VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


**What would be far more sensible would be to assemble a whole
bunch of amps, within the price range, regardless of technology
and listen to them in a blind test.


Yep, say 30 or 40 amps and with a little bit of help you could have
the job knocked off in an afternoon....


**Points:

* You would not need to listen to that many.


What's a 'whole bunch' then? Dozen or so...??

**However many is necessary. The OP could, for instance, choose the
following as a representative sample:
* The two amps orginally asked about.
* Another quality push pull valve amp.
* A zero global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.
* A high Global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.

He should be able to glean most of what he needs to know by listening
to the above.




* LISTENING, rather than asking people who may or may not be
reliable, makes far more sense to us humans.
* Both amps quoted cost serious Squid. A good long listen makes
sense and any dealer who does not comply does not deserve the
business.


Couldn't agree more - I would need the 'last few' amps for months to
make a final choice. My original suggestion is still good - buy both
and flog the 'loser' on after a long trial. The speakers and how they
sound on the amps (in the listening room) would be the final decider,
in any case.....

**Dumb idea. Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars. Don't
spend a single Squid, until a good long listen can be had. Anything
else is just dumb.



You're talking to the wrong bloke, Trevor - I've got 3 valve amps in my
'spares cupboard' (4 if you want to split a pair of monos). I can't be
arsed with all that faffing about *borrowing* stuff just to make a
pressured decision and auditions on dealer's premises are worse than
useless, IMO.....

**I was providing advice to the OP, not you.



Silly me - I thought a direct reply to my post meant you were talking to
me.....

**Read the thread. You will rapidly become aware that I was making
suggestions to the OP.



Not really, not when the post starts:

"Keith G" wrote in message
... "

Or is it me - am I displaying a certain lack of imagination...??

(Do you think the OP will pick up that you are replying to him, when you
are, er, actually replying to me...??)








But then, WTF do I know?

**You buy amps, just so you can judge them?



Doesn't everybody....???

**Nope. Sane people listen BEFORE they buy.


The last two amps I bought came from China.....


Particularly sane people will
borrow the amp and listen in their own system.


Tried that. Herbert Lim said 'Solly me ole china, no can do - you gimme
dorrers and fluck off now....'


The wealthy and the
intellecually challenged may choose another course.


Like what - saying **** all that crap, just gimme the amps and I'll flog off
what I don't want to keep....??

Your suggestion is considerably more hassle and time consumptive.

Actually, I'll put it a little more bluntly - anybody with *some experience*
will have a fairly good idea what to expect from an amp, some will have the
balls to back their intuition with hard cash and will work hard enough to
dig themselves out of an unsatisfactory position, should it occur. Creeping
round Christ knows how many dealers, trying to skank a freebie loan of a
ridiculous number of amps for a *meaningfully* long enough period of time
isn't quite my style, sorry to say....





Clearly, you don't know much, or
you have money to burn. You choose.



OK, I'll take 'money to burn then'...... :-)



The one I'm using *all the time* (natural
selection) is one of the 2 Chinese 300B SETs I got for buttons - the
other one I flogged on at *exactly* the price I paid for it. The bloke
who bought it had it to play with (with no obligation whatsoever) for a
week, then bought it from me and saved himself a 6 week wait. I didn't
even have to carry it out of the house....

**And I'll say it again: Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars.


Depends...

I actually made a profit on a new car once - it was the only 'new model'
RX7 in the country at the time, got it at a bargain price from my pet
dealer (over 30 cars from him, I should think) and I was offered 4K more
than I paid for it a few months later! But I'd certainly agree that brand
new 'hifi' equipment is usually *no* investment.....

**That would be an exception rather than the rule.


I just read that again myself - make that the only new model *RED* RX7 in
the country at the time....

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


**What would be far more sensible would be to assemble a whole
bunch of amps, within the price range, regardless of technology
and listen to them in a blind test.


Yep, say 30 or 40 amps and with a little bit of help you could
have the job knocked off in an afternoon....


**Points:

* You would not need to listen to that many.


What's a 'whole bunch' then? Dozen or so...??

