On 2006-09-14, Andy Evans wrote:
Although perhaps (Brendel) was more plastered on one occasion than the
other. He plays better when plastered, and it did seem that the Liszt
gave the better stereo image, etc. :-) JLS

The music of Abbe Franz Liszt
If loszt would never be miszt.
They all stood aghaszt
As he played oh so faszt
But moszt of the time he was piszt.

When Josef Hofmann's career was in its last stage, when he'd apparently
play brilliantly before the interval then come back on stage tanked up,
a pupil of a friend of Hofmann related going to hear Hofmann play
Chopin and being amazed at his extraordinarily rapid tempo for one of
the more difficult etudes I think it was.
"Why" he asked his teacher, "does he play them so fast?"
"Because he can't play them any faster".

Yes, I too immediately thought of the Chopin études when Liszt's speed
was mentioned.

But then I thought of Ligeti's études which can be even more diabolical.

And then there's Nancarrow's studies for player piano which are
*definitely* too fast for human digits. Indeed some of them have been
described as sounding like "Wanda Landowska's harpsichord on speed."

--
John Phillips

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...


[2] Who also moved on from valves to SS in due course and despite
being a keen musician tended then to be puzzled by the ongoing
arguments about valve amps. I can't recall him ever complaining
that without valves he couldn't tell an oboe from a cor any more...



Jim. A "cor" is the name commnonly used by musicians to
denote a French horn, (the instrument first developed in France
from the "cor de chasse") and marked "cor" on most symphonic
full scores.

I don't think anyone on this planet could fail to discern
between a French horn and an oboe:-)

Iain

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 14:03:51 +0300, "Iain Churches"
wrote:

[2] Who also moved on from valves to SS in due course and despite
being a keen musician tended then to be puzzled by the ongoing
arguments about valve amps. I can't recall him ever complaining
that without valves he couldn't tell an oboe from a cor any more...



Jim. A "cor" is the name commnonly used by musicians to
denote a French horn, (the instrument first developed in France
from the "cor de chasse") and marked "cor" on most symphonic
full scores.

I don't think anyone on this planet could fail to discern
between a French horn and an oboe:-)

Whereas "tell an oboe from a cor" clearly implies a cor anglais. Don't
be silly.

"Laurence Payne" lpayne1NOSPAM@dslDOTpipexDOTcom wrote in message
...
On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 14:03:51 +0300, "Iain Churches"
wrote:

[2] Who also moved on from valves to SS in due course and despite
being a keen musician tended then to be puzzled by the ongoing
arguments about valve amps. I can't recall him ever complaining
that without valves he couldn't tell an oboe from a cor any more...



Jim. A "cor" is the name commnonly used by musicians to
denote a French horn, (the instrument first developed in France
from the "cor de chasse") and marked "cor" on most symphonic
full scores.

I don't think anyone on this planet could fail to discern
between a French horn and an oboe:-)

Whereas "tell an oboe from a cor" clearly implies a cor anglais. Don't
be silly.


Laurence.
Jim's post was brought to my attention by a French horn player in
a major symphony orchestra, a member of the music group to which
I belong. He did not think that accurately differentiating between the
two was "silly". Neither do I.

A cor Anglais is no more a cor than a saxophone is a horn:-)

regards
Iain

On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 15:30:03 +0300, "Iain Churches"
wrote:

Jim. A "cor" is the name commnonly used by musicians to
denote a French horn, (the instrument first developed in France
from the "cor de chasse") and marked "cor" on most symphonic
full scores.

I don't think anyone on this planet could fail to discern
between a French horn and an oboe:-)

Whereas "tell an oboe from a cor" clearly implies a cor anglais. Don't
be silly.


Laurence.
Jim's post was brought to my attention by a French horn player in
a major symphony orchestra, a member of the music group to which
I belong. He did not think that accurately differentiating between the
two was "silly". Neither do I.

A cor Anglais is no more a cor than a saxophone is a horn:-)

Yes dear. Now re-examine the context and stop being silly.

In article , Iain Churches
wrote:

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...


[2] Who also moved on from valves to SS in due course and despite
being a keen musician tended then to be puzzled by the ongoing
arguments about valve amps. I can't recall him ever complaining that
without valves he couldn't tell an oboe from a cor any more...


Jim. A "cor" is the name commnonly used by musicians to denote a
French horn, (the instrument first developed in France from the "cor de
chasse") and marked "cor" on most symphonic full scores.

Happy to accept what you say. That doesn't seem the usual practice in the
small collection of pocket scores I have, but I'd appreciate that full
professional scores may well be very different. Indeed, when I looked
just now in one of my old books on score reading, etc, some of the
examples show 'cor' for the horns, although others do not.

I just typed cor to be brief in what was an aside. Afraid I'd long
forgotten this practice. Probably never had any idea it was common.

I'd be surprised if anyone genuinely misunderstood my meaning, given the
context, but apologies if anyone was.

