and is a collector of various
types of vinyl specialities (picture discs, promos &c.)...

What is there to enjoy about *playing* LPs ? It's an utter chore. I suppose all
the attendant fussing about required could be OCD !

Graham

Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

the average music CD lasts 3 days....

Anything that plays for 3 days ISN'T an audio *CD* ! An audio CD is
limited to ~ 50 mins.

To paraphrase Judge Judy: Your looks, voice and mental ability will fade
eventually, but *dumb* is for life...

A CD-ROM containing mp3 (or similar) files is not an audio CD and may not be
marketed as one.

Philips owns the rights to the *CD* trademark and requires Red Book compliance
before it can be used. That means (among other things) that a real *CD* may
only contain uncompressed audio. Philips has 'had words' with the likes of Sony
when they started marketing 'computer discs' as CDs. Basically they said "oh no
you don't".

Graham

Keith G wrote:

"Arny Krueger" wrote
"Eeyore" wrote
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with the
sound of the CD format since it is sonically transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different for the sake of
being different, and gettting attention is behind most of the adamant LP
preference we see expressed around here.

Catch a grip, Arny....

Oh come on. Some people really do like those dull orange and electric blue
glows coming from valve amps. Has nothing to do with sound quality of course.

Graham

"Keith G" wrote in message
...


In the case of my son, his kit (Technics/B&W) masks any differences
between CD and LP

Interesting comment. In my experience the difference between CD and LP is
obvious even on the most lowly of kit.

David.

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

"Eeyore" wrote
Keith G wrote:

the average music CD lasts 3 days....

Anything that plays for 3 days ISN'T an audio *CD* ! An audio CD is
limited to ~ 50 mins.

To paraphrase Judge Judy: Your looks, voice and mental ability will fade
eventually, but *dumb* is for life...

A CD-ROM containing mp3 (or similar) files is not an audio CD and may not
be
marketed as one.

Philips owns the rights to the *CD* trademark and requires Red Book
compliance
before it can be used. That means (among other things) that a real *CD*
may
only contain uncompressed audio. Philips has 'had words' with the likes of
Sony
when they started marketing 'computer discs' as CDs. Basically they said
"oh no
you don't".


It seems the anti-CD brigade is resorting to dirty tricks. A CDROM
containing mp3 files ain't an audio CD.

David.

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


I HAVE heard bad CD players such as the original Sony CDP-101. It souded
'harsh'
to me (one can speculate over what casued that) and I was convinced that
reverberation was being truncated (although that could have been the
result of
flawed mastering).

As a result I didn't buy a CD player until ~ 1989. A Denon DCD-1710 which
sounded natural. I still have it. There seems no point in upgrading since
it
works fine plus its build quality is the kind of thing one is never likely
to
see again outside of esoteric hi-fi.

I also have a decent Panasonic DVD player. I honestly can't tell it apart
from
the Denon.


There is little doubt that some first generation CD players were pretty
crap, due to a combination of poor monolithic 16-bit DACs (poor linearity
due to the difficulty of ensuring that the weight of each bit was *exactly*
half that of the one before over the full range), time errors due to using
one DAC time-shared between the two channels (which created problems if the
outputs were combined for mono reproduction) and all-analogue "brick-wall"
reconstruction filters with poor phase response.

These problems were significantly reduced in second-generation players with
over-sampling, and pretty much eliminated in modern players with "1-bit"
converters. The distortions created by modern DACs are similar in nature to
those created by analogue systems such as amplifiers, and very significantly
lower than those created by analogue disc or tape.

David.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
. ..
"Eeyore" wrote in
message
Arny Krueger wrote:

There is no chance that there is anything wrong with the
sound of the CD format since it is sonically transparent.

No help to those who actively seek colouration though.
Same as valve amps. The two ( liking valves and LPs)
seem to go hand-in-hand which strongly suggests to me
that those people like a strongly coloured sound.

I think that sentimentality, a desire to be different for the sake of
being different, and gettting attention is behind most of the adamant LP
preference we see expressed around here.

Hey, I like vintage technology too! I've got a collection of valve TV sets,
old telephones, a telephone repeater panel dating from 1924 and all sorts of
other items ("junk" as my wife calls it :-( )

And you must admit that there is something about steam railway locos that
modern electric ones just don't have. Why shouldn't the vinyl and valve-amp
brigade have their fun?

David.

"Eeyore" wrote in message
...


Keith G wrote:

In the case of my son, his kit (Technics/B&W) masks any differences
between
CD and LP but he prefers *playing* the LPs and is a collector of various
types of vinyl specialities (picture discs, promos &c.)...

What is there to enjoy about *playing* LPs ? It's an utter chore.


So's peeling vegetables - stupid really, when you could just open a can....