**However many is necessary. The OP could, for instance, choose the
following as a representative sample:
* The two amps orginally asked about.
* Another quality push pull valve amp.
* A zero global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.
* A high Global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.

He should be able to glean most of what he needs to know by listening
to the above.




* LISTENING, rather than asking people who may or may not be
reliable, makes far more sense to us humans.
* Both amps quoted cost serious Squid. A good long listen makes
sense and any dealer who does not comply does not deserve the
business.


Couldn't agree more - I would need the 'last few' amps for months to
make a final choice. My original suggestion is still good - buy both
and flog the 'loser' on after a long trial. The speakers and how
they sound on the amps (in the listening room) would be the final
decider, in any case.....

**Dumb idea. Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars. Don't
spend a single Squid, until a good long listen can be had. Anything
else is just dumb.



You're talking to the wrong bloke, Trevor - I've got 3 valve amps in
my 'spares cupboard' (4 if you want to split a pair of monos). I can't
be arsed with all that faffing about *borrowing* stuff just to make a
pressured decision and auditions on dealer's premises are worse than
useless, IMO.....

**I was providing advice to the OP, not you.



Silly me - I thought a direct reply to my post meant you were talking to
me.....

**Read the thread. You will rapidly become aware that I was making
suggestions to the OP.



Not really, not when the post starts:

"Keith G" wrote in message
... "

Or is it me - am I displaying a certain lack of imagination...??

**Nope. Just an inability to comprehend the Queen's English. Which I find a
trifle ironic, BTW. Here, I'll lay it out for you:

* OP asks about amps.
* I then explain the best way to evaluate amps, which specifically excludes
the opinions of others.
* Then, in this post, I wrote:

---
**However many is necessary. The OP could, for instance, choose the
following as a representative sample:
* The two amps orginally asked about.
* Another quality push pull valve amp.
* A zero global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.
* A high Global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.

He should be able to glean most of what he needs to know by listening to the
above.
---

Later, in the same post I wrote:

---
**Dumb idea. Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars. Don't spend a
single Squid, until a good long listen can be had. Anything else is just
dumb.
---

It is clear that my advice is directed to the OP, though I will admit I
should have written:

**Dumb idea. Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars. The OP should
not spend a
single Squid, until a good long listen can be had. Anything else is just
dumb.



(Do you think the OP will pick up that you are replying to him, when you
are, er, actually replying to me...??)

**Let's face facts: The OP thinks he will chose a hi fi product, based on
what someone he has never met will say. Moreover, he has restricted his
choice to two, expensive, outdated technology products. He seems to
disregard the many alternate choices available to him. His critical thinking
abilities appear to be severely compromised.









But then, WTF do I know?

**You buy amps, just so you can judge them?



Doesn't everybody....???

**Nope. Sane people listen BEFORE they buy.


The last two amps I bought came from China.....

**And that makes you insane, if you did not arrange a demo first. Or
wealthy.



Particularly sane people will
borrow the amp and listen in their own system.


Tried that. Herbert Lim said 'Solly me ole china, no can do - you gimme
dorrers and fluck off now....'


The wealthy and the
intellecually challenged may choose another course.


Like what - saying **** all that crap, just gimme the amps and I'll flog
off what I don't want to keep....??

Your suggestion is considerably more hassle and time consumptive.

**It also guarantees several things:

* That the least amount of money will be spent to achieve the desired
result.
* That one can still sleep nights, secure in the knowledge that one has not
passed off a POS to an unsuspecting punter.
* That one does not end up with an unreliable POS, which may be impossible
to pass on to an unsuspecting punter at any price.



Actually, I'll put it a little more bluntly - anybody with *some
experience* will have a fairly good idea what to expect from an amp, some
will have the balls to back their intuition with hard cash and will work
hard enough to dig themselves out of an unsatisfactory position, should it
occur. Creeping round Christ knows how many dealers, trying to skank a
freebie loan of a ridiculous number of amps for a *meaningfully* long
enough period of time isn't quite my style, sorry to say....

