"Rob" wrote in message
om...


You do seem rather fixated.

Do I?, On what?

And at least a less than discerning listener?


Really? preferring low distortion makes one a "less than discerning
listener"?

Just as people who prefer smooth, quiet cars to noisy uncomfortable ones are
"less than discerning motorists" I suppose?

David.

"David Looser" wrote in message
...
"Rob" wrote in message
om...


Rob? Is that you?

I'm not seeing your posts - only this reply!

(The bloody 'new posts' numbers twinkle and disappear!)

How are you keeping?

"David Looser" wrote in message
...
"Keith G" wrote in message
...


No, you're missing the point -

No I'm not. It is clearly one of your "debating" styles to tell your
opponent that they are "missing the point" when they don't agree with you,
but I see you go on to make an entirely different point as though it was
somehow the same as the last one you made (which it isn't).


Dear oh dear...

Trust me, you were missing the point - you were talking about "The sound
that issues from a loudspeaker is not an illusion, it has an
objective physical reality." in response to my point about the *illusion of
reality* (instruments, voices, whatever) in the sound created by a system.

OK?

('Don't agree with me' you say...?? - When TF has anybody ever agreed with
me here?? :-)


Consider this also - I have and use *both* valve and SS amps; I have and
use *both* vinyl and 'digital music'. OK? And you use what...??


Are you trying to suggest that I am not perfectly familiar with those
things as well? what arrogance!


I don't do arrogance (or hubris either) - the question is clear: What do you
use? IOW, how ancient are your terms of reference?

Too many people with current opinions based on distant memories and
experiences (whether real or imagined) to take them seriously, I find....


It's because I am perfectly familiar with vinyl and all the distortions
that it generates that I know just how much worse it is than CD.


In your opinion - means nothing to me....



But *good* valve
amps are as good as good SS ones, just more expensive and less reliable.


No, lets shoot this one through the head, if nothing else - budget valve
amps are no more expensive these days than their equivalent SS amps (check
eBay), 'boutique' valves are no more expensive than 'boutique' SS and no-one
(other than good budget Jap like Sony) has any greater claim to
reliability - starting with Arcam, here in the UK....

"UnsteadyKen"

** Obviously you did not comprehend my article on the ESP site at all.

Try again - with your fat head out of your arse this time.

I asked the question because I was curious,


** Being "curious" is the least of your problems - pal.

"Keith G" wrote in message


No, you're missing the point - the job of a hifi system
is to try and convince you that 'you are there' (as *one*
here would once have had it) - ie create an illusion of
'reality'.

So far, so good.

On a really good system, the sound is to try
and recreate a realistic illusion of, say, a viola well
enough that you don't confuse it with the sound you would
expect to hear from a violin.

Straw man argument. An audio system has to be really bad to confuse a
knowlegable person that a violin is a viola and vice versa.

But please save yourself the effort and don't bang on
about 'differences' between amplifiers, especially SS
amps (of which I have and use 3 on a daily basis) - I
have never said anything *other* than they sound the
'same'! My personal hobby horses are 'vinyl vs, digital'
and 'horns' vs. 'normal speakers' - both of which are
distinctly different to my ears, as are the differences
between various phono carts....

Trying desperately to get your mind to hold steadily onto your origional
thought Keith...

By what means does adding randomly-selected noise and distortion to a
recording improve its ability to create an illusion of reality?

What concert hall comes with built-in LP tics?

"Arny Krueger" wrote


AK's own peculiar brand of Usenet claptrap snipped


What concert hall comes with built-in LP tics?


OK, another *Tip For Life* specially for Arny:

If all you hear are 'tics' when you play a record then you had better give
up and settle for the best you can get off a CD....

And then a question for all:

Has anyone ever been to concert hall that was anything like *silent*
throughout the performance (coughing tsunami at the end of every movement
not included) or even heard a concert on the radio without that silly bitch
(it's the same one every time) coughing *without restraint* at the midpoint
of the most important General Pause in the whole piece, every single
time...??

In article , Keith G
scribeth thus

"Arny Krueger" wrote


AK's own peculiar brand of Usenet claptrap snipped


What concert hall comes with built-in LP tics?


OK, another *Tip For Life* specially for Arny:

If all you hear are 'tics' when you play a record then you had better give
up and settle for the best you can get off a CD....

