Audio, hi-fi and car audio - Soundstage and depth of image

Trevor Wilson wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...

Trevor Wilson wrote:
"mb66" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hello, perhaps someone out there can help me - some years ago I
purchased a hifi setup which relative to other kit I listened to
sounded good. It was a Restek CD, Pre-amp and monoblocs, along with
some Dynaudio Craft speakers. The sound was improved with some quality
cardas golden cross leads and a Townshend seismic sink. My problem is
this, when demo-ing speaker cables a friend who worked in a hifi shop
in london let me listen to a system he had set up in the crudest manner
but it had the most incredible depth of soundstage I have ever heard.. I
played one track on it - it was the only cd I had with me by Crowded
House, track was 'Four seasons in one day' - it was amazing I could
picture each instrument so clearly - it was just so realistic. The
system used was a TEAC VRCD? CD player, an Audionote valve integrated
amp and some DALI bookshelf speakers propped up in the crudest of
fashions. I have trudged hifi shops and home demo'd kit for the last
five or so years to try and recreate that elusive sound vowing not to
spend any more money on 'tweaks' until I can find it. Question is was
that sound a fluke of the components and environment or was there a key
component in there - perhaps the speakers? Anybody got a system out
there that creates that holgraphic soundstage on the track I mention
above?
Unfortunately my friend moved on and I have never managed to get those
components together again.
Any feedback greatly appreciated....

**Apart from room acoustics (which was previously mentioned), the next
things which need to be carefully considered a

* Speaker quality. A speaker which has been designed to reduce
'diffraction
effects' (rounded corners, etc) will affect image depth.
* A valve preamp stage, due to it's microphonics, will add excessive and
artificial depth to all recordings. Listen carefully and you will
probably
find that it also has a bloated and artificial width as well.

--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

Trevor,

Keep the spin coming Trevor.Or is it just dogma?

**I deal in facts. I have used power OP amps many times, over many years.
They're cheap, convenient, easy to use and adequate performers. High end
they ain't.

The Gainclone chip amps were evolved by the former Head of Design at
Luxman.This is the man who dared to make tube amps and low negative
feedback SS amps at Luxman during the 1970s when it was very
unfashionable.[The Duo Beta series of SS amps]
His amp and preamp designs are noted for their ability to image
precisely[relatively anyway], which is something very rare in
mainstream equipment from that era.Clearly he discovered similar traits
with chip amps and this motivated him to start 47 Labs.

**The people behind 47 Labs are niave con-men. The site is full of
nonsensical terminology and outright lies.

These things are not perfect,and the component cost might be low-but
they really do put to shame even expensive and well designed SS amps
when it comes to imaging precision and depth.Especially those with high
damping factors and feedback.

**Sure they probably do, since there are quite a few badly designed
amplifiers on the market. There are also a huge number of properly designed
amps on the market. Many use the same power OP amps that Gainclones use.
Mostly, they're cheap as chips.

--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au

--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

September 1999

Everything You Know
Is Wrong
Or
I Was Fooled by
Mainstream Audio Gurus

Review by Steven R. Rochlin
Click here to e-mail reviewer

Most of us have heard this before. Class A amplifiers are the best
for music reproduction. Or how about single-ended tubes sound good
because of all that second harmonic distortion. Oh, then there is the
one about how speakers must be placed in cabinets so solid a nuclear
warhead can not destroy 'em. Wait, i got another one. All amplifiers
sound the same (said the newsgroup Borgs). Resistance is futile! Of
course the best amplifiers are those newfangled 1.21 jigawatt high
efficiency Class D digital amplifiers, right? Did i forget to mention
that with amplifiers the bigger the better?

"The more you know the less you understand"
-- Tao Te Ching

Just when i feel a good understanding about audio, something like the
47 Laboratories Gaincard comes along and destroys it. How stupid could
i have been? A reviewer in this industry must have extreme honesty with
a very open mind unhindered by the politics. Politics in this industry
which make me really sick by the way and have no bearing on being
honest to their readers. Simply having an open mind is one thing, but
being honest and willing to go against all those preconceived notions
and politics is another. It is called chutzpah!

So there i was kicking myself in the butt about going to the
Stereophile Hi-Fi '99 show in Chicago and not the great show happening
at the same time in Germany. Aahhhh, Germany. The autobahn, Porsche...
Nürburgring! In fact Hi-Fi '99 was a very casual and enjoyable show
because there were no big crowds of people to contend with. While
casually strolling through one of the lower levels i came upon a room
which used the 47 Laboratories product. The room was sparse visually as
i recall and what really got my attention were this very small product
which was putting out incredibly good sound. A gentleman showed me this
amplifier called the Model 4706 Gaincard which needed the Power Humpty
power supply (gotta love the Japanese and their unique product names).
The Gaincard was, well, this very small at 6.75" wide by 6" deep and
1.75" high that weighed only what seems to be a fraction of one pound!
Seriously!