**Fair enough. Don't forget: The OP has a sizable budget. Well in excess of
the cheap crap you seem to favour. Dealers have sufficient profit margin,
when selling expensive stuff to go the extre kilometre.Or at least they
SHOULD.






Clearly, you don't know much, or
you have money to burn. You choose.



OK, I'll take 'money to burn then'...... :-)



The one I'm using *all the time* (natural
selection) is one of the 2 Chinese 300B SETs I got for buttons - the
other one I flogged on at *exactly* the price I paid for it. The bloke
who bought it had it to play with (with no obligation whatsoever) for
a week, then bought it from me and saved himself a 6 week wait. I
didn't even have to carry it out of the house....

**And I'll say it again: Hi fi products lose value faster than new
cars.


Depends...

I actually made a profit on a new car once - it was the only 'new model'
RX7 in the country at the time, got it at a bargain price from my pet
dealer (over 30 cars from him, I should think) and I was offered 4K more
than I paid for it a few months later! But I'd certainly agree that
brand new 'hifi' equipment is usually *no* investment.....

**That would be an exception rather than the rule.


I just read that again myself - make that the only new model *RED* RX7 in
the country at the time....

**Same deal here, for anyone wanting to buy a new Ferrari. However, for
EVERYTHING else, you lose between 10% and 40% as soon as you drive it off
the showroom floor.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote


**What would be far more sensible would be to assemble a whole
bunch of amps, within the price range, regardless of technology
and listen to them in a blind test.


Yep, say 30 or 40 amps and with a little bit of help you could
have the job knocked off in an afternoon....


**Points:

* You would not need to listen to that many.


What's a 'whole bunch' then? Dozen or so...??

**However many is necessary. The OP could, for instance, choose the
following as a representative sample:
* The two amps orginally asked about.
* Another quality push pull valve amp.
* A zero global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.
* A high Global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.

He should be able to glean most of what he needs to know by
listening to the above.




* LISTENING, rather than asking people who may or may not be
reliable, makes far more sense to us humans.
* Both amps quoted cost serious Squid. A good long listen makes
sense and any dealer who does not comply does not deserve the
business.


Couldn't agree more - I would need the 'last few' amps for months
to make a final choice. My original suggestion is still good - buy
both and flog the 'loser' on after a long trial. The speakers and
how they sound on the amps (in the listening room) would be the
final decider, in any case.....

**Dumb idea. Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars. Don't
spend a single Squid, until a good long listen can be had. Anything
else is just dumb.



You're talking to the wrong bloke, Trevor - I've got 3 valve amps in
my 'spares cupboard' (4 if you want to split a pair of monos). I
can't be arsed with all that faffing about *borrowing* stuff just to
make a pressured decision and auditions on dealer's premises are
worse than useless, IMO.....

**I was providing advice to the OP, not you.



Silly me - I thought a direct reply to my post meant you were talking
to me.....

**Read the thread. You will rapidly become aware that I was making
suggestions to the OP.



Not really, not when the post starts:

"Keith G" wrote in message
... "

Or is it me - am I displaying a certain lack of imagination...??

**Nope. Just an inability to comprehend the Queen's English. Which I find
a trifle ironic, BTW. Here, I'll lay it out for you:

* OP asks about amps.
* I then explain the best way to evaluate amps, which specifically
excludes the opinions of others.
* Then, in this post, I wrote:

---
**However many is necessary. The OP could, for instance, choose the
following as a representative sample:
* The two amps orginally asked about.
* Another quality push pull valve amp.
* A zero global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.
* A high Global NFB SS amp, which offers good performance figures.

He should be able to glean most of what he needs to know by listening to
the
above.
---

Later, in the same post I wrote:

---
**Dumb idea. Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars. Don't spend a
single Squid, until a good long listen can be had. Anything else is just
dumb.
---

It is clear that my advice is directed to the OP, though I will admit I
should have written:

**Dumb idea. Hi fi products lose value faster than new cars. The OP should
not spend a
single Squid, until a good long listen can be had. Anything else is just
dumb.