And then a question for all:

Has anyone ever been to concert hall that was anything like *silent*
throughout the performance (coughing tsunami at the end of every movement
not included)

Yeabut thats part of the live experience

And seeing that concert goer's are getting older its likely to get
worse;(..


or even heard a concert on the radio without that silly bitch
(it's the same one every time) coughing *without restraint* at the midpoint
of the most important General Pause in the whole piece, every single
time...??


Don't they have cough keys on modern desks?...


--
Tony Sayer

"Keith G" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote


AK's own peculiar brand of Usenet claptrap snipped


What concert hall comes with built-in LP tics?

OK, another *Tip For Life* specially for Arny:

If all you hear are 'tics'

Never said that, Keith.

Here's a tip for life Keith:

If you want to seem to be honest and sincere, try not putting words in other
people's mouth and then putting them down for saying them.

You're just making yourself look both dishonest and foolish.

I'll bet this trick works well in the pubs that you are often found in,
though.

"Keith G" wrote in message
...


Dear oh dear...

Trust me, you were missing the point - you were talking about "The sound
that issues from a loudspeaker is not an illusion, it has an
objective physical reality." in response to my point about the *illusion
of reality* (instruments, voices, whatever) in the sound created by a
system.

So why didn't you say that before, if that was your point? It is, if I may
say so, a particularly pointless point.

OK?


Consider this also - I have and use *both* valve and SS amps; I have and
use *both* vinyl and 'digital music'. OK? And you use what...??


Are you trying to suggest that I am not perfectly familiar with those
things as well? what arrogance!


I don't do arrogance (or hubris either)

No? then someone else writes your posts for you.

- the question is clear: What do
you use?

Use for what?

IOW, how ancient are your terms of reference?

Very recent thanks. (days rather than weeks)

Too many people with current opinions based on distant memories and
experiences (whether real or imagined) to take them seriously, I find....

Ah, the old "if other people had as much knowledge/experience of the subject
as I have they would agree with me" conceit.


It's because I am perfectly familiar with vinyl and all the distortions
that it generates that I know just how much worse it is than CD.


In your opinion

No only my opinion of course, and it is unarguable that CD produces
negligible distortion compared to vinyl, so unless you are arguing that
distortion is a *good* thing?

means nothing to me....

Clearly it does, otherwise you wouldn't keep responding to me

But *good* valve
amps are as good as good SS ones, just more expensive and less reliable.


No, lets shoot this one through the head, if nothing else - budget valve
amps are no more expensive these days than their equivalent SS amps (check
eBay), 'boutique' valves are no more expensive than 'boutique' SS and
no-one (other than good budget Jap like Sony) has any greater claim to
reliability - starting with Arcam, here in the UK....

Clearly the word "budget" means something different to you than it does to
me. There are no valve amps that fit in the "budget" category as I would
recognise the term. But it seems improbable that valve amps can be sold at a
similar price to SS ones, valve amps include inherently expensive components
(output transformers, larger mains transformers, high-voltage capacitors
etc.), furthermore they require a more labour-intensive manufacture. Yes I
know that Chinese labour is relatively cheap, but all the same.

As for claiming similar reliability, words fail me! My Quad 405 has been
sitting in the corner of my sitting-room for 25 years running the sound
system in that room. In that time it has been powered up for about 100,000
hours, yet has never required any maintenance whatsoever. This is the sort
of reliability that is normal from SS equipment, but has never been on offer
from valve equipment.

David.

"Arny Krueger" wrote in message
...
"Keith G" wrote in message

"Arny Krueger" wrote


AK's own peculiar brand of Usenet claptrap snipped


What concert hall comes with built-in LP tics?

OK, another *Tip For Life* specially for Arny:

If all you hear are 'tics'

Never said that, Keith.

Here's a tip for life Keith:

If you want to seem to be honest and sincere, try not putting words in
other people's mouth and then putting them down for saying them.

You're just making yourself look both dishonest and foolish.

I'll bet this trick works well in the pubs that you are often found in,
though.


If you want to seem to be honest and sincere, try not printing blatant lies
about them - you're just making yourself look both dishonest and foolish.

I don't drink more than a couple of beers a *year* and I think it's been 10
years or more since I was in a pub for a meal - not that I expect the truth
or *accuracy* of any kind to be of any interest to you....