Model 4706 Gaincard and Power Humpty

The first thing i did was laugh. i just couldn't help it. C'mon, you
probably would too after seeing all these big preamplifiers and
amplifiers at the Hi-Fi Show only to come into this room and seeing
this teeny tiny Model 4706 Gaincard and hearing it retails with the
needed "Power Humpty" for $2,750! Just hearing the words Power Humpty
still makes me laugh. My humble apologies, yet vision of Humpty Dumpty
or people dancing to the song "Humpty Dance" by the Digital Underground
fill my head. Ok, this proves my ignorance perhaps. Sad but true. So
after being amused i regained my composure and listened to the benefits
of this piece. After a few minutes i began to realize that this was
either a hoax or something really special. The pessimist in me felt it
more of a hoax, yet if 47 Laboratories was willing to send me a review
sample i would give it a fair listen. After all, people still laugh at
me when i tell them about once owning the now $90,000 Audio Note Ongaku
27 watt per channel all silver wired, ultra-purist, hand made only
during nights with a full moon by vestal virgins. This is extremist
single-ended integrated tube preamp/amplifier territory folks!

"If a man wishes to be sure of the road he treads on, he must close his
eyes and walk in the dark"
-- St. John of the Cross

Let us get one thing out in the open here, Sakura System's motto is
"Only the simplest can accommodate the most complex." My personal love
for all things Zen immediately came into action. Everyone by now knows
that single-ended tube amplifiers use very few parts and this is
considered by some as partially why really good SE tube amplifiers
sound as they do (extremely transparent and amazingly musical). Upon
learning more about the Model 4706 Gaincard i discovered that it
contained the "world's smallest number of parts - nine parts per
channel (excluding attenuators)" with also the "world's shortest signal
pass length - 32 mm (including the length of parts)" according to their
website. For those metrically challenged, this means that the entire
signal path is less that two inches long! The Model 4706 Gaincard runs
in Class AB and has negative feedback whose signal length is less than
1/2" long including the length of the resistor! Each channel is in it's
own separate aluminum chassis compartment which they claim helps to
"release vibrations smoothly". Each channel also has a 12-position
attenuator. While a single Power Humpty can run the entire unit, you
can use a second Power Humpty for true dual mono operation. Now to make
this an even harder sell to your normal everyday audiophile, if there
is such a thing, is that the total power output is 25 watts per
channel. What did you expect, 1.21 jigawatts? Enough foreplay, it is
music time baby!

Upon first listen with one Power Humpty as supplied to me it was good,
though i was not overly impressed. Maybe i was still trying to get over
the small size and weight? After a few days of break in something
mysterious happened. It was as though, as though... as though someone
brought back my beloved Audio Note Ongaku! Ok, so maybe not exactly
like the $90,000 Audio Note Ongaku, though there was so much rightness,
so much freedom, so much musical soul. How can this be explained to
those who have never heard this... The Ongaku is among the rare
treasures on earth which allow the recorded music to transcend time and
space and bring the musicians soul and intended musical message into
one's listening room. It is more than transparency, more than correct
harmonics, it is a freedom from what i call "beat" which is generally
heard only during true live acoustic musical performances. If you are a
drummer, it is the difference from playing the 4/4 beat and playing "in
the pocket". There are very, very small timing cues which while not
perfectly on the downbeat, they are playing a very small amount before
or after the exacting beat timing which gives the music a unique feel,
or soul.

Alas, i have found that only the truly rare systems and products offer
this type of rhythmically musical freedom. The Audio Note Ongaku, the
Clearaudio Insider Gold MC cartridge, and now the 47 Laboratories 4706
Gaincard can be added to this very small list. While this might seem
like making a big deal over such a small thing as timing cues, please
remember that music is really nothing more than various frequencies
occurring over time.

"As is the human body,
so is the cosmic body.
As is the human mind,
so is the cosmic mind.
As is the microcosm,
so is the macrocosm
As is the atom
so is the universe." --- The Upanishads

This added freedom also shows how much deep inner resolution the
Gaincard has. On music i have heard time and time again such as my
favorite Miles Davis vinyl box set from Analogue Productions to my
prized mint UK original pressing of Pink Floyd Dark Side of the Moon.
As rarely heard, there is a deep inner detail and a seemingly infinite
depth while the music washes over my soul. It is as though i sit here
now trying to explain a more spiritually moving experience vs. the
usual "here's another piece of equipment that does A, B and C, right
but D could be better". The 47 Laboratories 4706 Gaincard transcends
all this rubbish and goes into the rare realm that only pieces such as
the Ongaku travel.

From the very small harmonic details as each musical note decays to
fast transient attacks, the Gaincard seemed untripable with my personal
reference KEF 104/2 (modified) speakers. In fact the Gaincard even
handled the new Magnapan 3.6 speakers, with their low sensitivity,
quite well! Considering this is only 25 watts per channel, it actually
did a very admirable job to the point of making me wonder about the
advantages of using the Bryston 7B ST monoblocks that were also here
for a brief period. Of course the volume point was limited with higher
SPL listening session with the Magnapan, but this was not evident with
small jazz and mellow classical music.

