What's your view of speaker crossovers?
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Keith G wrote:
(Hint: I have never yet *sold* a pair of speakers! ;-)

Set the reserve lower then. Even firewood has a value.

--
*If at first you don't succeed, then skydiving definitely isn't for you *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.



"Please realise that posts on here aren't just to you personally. They are
a contribution to a general debate. As I've said before, it isn't your
personal group - much as you wish it was or try and make it."


????

What's your view of speaker crossovers?
 

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Keith G wrote:
Many of the very best commercial designs use carefully chosen and
controlled materials for the cabinets. The principle behind this is
you can't eliminate all resonances so incorporate them as part of the
design. The Spendor BC1 being a prime example - and it's by no means
the only one. The home maker simply hasn't the facilities for such
choices - even MDF varies from one maker to another.


Hmm...

I thought you were too busy to reply to my crap....??

You need to try reading what is said rather than assuming. I was too busy
to do more than skim through your tracts. They tend to be very long...

Anyway, do stop trying to make yourself look good by telling me stuff I
(and most everyone else here) already know - I'm well aware of the
different approaches to cabinet resonances adopted by different makers
and have even had a pair of 'thinwall' Rogers BBC Studio Monitors here,
myself. I've told you before (only recently) - there's nothing you know
that I either don't know already or need to know, OK?

Please realise that posts on here aren't just to you personally. They are
a contribution to a general debate. As I've said before, it isn't your
personal group - much as you wish it was or try and make it.



No, you lost me - is this post replying to me personally or are you just
braying to the group again....??

(I don't think you have the slightest clue what you are doing, do you? :-)




As to consistency of components and materials used in speaker
manufacturer - tell me you *wouldn't* prefer a pair of speakers with
consecutive serial numbers....??

You clearly haven't seen decent speakers being made.

(But then, I don't even need to know that....!! :-)

--
*Yes, I am an agent of Satan, but my duties are largely ceremonial

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

What's your view of speaker crossovers?
 

"Don Pearce" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 13:08:20 -0000, "Keith G"
wrote:

Ah, so you have adopted the Taguchi method, whereby you change many
variables at once rather than just one at a time. It is a kind of
evolutionary system, but you have to be really ruthless in kicking out
the crap. :-)



Sure, but the 'freedom' exists in there being no constraints of
expectation,
so they can be kicked out without too much stress if necessary.

Your advice to the poster Sharad (way above) is perfectly correct, but the
alternative would work just as well: Buy a pair of stunning-looking
speakers
that you really can *not* afford (divorce-inducing) with a truly 'world
class' name (Bosendorfer, Sonus Faber, Wilson &c.) and learn to ignore
their
shortcomings - just like you would with a pair of cardboard Wharfedales,
if
you had more sense than money....!!


Well I have my Sonus Fabers (Amator), and I listen to them with no
sense of any shortcomings I have to ignore. They are by now
seamlessly integrated with the sub, so all I have to do is switch on
and start listening.

It's like with cars, throughout my life, I have preferred to buy an
enormous
number of totally different cars (more out of curiosity than anything
else)
than try and work through 'improved' variants of the same make/model..!!
(With a V12 Jag at the 'top' of the list, I guess, all I would say is the
'best' cars have not been the *best* cars*..!! ;-)


I've had my share too - I used to go rallying in mki Escorts (RS1600
era) and I've been through the usual suspects since. But I'm happiest
with my current car which I've owned longer than any other - Audi S4
Avant (the Avant bit is the key).



I owned an Audi for a while but never drove it!!



Most successful make of car in my life..? - Suzuki, without a doubt, but I
wouldn't want one now.....

(Swim, OTOH, had had the same car for at least 15 years and won't be
parted
from it!)



Like an old pair of slippers!


No idea why she's so attached to it, even she says my old bus is a better
drive and damn near as fast!! (Citroen Xantia - 2lt petrol version,
seriously nippy and smooth as silk!!)

What's your view of speaker crossovers?
 

"Serge Auckland" wrote


Funny how that happens. By the way, with your considerable woodworking
skills, I thought you might like to have a go at a pair of transmission
line 'speakers. They'll need a bit more welly than your horns, but you
should find the bass smoother and treble less "crunchy"


Streuth! I've just noticed an old HFW lying *open* next to my monitor - at
an article on building a pair of Ariel 6 TLs!!

What's your view of speaker crossovers?
 

Don Pearce wrote:

On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 19:13:11 +0000, Eeyore
wrote:

If your drivers are up to the task, just use a first order crossover ( 6dB /
octave).

By its very nature it can't screw up. It will always give constant power and
pressure and eliminate any phase 'nasties'.

No, a singe order crossover can't be linear phase - you need at least
second order to achieve that.

Nonsense.

The vector sum of a first order crossover is flat in both amplitude and phase.

Graham

What's your view of speaker crossovers?
 

On Sun, 03 Dec 2006 12:42:16 +0000, Eeyore
wrote:



Don Pearce wrote:

On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 19:13:11 +0000, Eeyore
wrote:

If your drivers are up to the task, just use a first order crossover ( 6dB /
octave).

By its very nature it can't screw up. It will always give constant power and
pressure and eliminate any phase 'nasties'.

No, a singe order crossover can't be linear phase - you need at least
second order to achieve that.

Nonsense.

The vector sum of a first order crossover is flat in both amplitude and phase.

Graham

Show me the maths. And then explain, if it is flat in amplitude, how
does it work as a crossover? Then you can go on to explain what is
happening to the phase around crossover as opposed to the passband. Do
it in terms of group delay please - that is an easier visualization
for linear phase systems.

I will do the same - lets see who blinks first, shall we?

d

--
Pearce Consulting
http://www.pearce.uk.com

What's your view of speaker crossovers?
 

Don Pearce wrote:

Eeyore wrote:
Don Pearce wrote:
Eeyore wrote:

If your drivers are up to the task, just use a first order crossover ( 6dB /
octave).

By its very nature it can't screw up. It will always give constant power and
pressure and eliminate any phase 'nasties'.

No, a singe order crossover can't be linear phase - you need at least
second order to achieve that.

Nonsense.

The vector sum of a first order crossover is flat in both amplitude and phase.

Graham

Show me the maths. And then explain, if it is flat in amplitude, how
does it work as a crossover? Then you can go on to explain what is
happening to the phase around crossover as opposed to the passband. Do
it in terms of group delay please - that is an easier visualization
for linear phase systems.

I will do the same - lets see who blinks first, shall we?

Here's something simple I can type here and now.

In the passband both filters have no phase shift and the 'gain' is 1.

At the crossover point the voltage gain of each section is 0.7071 at a phase angle
of +-45 degrees.

Take the vectors and sum and you're back to a voltage gain of 1 and no phase shift.

The power at crossover is -3dB ( half power ), add those and it's 0dB again.

If the drivers have the bandwidth it's a great scheme.

Graham