(Do you think the OP will pick up that you are replying to him, when you
are, er, actually replying to me...??)

**Let's face facts: The OP thinks he will chose a hi fi product, based on
what someone he has never met will say. Moreover, he has restricted his
choice to two, expensive, outdated technology products. He seems to
disregard the many alternate choices available to him. His critical
thinking abilities appear to be severely compromised.









But then, WTF do I know?

**You buy amps, just so you can judge them?



Doesn't everybody....???

**Nope. Sane people listen BEFORE they buy.


The last two amps I bought came from China.....

**And that makes you insane, if you did not arrange a demo first. Or
wealthy.



Particularly sane people will
borrow the amp and listen in their own system.


Tried that. Herbert Lim said 'Solly me ole china, no can do - you gimme
dorrers and fluck off now....'


The wealthy and the
intellecually challenged may choose another course.


Like what - saying **** all that crap, just gimme the amps and I'll flog
off what I don't want to keep....??

Your suggestion is considerably more hassle and time consumptive.

**It also guarantees several things:

* That the least amount of money will be spent to achieve the desired
result.
* That one can still sleep nights, secure in the knowledge that one has
not passed off a POS to an unsuspecting punter.
* That one does not end up with an unreliable POS, which may be impossible
to pass on to an unsuspecting punter at any price.



Actually, I'll put it a little more bluntly - anybody with *some
experience* will have a fairly good idea what to expect from an amp, some
will have the balls to back their intuition with hard cash and will work
hard enough to dig themselves out of an unsatisfactory position, should
it occur. Creeping round Christ knows how many dealers, trying to skank a
freebie loan of a ridiculous number of amps for a *meaningfully* long
enough period of time isn't quite my style, sorry to say....

**Fair enough. Don't forget: The OP has a sizable budget. Well in excess
of the cheap crap you seem to favour. Dealers have sufficient profit
margin, when selling expensive stuff to go the extre kilometre.Or at least
they SHOULD.






Clearly, you don't know much, or
you have money to burn. You choose.



OK, I'll take 'money to burn then'...... :-)



The one I'm using *all the time* (natural
selection) is one of the 2 Chinese 300B SETs I got for buttons - the
other one I flogged on at *exactly* the price I paid for it. The
bloke who bought it had it to play with (with no obligation
whatsoever) for a week, then bought it from me and saved himself a 6
week wait. I didn't even have to carry it out of the house....

**And I'll say it again: Hi fi products lose value faster than new
cars.


Depends...

I actually made a profit on a new car once - it was the only 'new
model' RX7 in the country at the time, got it at a bargain price from
my pet dealer (over 30 cars from him, I should think) and I was offered
4K more than I paid for it a few months later! But I'd certainly agree
that brand new 'hifi' equipment is usually *no* investment.....

**That would be an exception rather than the rule.


I just read that again myself - make that the only new model *RED* RX7 in
the country at the time....

**Same deal here, for anyone wanting to buy a new Ferrari. However, for
EVERYTHING else, you lose between 10% and 40% as soon as you drive it off
the showroom floor.



No idea why you repeated all that - your theories may be perfectly fine *in
principle* but AFAIAC you're living in Dreamland, when it comes to the
practicalities of valve amps in the UK....

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...



No idea why you repeated all that - your theories may be perfectly fine
*in principle* but AFAIAC you're living in Dreamland, when it comes to the
practicalities of valve amps in the UK....

**OK, I'll bite. Why? Be specific.


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au



--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote in message
...



No idea why you repeated all that - your theories may be perfectly fine
*in principle* but AFAIAC you're living in Dreamland, when it comes to
the practicalities of valve amps in the UK....

**OK, I'll bite. Why? Be specific.


You are talking about a private individual assembling a selection of amps
that most dealers would be hard put to get together at the same time! Then
this individual gets to take all these amps home (on the heads of his native
bearers, presumably) and bugger about with them for what I suspect would be
far longer than most dealers would be comfortable with, while he tries to
sort through the inevitable 'amp blindness' that would follow and make a
*meaningful* choice....??

Get real....

