"Kurt Hamster" wrote in message

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 14:42:01 +0100, Ian Molton used
to say...

Kurt Hamster wrote:

If you are making the amps then yes it would be a good thing, but
if it is for the purposes of buying one then why should the
listener's bias' be ignored?

Having been the unwitting victim of my own bias once or twice, I can
answer that - it MUST be ignored.

For you it should, but why should that be the case for anyone else?


Your gun, your bullet, your foot!

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 18:36:29 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote:

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 12:08:16 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote:

I may be wrong, but I don't think it's that simple - I'm awaiting delivery
of a cheap sub (from the same outfit as the ch*nky amp :-) as I type. My
speakers go very low but I'm not happy that the amp is delivering the '.1'
stuff to them, especially as we don't use a centre speaker. I want a sub
just to pull these frequencies off (ie tell the amp there *is* a sub) -
now,
is anybody going to tell me I've got that all screwed up??

If you set the processor to 'no sub', the .1 LFE signal should be fed
to the 'large' speakers. It doesn't matter if you're using a phantom
centre.


Have you had a hard day or summat?

Nope, I simply read your statement to mean that you weren't
*convinced* that your amp was delivering the .1 signal to the fronts,
not that you were concerned about overloading the fronts.

Read the words - I bloody *know* that, ie I want to be able to tell the amp
(processor, if you prefer) that there *is* a sub to 'relieve' the front
speakers of the LFE burden. (I'm not worried about 'centre speaker' as the
sound is perfectly fine without one and the speech comes 'straight from
their mouth', IYSWIM....)

When I was using the mission sub there was a much better overall sense of
space, even when there was little or no s/w activity - it ain't all about
'tectonic bass'....

It's certainly likely that the fronts will be happier not having to
deal with high levels at frequencies below their design capacity.
--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

Stewart Pinkerton wrote:

On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 23:08:06 +1000, Tat Chan
wrote:


Stewart Pinkerton wrote:


On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 14:03:44 +1000, Tat Chan
wrote:


and the bass on your Apogees is good enough to warrant not having a
subwoofer?


The main panel resonance is at 30Hz, and they're flat to 25Hz,

well, that is lower than my 10 inch sub goes!


The radiating area of my bass panels is the equivalent of eight 12"
drivers, so you don't need a lot of throw!



Now that should produce a lot of bass.

Btw, a local hi-fi shop has a 2nd hand pair of Apogee Centaur Minors for
sale for £600.

Obviously not as much bass as your Apogees as each speaker only has a
pair of 6.5 inch drivers.

Still, I believe the Centaurs got rave reviews when they were still in
production.

On Wed, 13 Oct 2004 01:04:45 +0100, Ian Molton wrote:

Tat Chan wrote:

The Radfords are transmission line speakers, right?
Still, 12 - 15 Hz is pretty low for speakers.

No, they arent.

And they don't give audible levels at 12-15 Hz, either...........

--

Stewart Pinkerton | Music is Art - Audio is Engineering

Stewart Pinkerton wrote:

And they don't give audible levels at 12-15 Hz, either...........

Come and have a listen then... (or are you saying 15 Hz is sunsonic ?)

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 18:36:29 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote:

"Stewart Pinkerton" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 12 Oct 2004 12:08:16 +0100, "Keith G"
wrote:

I may be wrong, but I don't think it's that simple - I'm awaiting
delivery
of a cheap sub (from the same outfit as the ch*nky amp :-) as I type.
My
speakers go very low but I'm not happy that the amp is delivering the
'.1'
stuff to them, especially as we don't use a centre speaker. I want a sub
just to pull these frequencies off (ie tell the amp there *is* a sub) -
now,
is anybody going to tell me I've got that all screwed up??

If you set the processor to 'no sub', the .1 LFE signal should be fed
to the 'large' speakers. It doesn't matter if you're using a phantom
centre.


Have you had a hard day or summat?

Nope, I simply read your statement to mean that you weren't
*convinced* that your amp was delivering the .1 signal to the fronts,
not that you were concerned about overloading the fronts.


You're the one with comprehension problems, sunshine - read it again, I
think you missed the second word 'that' in the above......

"Wally" wrote in message
...
Ian Molton wrote:

Having been the unwitting victim of my own bias once or twice, I can
answer that - it MUST be ignored.
For you it should, but why should that be the case for anyone else?

Are you suggesting that the bulk of psychological research into this
is wrong? or just that you happen to differ from the *entire* human
race?

The point is that you should buy what makes you happy. If your criterion
of
happiness in the context of audio gear is something that's 'accurate',
then
that's what you should buy. If having the 'right' looks or brand is a
factor, then account for it.

I don't review gear - I tend to take a chance on something that'll give me
a
step-change improvement, and then see if I like it after a few weeks or
months. One of my criteria is that I have to be able to live with it, and
the only real way to test that is to live with it. Sooner or later, I'll
completely forget about the system and start doing my normal thing with
music. If I get the right experience, then I'm happy with the bit of kit.
I
don't care about accuracy as such - I don't actively look for it. While
it's
nice to be able to listen to a live recording and feel that you're there,
there's much more to music than that pure replication aspect.


Yep, I can live with just about all that.....

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Mike Gilmour" wrote


Just like they used to make 'em here in the days of hand assembly. Buy
all you can from China because at this quality it'll go the way of Japan
and Korea i.e. not long prices rise,

*exactly* :-)


maybe then workers afforded a better standard of living.


I'm not sure that China (generally speaking) does have a low standard of
living - they are a BRIC member, after all. It's not the same as ours, but
one which I might swap for in some/many respects!!

(Do they have pie and mash restaurants in China? ;-)


Just been looking at my Sansui Model 2000 (earlyish Japanese days) and
it came with a full workshop manual packed with schematics, component id
photographs and a complete parts list down to the last nut & washer & a
comprehensive user manual.
.....sing along 'Those were the days my friend'


Certainly/absolutely, but it won't be long before some **** comes rushing
up to tell it's not *hi*fi or summat!!

;-)


Pie & Mash......I think you're right - see
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1053349,0050.htm :-)

"Mike Gilmour" wrote



Pie & Mash......I think you're right - see
http://www.hindustantimes.com/news/181_1053349,0050.htm :-)


Streuth!

Bothers me to see things mentioning stuff like '200 million people' - starts
off a thought process about all the people in the world and I think of weird
things like 'Where does all the poop go? - How much poop can the planet
handle.....???'

Adds a new dimension to the phrase 'global warming' don't it? :-)

(Also stuff like 'everyone in the world has breathed in an atom of one of
Adolf Hitler's farts by now..... :-)


(I think I need a holiday........
............
......
...
..)

"Andy Evans" wrote in message
...
Yup, what you described wasn't perfect pitch, but being able to tell the
interval between one note and another.


Which should be trivial to a musician.

Trivial! Try humming some Stockhausen. Or even an improvised line to Giant
Steps. There's intervals and intervals, mate!

Let me quote from the original post which I responded to:
"I once asked my partner (musician) to stop me when
I had increased the sound from a Technics deck (with pitch sliders) by a
semitone by 'blind' listening alone".

So the test was to detect a rise of a semitone - a minor second. Trivial.

I've never sung Stockhausen though I have trodden in some. On the other hand
if you want proper microtonal music there's always Ligeti or Lutoslawski.

Roy.




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