"What is the sound of one hand clapping?"
-- Zen Koan

Yoshi was kind enough to supply me with a second Power Humpty for true
mono operation with one power supply per channel. It was also at this
time i read Herb Reichert's great review of this unit in Listener
Magazine Volume 5 Number 2 Sprint 1999 (Steve sez: subscribe to
Listener, one of the few great audio reads in the English language!). i
was amazed that Herb did not cover more about adding the second power
supply, though maybe he had his reasons. i can easily see how Herb can
compare the Gaincard to the Ongaku. Herb is very qualified in making
this comparison as he was previously the distributor of Audio Note gear
in the USA. i found that adding the second power supply actually took
away from the music. Sure it made the music tighter and added a bit
more dynamics, yet this seemed to come at the expense of the flow and
wonderful rhythmic ability i so enjoyed about the unit. After a few
days of experimentation using the second Power Humpty, i removed it and
never looked back. One power supply is all this, as Herb Reichert might
call me, "Bohemian or a starvin' Marvin" needs. As Sakura Systems say
"Only the simplest can accommodate the most complex" and who am i to
argue?

"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential
is invisible to the eye"
-- Antoine De Saint-Exupéry

To wrap this up, it seems we have a very unique unit here which totally
obliterates all preconceived notions. This solid-state, Class AB,
negative feedback using unit totally blew me away. There is nothing, an
i mean nothing that my ears have hear that comes close to sounding this
good for under $3,000... or even $7,000 that i know of! The next step
would probably be one of the better Wavelength Audio single-ended tube
audio masterpieces. Many of you remember how i first brought the now
seemingly legendary Lehmann Audio Black Cube into the worldwide
audience. i can only hope this review has the same affect as the 47
Laboratories 4706 Gaincard is the rarest of musical instruments. Like
finding a Stradivarius in a sea of mass produced student model violins.
Why settle for the same electrical circuit rehashed when you can own a
true handcrafted work of art like the Gaincard?

My humble apologies for giving a full blow by blow detail of the unit,
yet when your soul is moved by such a great device as the Gaincard, you
lose all your own preconceived notions of a review and just allow the
words to flow onto the page. Maybe it is better this way. Less
thinking, more feeling... more music. Could life be any better? As an
added bonus, Yoshi has graciously interviewed the main craftsmen at 47
Laboratories for us. Alas, since i speak no Japanese, i gave Yoshi my
basic questions and he flew to Japan. Please read this interview by
clicking here.

"Knock on the sky and listen to the sound"
-- Zen Saying

"All you touch and all you see
is all your life will ever be"
-- Pink Floyd

Tonality 92
Sub-bass (10 Hz - 60 Hz) 75
Mid-bass (60 Hz - 200 Hz) 85
Midrange (200 Hz - 3,000 Hz) 95
High-frequencies (3,000 Hz on up) 95
Attack 90
Decay 95
Inner Resolution 95
Soundscape width front 95
Soundscape width rear 95
Soundscape depth behind speakers 95
Soundscape extension into the room 95
Imaging 95
Fit and Finish 90
Self Noise 100
Value for the Money 95

4706 Gaincard $1,250
4700 Power Humpty $1,500 (one quantity needed, two for true monoblock
operation optional)

Sakura Systems
2 Rocky Mt. Road
Jefferson, MA 01522

Voice/Fax: 508-829-3426
Website: www.sakurasystems.com/

Manufacture Reply:

Dear Steve:

Thank you very much for a wonderful review on Gaincard amplifier. I
translated the essence of your review for Mr. Kimura and Mr. Teramura
and talked with them on the phone.

Yoshi ) Hi, guys! Did you read the review?

Kimura, Teramura ) Yes, we did!

T ) It is very good, and I think Steve is right on target when he talks
about subtle rhythmic variations created by musicians conveying heart
and soul of music. That also explains what I call "activity" pretty
well. Does he play drums or percussion himself?

Y ) I think once he told me he plays drums.

K ) Yes, many of our clients are musicians themselves. I also liked his
way of writing very much. I don't know about his other reviews 'cause
I've never read them, but it seems that he goes right into the essence
of the design at least in this case. I hope we have this type of
reviewing in Japan too.

Y ) What do you think of his comments on adding extra power supply?

K, T ) ------------(silence)

T ) Anyway, he seems to understand the music and it's reproduction
pretty
well. Why don't we ask him to be our distributor instead of Yoshi?

K ) Huh, worth consideration.

Y ) Yeah, right-----.

K ) Well, whatever waits in the future, please give our sincere thanks
to Steve and Enjoy The Music.com. We are thoroughly impressed and
thrilled by the review.

So, thank you again, Steve. We hope that you check out other 47 Lab
products too in the near future.

Yoshi Segoshi/Sakura Systems

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