Much better to do what I say - narrow the selection down by any means
available (demos, reviews, recommendations or whatever) to two, if he really
must, buy 'em both and then spend *as long as he wants* finalising his
choice. TBH, I would keep them both anyway, because despite lofty remarks
made by you in the past about my 'backup methodology', valve amps can and
*do* go tits up at a moment's notice. The Copland amp mentioned elsewhere
today, that was burned out by a rogue EL34 was a *long* number of weeks
waiting for a special (Copland only) transformer to fix it...

If I wuz a dealer and someone wanted as many amps as you describe to
audition them down to the one *possible* purchase, I would tell him to ****
off. OTOH, I would allow him to spend as long as he wanted to audition them
on my premises and might let him take two home if I *knew* him or he paid
for both against a near future refund on the unwanted amp..

It's a bit different here in Blighty - let me tell you of an anecdote
regarding cars: About 20/25 years ago, someone I know told me about someone
he knew who took about 20,000 quid *cash* into the Cambridge branch of
Marshalls to buy a brand new Mercedes. They told him (politely, I suppose)
to **** off and get a banker's draft - they were not prepared to count
and/or handle the notes....

(Catch my drift....?? ;-)

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Trevor Wilson" wrote

I actually made a profit on a new car once - it was the only 'new
model' RX7 in the country at the time, got it at a bargain price from
my pet dealer (over 30 cars from him, I should think) and I was offered
4K more than I paid for it a few months later! But I'd certainly agree
that brand new 'hifi' equipment is usually *no* investment.....

**That would be an exception rather than the rule.


I just read that again myself - make that the only new model *RED* RX7 in
the country at the time....



Here ya go, Trevor me auld china - a couple of pix of said Mazda:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/mazda.JPG

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/mazda2.JPG


These were my 'weekend toys' back when I was making a *lot* more money than
I do now!!

(Ignore the *shrapnel* next door - when you have a smallholding in a
Bedfordshire village, you get rum neighbours!! ;-)

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

In article ,
Keith G wrote:
Here ya go, Trevor me auld china - a couple of pix of said Mazda:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/mazda.JPG

With your initials on the 'plate. What was it you said about satellite
dishes?

--
*To steal ideas from *one* person is plagiarism; from many, research*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Keith G" wrote in message
...

"Trevor Wilson" wrote

I actually made a profit on a new car once - it was the only 'new
model' RX7 in the country at the time, got it at a bargain price from
my pet dealer (over 30 cars from him, I should think) and I was
offered 4K more than I paid for it a few months later! But I'd
certainly agree that brand new 'hifi' equipment is usually *no*
investment.....

**That would be an exception rather than the rule.


I just read that again myself - make that the only new model *RED* RX7
in the country at the time....



Here ya go, Trevor me auld china - a couple of pix of said Mazda:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/mazda.JPG

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/mazda2.JPG


These were my 'weekend toys' back when I was making a *lot* more money
than I do now!!

(Ignore the *shrapnel* next door - when you have a smallholding in a
Bedfordshire village, you get rum neighbours!! ;-)

**Well, anyone who can afford to feed a Mazda rotary, qualifies as wealthy.
Particularly at European fuel prices. FWIW, that was my least favourite RX7.
The subsequent models were far more attractive. As was the earlier one. And
again, FWIW: When the first RX7 was released, I had to do a double take. I
searched through some old motoring mags and found that the RX7 was
stylistically very similar to the 1966 Lotus Elan. Except the Lotus went
better and was far more fuel efficient. That's progress, huh?


--
Trevor Wilson
www.rageaudio.com.au





--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Trevor Wilson" wrote in message
.. .

"Keith G" wrote


I just read that again myself - make that the only new model *RED* RX7
in the country at the time....



Here ya go, Trevor me auld china - a couple of pix of said Mazda:

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/mazda.JPG

http://www.apah69.dsl.pipex.com/show/mazda2.JPG


These were my 'weekend toys' back when I was making a *lot* more money
than I do now!!