I don't think anyone on this planet could fail to discern between a
French horn and an oboe:-)

I think I'd agree. Particulary if they use full scores. :-)

Slainte,

Jim

--
Electronics http://www.st-and.ac.uk/~www_pa/Scot...o/electron.htm
Audio Misc http://www.st-and.demon.co.uk/AudioMisc/index.html
Armstrong Audio http://www.st-and.demon.co.uk/Audio/armstrong.html
Barbirolli Soc. http://www.st-and.demon.co.uk/JBSoc/JBSoc.html

Iain Churches wrote:

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...
In article , Iain Churches
wrote:

I don't read hi-fi reviews, but listen carefully to what dealers tell
me. They are not trying to sell me anything, but they do have their
finger on the pulse, and know precisely what products are in demand. The
fact that in Stockholm one can buy a Krell at -30% while there is a
longish waiting list for Conrad Johnson, speaks volumes.

You seem to keep assuming pricing and markup practices indicate quality.
Are you not aware that both makers and dealers will have varying practices
in these matters? All part of the ways they try to compete and promote
sales of their products.

Jim. It is a lot simpler than that. The Krells on offer from stock at -30%
are SS amplifiers. The CJs (at list price with a waiting period) are valve
models. Both have a 40% mark-up. I asked, "why would a dealer be
willing to forgo the larger part of his profit to move the Krells?" The
answer is that this segment of the market is becoming increasingly
dominated by valve equipment.

I am aware that what is happening locally, may not be representative
of the situation elsewhere. But despite the temptation to take home a
high end SS bargain, people are happy to wait for their valve amp:-)

Is there any evidence to sugget that this isn't anything more or less than just
a 'cult' ?

Graham

Iain Churches wrote:

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...
In article , Iain Churches
wrote:

I don't read hi-fi reviews, but listen carefully to what dealers tell
me. They are not trying to sell me anything, but they do have their
finger on the pulse, and know precisely what products are in demand. The
fact that in Stockholm one can buy a Krell at -30% while there is a
longish waiting list for Conrad Johnson, speaks volumes.

You seem to keep assuming pricing and markup practices indicate quality.
Are you not aware that both makers and dealers will have varying practices
in these matters? All part of the ways they try to compete and promote
sales of their products.

Jim. It is a lot simpler than that. The Krells on offer from stock at -30%
are SS amplifiers. The CJs (at list price with a waiting period) are valve
models. Both have a 40% mark-up. I asked, "why would a dealer be
willing to forgo the larger part of his profit to move the Krells?" The
answer is that this segment of the market is becoming increasingly
dominated by valve equipment.

I am aware that what is happening locally, may not be representative
of the situation elsewhere. But despite the temptation to take home a
high end SS bargain, people are happy to wait for their valve amp:-)

Ppl also buy Rolexes despite the fact that a Casio or Sekonda will tell you the
time just as well for 1/100 the price or less.

What rich ppl buy is no guide of real worth at all.

They just do it because they can.

Graham

"Laurence Payne" lpayne1NOSPAM@dslDOTpipexDOTcom wrote in message
...
On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 15:30:03 +0300, "Iain Churches"
wrote:

Jim. A "cor" is the name commnonly used by musicians to
denote a French horn, (the instrument first developed in France
from the "cor de chasse") and marked "cor" on most symphonic
full scores.

I don't think anyone on this planet could fail to discern
between a French horn and an oboe:-)

Whereas "tell an oboe from a cor" clearly implies a cor anglais. Don't
be silly.



Laurence.
Jim's post was brought to my attention by a French horn player in
a major symphony orchestra, a member of the music group to which
I belong. He did not think that accurately differentiating between the
two was "silly". Neither do I.

A cor Anglais is no more a cor than a saxophone is a horn:-)

Yes dear. Now re-examine the context and stop being silly.


Laurence. Lighten up a little. Did you not see the smiley
which ended both my posts? If the lines written by Jim were
from anyone else, they would have probably passed un-noticed.
But Jim is renowned for his accuracy in writing, and expects
the same from others.

One more thing. Please do not call me "dear", unless of course
you are a female in your mid 30s, tall, blonde, beautiful and
musically gifted:-)

Regards
Iain

Jim Lesurf wrote:
In article , Iain Churches
wrote:

"Jim Lesurf" wrote in message
...


[2] Who also moved on from valves to SS in due course and despite
being a keen musician tended then to be puzzled by the ongoing
arguments about valve amps. I can't recall him ever complaining that
without valves he couldn't tell an oboe from a cor any more...


Jim. A "cor" is the name commnonly used by musicians to denote a
French horn, (the instrument first developed in France from the "cor de
chasse") and marked "cor" on most symphonic full scores.

Happy to accept what you say. That doesn't seem the usual practice in the
small collection of pocket scores I have, but I'd appreciate that full
professional scores may well be very different. Indeed, when I looked
just now in one of my old books on score reading, etc, some of the
examples show 'cor' for the horns, although others do not.

I just typed cor to be brief in what was an aside. Afraid I'd long
forgotten this practice. Probably never had any idea it was common.

I'd be surprised if anyone genuinely misunderstood my meaning, given the
context, but apologies if anyone was.


James! You of all people must appreciate that accuracy is all and
context is nowt after the stern telling off* you gave me recently :-)

Rob

*watts, hours, joules per second per hour per day and so forth. A friend
(a proper scientist no less, although a polymer scientist) recently in
conversation, happened to say 'watts per hour', and I politely but
firmly corrected him. 'Pedant, you know what I mean', was what I got
back - the look on his face when I explained that one academic, and
another know-all, would actually die before understanding the meaning :-)