(Ignore the *shrapnel* next door - when you have a smallholding in a
Bedfordshire village, you get rum neighbours!! ;-)

**Well, anyone who can afford to feed a Mazda rotary, qualifies as
wealthy.


I recall that my own garage bills at the time were about 400 quid a month
and I recall that the bills for 'Dandidash' (?) for the lorries (cab cleaner
spray) were 27 quid a month, but I don't remember and absolutely dread to
think what the monthly fuel bills for all the cars and lorries was!! (No
single cost centre, so no single figure for a monthly total!) I do recall
working out that to replace every tyre on all the vehicles would have cost
10,000 back then!!



Particularly at European fuel prices. FWIW, that was my least favourite
RX7. The subsequent models were far more attractive. As was the earlier
one.


OK, here's how it went - I had only just bought the earlier RX7 ('Savannah'
in the States?) when the new one turned up. I knew it was coming but wasn't
bothered. The dealer (by then quite a good friend, having bought a lot of
cars from him....) said to take it out for a spin. I did. He then said if
you want it you'll have to grab it now as it's the only red one in the
country (and was in fact due to go off and be photographed for a book) so I
said OK for a fairly painless trade. I had the earlier one for only a few
weeks and never even got a photo of it!!


And
again, FWIW: When the first RX7 was released, I had to do a double take. I
searched through some old motoring mags and found that the RX7 was
stylistically very similar to the 1966 Lotus Elan. Except the Lotus went
better and was far more fuel efficient. That's progress, huh?


The trouble with the Elan (friend of mine had one and wrecked it) is that is
was so 'girly' - as was the earlier RX7, to some extent, by comparison to
the later model. Recent Mazdas are also very 'girly' but it doesn't matter
so much now as so are the 'blokes' who drive them....

(Note also the Mercedes G-Wagen in one of the pix - trust me, I *I invented*
Chelsea tractors...!! ;-)

VALVE AMPLIFIERS
 

"Keith G" wrote


OK, here's how it went - I had only just bought the earlier RX7
('Savannah' in the States?) when the new one turned up. I knew it was
coming but wasn't bothered. The dealer (by then quite a good friend,
having bought a lot of cars from him....) said to take it out for a spin.
I did. He then said if you want it you'll have to grab it now as it's the
only red one in the country (and was in fact due to go off and be
photographed for a book) so I said OK for a fairly painless trade. I had
the earlier one for only a few weeks and never even got a photo of it!!


I suppose I should add that the *fuss* with these things was all about the
rotary engine at the time - so much so that I got ushered into the centre of
a race track one time when I had gone to watch my brother-in law-race and
everyone was crawling all over it. (???) That and a sort of rear wheel
steering (automatic toe-in for hard cornering) which turned the car into a
deathtrap when it failed once....!!

I couldn't give a toss about cars, I really have had about 150 of 'em - the
novelty of a new car doesn't last a week with me and there's any number of
the ones from the past that were traded for 'summat better' I'd have back in
a heartbeat!!

Same with valve amps (as you have noticed) - I'd sooner have a rake of
*surprisingly good* cheap shrapnel that I can relax with (and abuse) than
one, hugely expensive, *precious* (and possibly disappointing) high-end
'name'....

OK, **** it...

The reason I susggest 'Option C' in life (*both* available options A *and*
B) is that, due to my own nature at least, any choice or decision made on
summat like the two amps the OP suggested is that there is a great
likelihood that, having made the choice under some pressure, there will
always be the nagging doubt that the other option/amp would have been
better. The minute anything goes wrong (happens with *anything*) there's
that self 'told you so' to deal with as well.

*That's* why I say, if there is no obvious option, grab them both/all and
listen/watch/eat/drink/fly/drive/shag them to death until your *true*
favourite emerges. It will then go on to become your old friend which, if
you've even only half a brain, you *never* get rid of. The old-fashioned way
to scrimp and save until you got summat you couldn't really afford and
convinced yourself it was right for decades thereafter is how there's a lot
of dodgy old poop out there with silly prices still on it!

Unfortunately, for a lot of people, 'hifi' is all about not being completely
happy with what you've got, isn't it?

;-)